November 18, 20223 yr 8 hours ago, Tnetennba said: A team can live with poor production from the catcher’s spot, they can’t at 1B or DH. Grandal might be a sunk cost, but there’s no reason to create a black hole at a premium offensive position. He's a black hole at a premium defensive position. He does less harm at 1B or DH.
November 18, 20223 yr 8 hours ago, Jack Parkman said: The catch is that if he still sucks you bring up Sheets and Burger to platoon there. So the answer to your black hole idea is to platoon a couple of AAAA guys at 1B, thus creating another black hole at the previously mentioned premium offensive position? I mean, it tracks, but it’s hardly what I would call a good idea.
November 18, 20223 yr Just now, Tnetennba said: So the answer to your black hole idea is to platoon a couple of AAAA guys at 1B, thus creating another black hole at the previously mentioned premium offensive position? I mean, it tracks, but it’s hardly what I would call a good idea. See post about Sheets/Burger platoon vs Vaughn.
November 18, 20223 yr 4 minutes ago, Harold's Leg Lift said: He's a black hole at a premium defensive position. He does less harm at 1B or DH. He is awful behind the plate, no argument there. He was just as bad at 1B IMO though. He is strictly the back up C as far as I’m concerned, and one slow start away from a DFA. There is no way in hell I go into 2023 intending to use him regularly at 1B or DH.
November 18, 20223 yr 3 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: See post about Sheets/Burger platoon vs Vaughn. Nah, I’m good.
November 18, 20223 yr 5 minutes ago, Tnetennba said: Nah, I’m good. The only reason why I'm advocating it is because it could be legitimately their best option for 1B production with Abreu out of the picture. Everyone is convinced Vaughn>Sheets/Burger but the stats say otherwise. Vaughn and Sheets are close vs RHP and Burger has a huge power advantage over Vaughn against LHP, albeit in a SSS. Also, Sheets full season stats include before he made his adjustments in Charlotte, after which by the eye test(I can't find splits for before vs after he got called back up) I'm pretty sure Sheets was better than Vaughn against RHP. Edited November 18, 20223 yr by Jack Parkman
November 18, 20223 yr 2 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: The only reason why I'm advocating it is because it could be legitimately their best option for 1B production with Abreu out of the picture. Everyone is convinced Vaughn>Sheets/Burger but the stays say otherwise. Guys with options in the minors for depth is fine. They will get at bats in the MLB at some point.
November 18, 20223 yr 6 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: The only reason why I'm advocating it is because it could be legitimately their best option for 1B production with Abreu out of the picture. Everyone is convinced Vaughn>Sheets/Burger but the stats say otherwise. Vaughn and Sheets are close vs RHP and Burger has a huge power advantage over Vaughn against LHP, albeit in a SSS. Also, Sheets full season stats include before he made his adjustments in Charlotte, after which by the eye test(I can't find splits for before vs after he got called back up) I'm pretty sure Sheets was better than Vaughn against RHP. The small sample sizes for your proposed platoon aren’t enough to convince me that they are as good or better.
November 18, 20223 yr 5 minutes ago, Tnetennba said: The small sample sizes for your proposed platoon aren’t enough to convince me that they are as good or better. Sheets vs Vaughn against RHP isn't SSS. Burger played the first 6 weeks with the team until Yoan got healthy and he was crushing LHP. 110+ mph piss missiles on a regular basis. Edited November 18, 20223 yr by Jack Parkman
November 18, 20223 yr 9 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: Sheets vs Vaughn against RHP isn't SSS. Burger played the first 6 weeks with the team until Yoan got healthy and he was crushing LHP. 110+ mph piss missiles on a regular basis. I don’t remember what date he got hit on the hand, but starting on June 12 he went 6/48 with 0 home runs, .453 OPS over that stretch before he was sent back down. Whole lotta weak contact in there.
November 18, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, Jack Parkman said: Actually, this is very calculated. I know Burger was a SSS, but Sheets+Burger as a strict platoon outperformed Vaughn last year in OPS and SLG. Burger outperformed Vaughn vs LHP by a lot actually. Sheets vs RHP .250/.301/.736 Vaughn vs RHP .260/.309/.753 Vaughn vs LHP .307/.363/.744 Burger vs LHP .326/.388/1.039(!!!!) So Sheets and Vaughn are similar vs RHP and Burger is a huge short side advantage. Also Sheets was way better after his trip to Charlotte. All this did was show me that Vaughn was "fine" against righties for a guy that likely wore out towards the last couple months of the season playing a more physical demanding position most of the season.
November 18, 20223 yr 35 minutes ago, Balta1701 said: I don’t remember what date he got hit on the hand, but starting on June 12 he went 6/48 with 0 home runs, .453 OPS over that stretch before he was sent back down. Whole lotta weak contact in there. Burger was legitimately terrible vs RHP, I'm not arguing that. Also the shift ban should help Sheets Edited November 18, 20223 yr by Jack Parkman
November 18, 20223 yr If Burger and Sheets end up at 1B then this team isn’t serious about contending. Burger also has never played 1B. Not saying he wouldn’t be able to figure it out, but it’s not a sure thing to just move a guy there and expect them to be good.
