Given how flexible he has been this year with moderate MLB success - 1.18 Whip, good fastball spin and chase rate...does he have a future as a 5th starter next year, or just a taxi guy? Sox probably will need to replace Cueto and I think Gio is on the block, so interested to see what people here think. 

Watch he will have 2 more good outings, we sign him to a long term expensive contract and like magic he will tank. Its the White Sox way

It can’t hurt to have him as a number 5 or depth piece, but he should not replace Cueto or be the next arm they need for the rotation.

I have no issue with Martin being part of the mix next year he’s earned that chance. But right now the Sox have 4 starters under contract other than him, and 3 have had issues this year - Cease (yay), Lynn (injury and long recovery), Kopech (injuries and arm buildup), and Giolito (injury, COVID, and sucking). 

As is, that’s a spotty rotation with zero depth behind it. High ceiling, but someone gets injured and it’s a catastrophe. And be honest, someone from That group will miss a couple months or will struggle for a couple months.

At the very least they need to know who the 6th starter is, as without a lockout it’s darn unlikely you’ll find a quality pitcher left at the end of training camp, and that 6th starter should be good enough that if he gets 25 starts you’re not screaming to cut him. It would also be nice to know who the 7th starter is as it a very likely that person will be needed several times. Unfortunately, I see no way to answer those questions without a free agency or trade move, and this org is very limited in the resources available for that.

He has been a great depth piece, quite a surprise. You say his spin rates are good? 

:opens can of worms. Closes can of worms:

Edited September 18, 20223 yr by Chick Mercedes

I think Martin as the 6th starter is a reasonable plan for a contender.

5 minutes ago, JoeC said:

I think Martin as the 6th starter is a reasonable plan for a contender.

Yeah but what about for the Sox?

3 hours ago, The Beast said:

It can’t hurt to have him as a number 5 or depth piece, but he should not replace Cueto or be the next arm they need for the rotation.

Why not? He’s earned it imo. I have no problem going into next season with Cease/Lynn/Kopech/Giolito/Martin. You can always add one or two cheap depth pieces like they did with Cueto and Velazquez this season. Guys like Quintana, Wacha, and Gibson suit the bill for cheap veteran depth.

Sox should just sign Rodon and re-sign Cueto. Tender Gio and trade him.

Cease

Rodon

Lynn

Kopech

Cueto

Martin

Edit: I know this won't happen but should.

Edited September 18, 20223 yr by KrankinSox

No. Sign a vet 5th starter and leave Martin as the 6th SP. He’ll still get 15-20 starts, but don’t rely on it. 

Went to MLB Trade Values to see their valuation of Pablo Lopez, one of the pitchers I wanted the Sox to target for Eloy, and came across this trade that 99% of Soxtalk would Go Apeshit if Hahn did this. I don't think Hahn would make it out of Comiskey alive, and no jury would convicted the mob.

Mets Trade: 2B J McNeil ($21.1), SP Tylor Megill ($11.1), SP David Peterson ($6.1), SP Jose Butto ($2.2) and C James McCann (minus $17.2M)

White Sox Trade: SP Michael Kopech ($17.8) SP Lucas Giolito ($12.6), RP Tanner Banks ($2.2M), C Yasmani Grandal (minus $10.2M).

I’m curious about Jimmy Lambert…any chance he can be stretched back into a starter? His stuff looks legit this year out of the pen. Of course it’s easier to look good in small doses than starting, 

Davis Martin would be excellent for a 5.
It  could be Martin for #4 and Vinny V for #5.......

4 hours ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Why not? He’s earned it imo. I have no problem going into next season with Cease/Lynn/Kopech/Giolito/Martin. You can always add one or two cheap depth pieces like they did with Cueto and Velazquez this season. Guys like Quintana, Wacha, and Gibson suit the bill for cheap veteran depth.

Wacha is nearly a 4 WAR pitcher this year and Quintana is a 3 WAR pitcher. I have to figure they’re at least making $10 million next year. You might even legitimately talk about those guys getting qualifying offers.

Gibson is a 1.5 WAR pitcher with an ERA of 4.5. Big range in price for Guys like that can run from Cueto to $8 million for Kluber.

3 hours ago, ChiSox59 said:

No. Sign a vet 5th starter and leave Martin as the 6th SP. He’ll still get 15-20 starts, but don’t rely on it. 

