Sox are worth 1.76 billion, and lost $10m in 21

https://www.forbes.com/sites/mikeozanian/2022/03/24/baseballs-most-valuable-teams-2022-yankees-hit-6-billion-as-new-cba-creates-new-revenue-streams/?sh=e126d51600a2

Is that all???

Gimme two of 'em, then.

If Jerry cared about winning they would have lost 30 million. 

I know Forbes is seemingly as accurate as we'll get on the public side, but I don't believe for a second the Sox lost money in 2021.

Open up the books and prove it.

The Clippers sold for 2 billion ten years ago.

The Sox are worth a lot more than 1.75 on the open market. 

1 hour ago, maxjusttyped said:

I know Forbes is seemingly as accurate as we'll get on the public side, but I don't believe for a second the Sox lost money in 2021.

Open up the books and prove it.

Yeah I’d love to see how those #’s make sense. Can’t be factoring in all revenue streams. There’s 0% chance teams like the Yankees, Phillies and Dodgers aren’t making $ somehow. I don’t care how rich these owners are, there’s no way they are willingly losing 10’s of millions every year. 
 

Then again, maybe it’s just a business strategy to report losses for tax purposes? I’m not smart enough/too broke to fully understand how that works tho

Edited January 7, 20233 yr by TheFutureIsNear

37 minutes ago, black jack said:

The Clippers sold for 2 billion ten years ago.

The Sox are worth a lot more than 1.75 on the open market. 

I’d say Forbes is like consistently 40% below selling price. Sometimes more.

Great, good for the kids.

Tax implications will not let the team be sold before he croaks, so.....

18 hours ago, maxjusttyped said:

I know Forbes is seemingly as accurate as we'll get on the public side, but I don't believe for a second the Sox lost money in 2021.

Open up the books and prove it.

I don't believe they lost money, either, at least not $10 million. JR has been crying poor for over 40 years, but after 40 years, he still holds onto the team. Don't care what the team is valued at. It is not going to be sold, so I find the number meaningless.

I "lost money" on my home last year while picking up a lot of equity. Same principal here, they may have lost $10 mil, but the value of the franchise may have increased $100 mil. And let's remember that it's not like the ownership group is tossing in money each year. It's more debt they have to service. 

If they only lost $10 mil a year for all of the forty years this group has owned the Sox, $400 mil total, it would still be a great investment. 

NBA franchises are with more. Comparing to the Clippers probably isn't accurate. The Bulls are worth over $2billion. 

I wouldn't be surprised if Jerry received a nice raise this year as President. Don't think of the loss as him losing income. If they sell, it means a bank will be grabbing a little more off the top at closing. At $1.7 billion that $10 mil loss is very minor. 

 

 

Not sure what the point is here. If anyone believes Jerry lost $21 mil last year, then I have some breachfront property in New Mexico to sell you. And the Sox will sell for way more than 1.76 bil if it attracts open bidders.

19 minutes ago, Sarava said:

Not sure what the point is here. If anyone believes Jerry lost $21 mil last year, then I have some breachfront property in New Mexico to sell you. And the Sox will sell for way more than 1.76 bil if it attracts open bidders.

It says 2021 right? That’s not impossible, given that fans didn’t get in until June.

Shows how terrible of a business man he is though given how the braves pulled a 100 mill profit.

18 minutes ago, Sarava said:

Not sure what the point is here. If anyone believes Jerry lost $21 mil last year, then I have some breachfront property in New Mexico to sell you. And the Sox will sell for way more than 1.76 bil if it attracts open bidders.

How much debt does the team have? What's their P&I cost?  What were the executive salaries? Office costs? The average MLB team employees about 500 people. How much do they contribute to run the league offices? Insurance costs? 

And Jerry owns 20% so "he" didn't lose that. Companies have losing years, dividends get paid, CEOs get bonuses. If they did lose that they have plenty of equity to borrow against. Just draw down their line if credit. 

It's easy to believe they lost $21 mil. That's really not that much. For some franchises that's just one player's salary. 