November 18, 20223 yr 9 minutes ago, CWSpalehoseCWS said: If Burger and Sheets end up at 1B then this team isn’t serious about contending. Burger also has never played 1B. Not saying he wouldn’t be able to figure it out, but it’s not a sure thing to just move a guy there and expect them to be good. I hate to break it to you, but Jerry's budget already says that they're not serious about contending. There's no way they could be with the contracts they have. I think if they non-tender Engel and Ruiz they have about $15M in budget space to fill their holes without subtracting from the roster. Idk if they traded Giolito and Hendriks if they could even pull off the modest offseason I put together. I know what I'd do if money was no object, but that's not reality. Edited November 18, 20223 yr by Jack Parkman
November 18, 20223 yr 6 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: I hate to break it to you, but Jerry's budget already says that they're not serious about contending. There's no way they could be with the contracts they have. I think if they non-tender Engel and Ruiz they have about $15M in budget space to fill their holes without subtracting from the roster. Idk if they traded Giolito and Hendriks if they could even pull off the modest offseason I put together. I know what I'd do if money was no object, but that's not reality. The White Sox had a top 10 payroll last year and will again this year, they are serious about contending but that doesn't mean they are good at it.
November 18, 20223 yr Andrew Vaughn had a 125 wRC+ through August of last year. That’s with Frank “f*** the HR” Menechino as hitting coach who no doubt was going to prioritize Vaughn’s worst tendencies. Stop playing him in the OF and let a hitting coach who preaches power work with him so this kid can finally reach his offensive potential. I think a 140 wRC+ is very much possible and that will blow whatever a Sheets/Burger platoon would give us.
November 18, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, Harold's Leg Lift said: He's a black hole at a premium defensive position. He does less harm at 1B or DH. No he doesn’t lol. Not when you consider the offense side of it too. This version of Grandal at 1B or DH on a consistent basis would be a disaster. Obviously it’s not ideal at C either but there aren’t that many great hitting catchers. 1B and DH are positions where you need to mash baseballs.
November 18, 20223 yr 11 minutes ago, T R U said: The White Sox had a top 10 payroll last year and will again this year, they are serious about contending but that doesn't mean they are good at it. They have too many holes to work with a $180M budget. If they're not willing to approach the tax(say $215-220M) , they're not serious.
November 18, 20223 yr 5 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Andrew Vaughn had a 125 wRC+ through August of last year. That’s with Frank “f*** the HR” Menechino as hitting coach who no doubt was going to prioritize Vaughn’s worst tendencies. Stop playing him in the OF and let a hitting coach who preaches power work with him so this kid can finally reach his offensive potential. I think a 140 wRC+ is very much possible and that will blow whatever a Sheets/Burger platoon would give us. All of this. I don't think AV has really even scratched the surface playing under TLR/Frank. He has never really gotten a chance to play at his natural position yet. If Sheets and or Burger out perform even after a year of AV at 1B, then we can start entertaining a silly platoon idea of subpar players.
November 18, 20223 yr 13 minutes ago, T R U said: The White Sox had a top 10 payroll last year and will again this year, they are serious about contending but that doesn't mean they are good at it. I wouldn't make absolute statements like that. They could easily fall out of the top 10. What were they 7th? If their payroll is $10M less this year and other teams step up in free agency it's easy to see the Sox falling into the 10-12 range in payroll. JR didnt get playoff money. and the Sox look terrible. It's doubtful JR feels any remorse about fucking up the Sox by the constant employment of incompetents . JR is a bottom line guy. No playoffs, no payoff. No money at the trade deadline last year and less money towards payroll this year than last year. They aren't serious about contending now. Serious would mean firing Hahn and modernizing and creating jobs in growing behind the scenes departments. If that didn't happen when the rebuild started it's not happening now.
November 18, 20223 yr 8 minutes ago, Tnetennba said: All of this. I don't think AV has really even scratched the surface playing under TLR/Frank. He has never really gotten a chance to play at his natural position yet. If Sheets and or Burger out perform even after a year of AV at 1B, then we can start entertaining a silly platoon idea of subpar players. I think if they could trade AV for Alek Thomas, I'd do it. 1B is a pretty easy spot to fill. They could even entertain Eloy there if he objects to DH so much. I wouldn't because Eloy has no awareness of walls, but they could do that if they so choose. Edited November 18, 20223 yr by Jack Parkman
November 18, 20223 yr 1 hour ago, joejoesox said: Jake Burger is AAAA fodder now? come on He is a TERRIBLE defender, so he has no defensive position he can play. His bat can only carry him so much, and with other DH's in front of him, yeah there isn't a real spot for him on a full and healthy roster.
November 18, 20223 yr 2 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said: I think if they could trade AV for Alek Thomas, I'd do it. 1B is a pretty easy spot to fill. They could even entertain Eloy there if he objects to DH so much. You have to wait a year on both of them. Thomas shows promise just as Vaughn does. Thomas intrinsically more valuable by positional defense. I am curious how Vaughn will do once put where he belongs and 2 years of facing MLB pitching. I'll minimize any effect of a new manager and hitting coach . Besides it's doubtful AZ is entertaining trading their growing young core of LHH OF's unless it's for pitching.
November 18, 20223 yr 23 minutes ago, Chicago White Sox said: Andrew Vaughn had a 125 wRC+ through August of last year. That’s with Frank “f*** the HR” Menechino as hitting coach who no doubt was going to prioritize Vaughn’s worst tendencies. Stop playing him in the OF and let a hitting coach who preaches power work with him so this kid can finally reach his offensive potential. I think a 140 wRC+ is very much possible and that will blow whatever a Sheets/Burger platoon would give us. I am with you. #TeamVaughn He is going to be a great hitter.
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