2 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:

I think most outsiders see a team that has the highest payroll in team history and in the top 25% of the league. They also see a  roster that heading into the offseason was easily top 5 in the game.  They see a team with the best pen in the game, and a top 5 rotation and lineup.  They see an opening in RF, but a former top prospect in the game that the Sox have penciled in, as well as a couple other interesting guys in Sheets and Engel to fill the gap, with another former top prospect just added to the mix. They see a 2B opening that needed to be filled with a vet, and it was.  

We all just had higher hopes.  And rightfully so.  But I am not surprised outside publications aren't as harsh on the Sox offseason as we all are. The Sox are still really, really good and are a better team than last year IF the key players stay healthy.  

Perfect post.

16 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

But we’re talking about the quality of the offseason, not the quality of the team itself.  No one is disputing the latter.  The problem is when your GM spends $46M on free agents / Craig Kimbrel and barely moves the needle in terms of improvement.  If outside “experts” want to ignore that point, then their grades are fairly meaningless IMO.

You can also massively fuck up a team in the offseason.

Example: This year's Lakers

37 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

But we’re talking about the quality of the offseason, not the quality of the team itself.  No one is disputing the latter.  The problem is when your GM spends $46M on free agents / Craig Kimbrel and barely moves the needle in terms of improvement.  If outside “experts” want to ignore that point, then their grades are fairly meaningless IMO.

I don't really support the way the money was spent this offseason.  But I don't think think the team "barely" improved.  This bullpen goes from one of the best in the game to very average if not worse if you remove Kimbrel, Graveman and Kelly.  And that was $32M of the $46M spent. Every contending team signs guys like Harrison and Leury and frankly I am unconcerned about them.  The lack of an impact move fucking sucks.  You know I wanted Conforto every bit as much as you did.  The offseason was a terrible failure as it sits today.  But most outsiders just didn't think this team had much more to do, and the grades reflect that. Just answering the question that was posed. And yes, I would agree that "offseason grades" are meaningless in every sense of the word. 

48 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said:

But we’re talking about the quality of the offseason, not the quality of the team itself.  No one is disputing the latter.  The problem is when your GM spends $46M on free agents / Craig Kimbrel and barely moves the needle in terms of improvement.  If outside “experts” want to ignore that point, then their grades are fairly meaningless IMO.

The real perfect post.

Even The Athletic didn't mention the curious cases of Rodon and Kimbrel . Nor did they say anything about the giant hole left from losing your nearly 5 WAR pitcher. Also there is the context that the Sox were bumslayers where even the loses of Eloy and Robert really didn't matter during the season, their woeful road record , their middling 2nd half of the season , the loss of Rodon and the reflection of all that in the playoffs. Throw all that together with they are supposed to be World Series contenders who aren't any better than they were last year when they were really pretenders.

Edited March 30, 20224 yr by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

Baffling people are voting B and C... Almost baffled by those who went D.. This is clearly an F.  

1 hour ago, Quin said:

You can also massively fuck up a team in the offseason.

Example: This year's Lakers 

Yep...although it is hard to positively "grade" paths that aren't taken but this post is spot on! 

52 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:

Baffling people are voting B and C... Almost baffled by those who went D.. This is clearly an F.  

I voted D, and now feel I was being too kind, lol.

I think the Bs and Cs are assumptions we have to do something at some point about starting pitching and Kimbrel…kind of like awarding a Nobel Prize for something that could theoretically happen in the future but is not guaranteed to actually transpire.  D- should have been an option, although that connotes actually trying…whereas the grade would have been higher simply doing nothing but a QO for Rodon and declining the Kimbrel option and say signing Escobar or even Miller.

Edited March 30, 20224 yr by caulfield12

1 hour ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:

Baffling people are voting B and C... Almost baffled by those who went D.. This is clearly an F.  

Grab a starter to take up the slack from Kopech and Keuchel, and it raises above an F for me.  They are still a really good team, but this offseason the FO failed to make it significantly better, and that matters.