This. Need to have a guy with options who can start the year at AAA and come up when you inevitably land a starter on the IL. Make Martin your 5th starter and then who comes up when someone gets injured?

3 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Went to MLB Trade Values to see their valuation of Pablo Lopez, one of the pitchers I wanted the Sox to target for Eloy, and came across this trade that 99% of Soxtalk would Go Apeshit if Hahn did this. I don't think Hahn would make it out of Comiskey alive, and no jury would convicted the mob.

Mets Trade: 2B J McNeil ($21.1), SP Tylor Megill ($11.1), SP David Peterson ($6.1), SP Jose Butto ($2.2) and C James McCann (minus $17.2M)

White Sox Trade: SP Michael Kopech ($17.8) SP Lucas Giolito ($12.6), RP Tanner Banks ($2.2M), C Yasmani Grandal (minus $10.2M).

I would go for that trade 

6 hours ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

Why not? He’s earned it imo. I have no problem going into next season with Cease/Lynn/Kopech/Giolito/Martin. You can always add one or two cheap depth pieces like they did with Cueto and Velazquez this season. Guys like Quintana, Wacha, and Gibson suit the bill for cheap veteran depth.

They need a better pitcher than Giolito and they need more depth. If they want to be an actual contender and not just get lucky with someone like Cueto, they would spend some money and get an established quality pitcher (someone who isn’t the caliber of Dallas Keuchel).

1 hour ago, fathom said:

I would go for that trade 

It is very interesting when you dive into it. I just think most fans would hate it.

Grandal vs. McCann is nearly a wash salary (2 years vs. 1) and health wise.  McCann would be an upgrade in terms of game prep and defense over Grandal, regardless if either bat improves.

I don’t know enough about McGill or Peterson, but like that both are young and may have potential.

Still hate to give up on Kopech. If he is healthy, he is the best player in this deal in terms of years under control. Which McNeil are you getting (5 WAR or 1-2 WAR) and are the Sox doing other smart moves to truly compete the next two years are the two big open questions / deal makers/breakers.

1 hour ago, The Beast said:

They need a better pitcher than Giolito and they need more depth. If they want to be an actual contender and not just get lucky with someone like Cueto, they would spend some money and get an established quality pitcher (someone who isn’t the caliber of Dallas Keuchel).

I think they’re going to trade Giolito personally and either acquire a SP via trade or sign someone like Quintana for that #4 spot.

3 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

Wacha is nearly a 4 WAR pitcher this year and Quintana is a 3 WAR pitcher. I have to figure they’re at least making $10 million next year. You might even legitimately talk about those guys getting qualifying offers.

Gibson is a 1.5 WAR pitcher with an ERA of 4.5. Big range in price for Guys like that can run from Cueto to $8 million for Kluber.

Quintana/Wacha are Giolito replacements if they trade him. Someone like Gibson is back end #5/#6 depth piece.

6 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

I think they’re going to trade Giolito personally and either acquire a SP via trade or sign someone like Quintana for that #4 spot.

I still think they need to acquire an actual successful starting pitcher through free agency or a trade. Decide if they really need Sheets and see if he can bring that starting pitcher back. I doubt they bring an ex-White Sox player back, that doesn’t happen all that often.

If you can trade grandal for a bucket of balls you consider that a win. The balls are more valuable right now.

26 minutes ago, The Beast said:

I still think they need to acquire an actual successful starting pitcher through free agency or a trade. Decide if they really need Sheets and see if he can bring that starting pitcher back. I doubt they bring an ex-White Sox player back, that doesn’t happen all that often.

Gavin Sheets might bring you a 5th starter type back. Nothing that makes the white Sox better.

If you want someone better than that, you will have to trade someone worth value. I do keep eyeing Milwaukee as both Woodruff and Burnes have 2 years of control left, Vaughn with 4 years of control could be a key piece in a deal for one of them.

43 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

Gavin Sheets might bring you a 5th starter type back. Nothing that makes the white Sox better.

I would take that in a heartbeat, a 5th/6th/7th starter with a 4-5 ERA and can handle 80-100 + IP is valuable.

The Sox have no room at DH. Sheets should never play OF, not even good at 1B. It's a win just getting an actual RF to play RF, which will benefit the entire staff. You can't have Sheets and Vaughn/Eloy starting in the OF if you are attempting to field a potential championship team. Preferable to have none of the three play OF, one is the absolute max you can get away with.