A+++++

I will now change my grade from an EASY F, to a D+/C-.  Did not address 2B, SP, backup catcher or left handed hitting.

On 3/30/2022 at 10:14 AM, ptatc said:

I voted C.

They focused on pitching like they should have. However, I'm not sure they acquired the correct ones.

I'll go from a C to a B. Filled RF with a player who will play 120 games.

Still would have preferred to trade him for SP.

6 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:

I will now change my grade from an EASY F, to a D+/C-.  Did not address 2B, SP, backup catcher or left handed hitting.

Kimbrel for Pollock raises to at least a D- for me.  Hahn still has a week or so to bump that up with another starter.

C+

24 minutes ago, ptatc said:

I'll go from a C to a B. Filled RF with a player who will play 120 games.

Still would have preferred to trade him for SP.

Pollock hasn't played in > 120 games since 2015. Taking out the short 2020 season, he's only averaged 107 games played/season over the past 5 seasons.

Right now, it's a C for me.

If they get Manaea without giving up a ton, easily a B.

C+/C

The one unassailable point is that we keep getting older and more Injury-prone with every passing day.

If 2B is now a platoon with Leury and Harrison, it would have been better to just spend the money on Escobar.

One can argue Leury can cover all the infield positions, especially SS...but TLR loves his veterans.

And still not seeing anything resembling a long-term vision for after 2023/24.  That said, let's just win a damn playoff series first.

 

As everyone says, final grade depends on if Manaea or Montas goes to an AL Central opponent because of our system's lack of depth and the fear of giving up Vaughn, Sheets and Burger.

Also the LHR solution.

Edited April 1, 20224 yr by caulfield12

Just now, caulfield12 said:

C+

The one unassailable point is that we keep getting older and more Injury-prone with every passing day.

If 2B is now a platoon with Leury and Harrison, it would have been better to just spend the money on Escobar.

One can argue Leury can cover all the infield positions, especially SS...bit TLR loves his veterans.

And still not seeing anything resembling a long-term vision for after 2023/24.  That said, let's just win a damn playoff series first.

All mangers love veterans. 

So everyone complains about winning this year. They make a move for this year and the complaints start about not looking to the future.

1 minute ago, ptatc said:

All mangers love veterans. 

So everyone complains about winning this year. They make a move for this year and the complaints start about not looking to the future.

Even TLR noted that though...see the very bottom of his quotes yesterday.  

The major question is how prohibitive the cost for current pitching, versus how it will eventually impact 2024-2026.   Opportunity cost.

I’m waiting until Opening Day to make a call. 

4 minutes ago, Tony said:

I’m waiting until Opening Day to make a call. 

I should have. Need to change D to a C, which could obviously change if they were to acquire a starter.

Goes from a D to C for me.  Still a shitty offseason and still didn't solve a lot of team weaknesses, but Sox are better now than they were a couple days ago and RF is no longer a black hole. 

Very pleased by today but stand by everything I wrote.

23 minutes ago, Tony said:

I’m waiting until Opening Day to make a call. 

It's been an F for me until today, but more moves by OD could significantly alter my opinion. 

11 minutes ago, bmags said:

Very pleased by today but stand by everything I wrote.

Same

I would just like to post my comment again here from a thread that is now closed...

Quote

My biggest gripe with the offseason complaints on this board (not just you) is the timing of them. People seem to talk in absolutes ("we didn't sign a RF", etc.) as if the offseason is over. 

Why weren't those same complaints being posted in November?  Well, the answer is obvious...we still had a full offseason to make the moves. So when exactly is the breaking point?  For me, it's April 8.  I won't complain about the lack of moves until I see our opening day roster. But what is the breaking point for others?  Is it a certain date?  Is it when we've spent money on smaller free agents?  Is it when our supposed top targets have signed with other teams?

There were several people here complaining about the lack of a RF and the inability to unload Kimbrel. Both were accomplished today, and we still have a week until opening day. 

Edited April 1, 20224 yr by SoxBlanco