I'm certain there is a pro CPA on this board.  How much can a team depreciate its players and/or capitalize them?

8 minutes ago, oldsox said:

I'm certain there is a pro CPA on this board.  How much can a team depreciate its players and/or capitalize them?

Jerry is a pro CPA, and former IRS auditor, uhhh, I think he's good. The losses also don't include parking revenue, which is entirely his. Making ? year after year, or more likely, 'breaking even' as far as the IRS is concerned.

Nothing will change until he dies and the kids sell the team.

Jerry owns 20%. His influence isn't as much as one of the owners, it's as the Chairman. He doesn't have to sell, he could retire and allow a successor to take over. 

1 hour ago, Texsox said:

Jerry owns 20%. His influence isn't as much as one of the owners, it's as the Chairman. He doesn't have to sell, he could retire and allow a successor to take over. 

How do you know his current ownership share?

2 hours ago, Texsox said:

Jerry owns 20%. His influence isn't as much as one of the owners, it's as the Chairman. He doesn't have to sell, he could retire and allow a successor to take over. 

He may not own the majority of economic interest, but he controls the voting interest 

5 hours ago, Balta1701 said:

How do you know his current ownership share?

That's the most common reoccurring percentage I've read. It is unofficial. It usually is included in reports on his current estimated net worth of $1.8 billion. Perhaps it's an audit number. But I don't believe anyone disputes he owns much less than half. 

3 hours ago, shago said:

He may not own the majority of economic interest, but he controls the voting interest 

Voting on what? 

8 hours ago, Texsox said:

I "lost money" on my home last year while picking up a lot of equity. Same principal here, they may have lost $10 mil, but the value of the franchise may have increased $100 mil. And let's remember that it's not like the ownership group is tossing in money each year. It's more debt they have to service. 

If they only lost $10 mil a year for all of the forty years this group has owned the Sox, $400 mil total, it would still be a great investment. 

NBA franchises are with more. Comparing to the Clippers probably isn't accurate. The Bulls are worth over $2billion. 

I wouldn't be surprised if Jerry received a nice raise this year as President. Don't think of the loss as him losing income. If they sell, it means a bank will be grabbing a little more off the top at closing. At $1.7 billion that $10 mil loss is very minor. 

 

 

The Lakers are probably worth more, but not the fucking Clippers. 

1 hour ago, black jack said:

The Lakers are probably worth more, but not the fucking Clippers. 

The Bulls are valued higher than the Sox. 

5 hours ago, Texsox said:

That's the most common reoccurring percentage I've read. It is unofficial. It usually is included in reports on his current estimated net worth of $1.8 billion. Perhaps it's an audit number. But I don't believe anyone disputes he owns much less than half. 

It has been estimated that JR now owns about 18% of the team since some of the other investors have passed away and he now has their shares.

But this is the key point. JR has ABSOLUTE AUTHORITY to run the franchise as he sees fit. It is in his contract. The minority owners can offer advice/suggestions but JR can do as he wishes. He also has control over if the franchise is to be sold. Minority owners have been asking him to sell since 2005 and he refuses to do so. Andrew Berlin twice offered to buy the club in 2008 and JR said no. 

The only way JR can in essence be removed from his position is if he does something illegal (malfeasance) or shows that he is losing his mental faculties.

I have spoken with two individuals who know members of the board/minority owners and have been told the Sox "haven't lost money in a long time..."

 

All sports teams always are under valued until they are sold. The White Sox team will go for a lot more than 1.76 billion when it's eventually on the open market for sale. 

There are only 30 of these MLB teams and they aren't being sold very often. Once the Sox are for truly for sale, there will be many extremely rich billionaires who will covet owning a MLB team like the Sox, especially one in the third largest market. These rich billionaires will bid high and be willing and able to pay way over the valuation of the team. 

Unfortunately that day cannot come soon enough!

Edited January 27, 20233 yr by The Kids Can Play

5 hours ago, The Kids Can Play said:

All sports teams always are under valued until they are sold. The White Sox team will go for a lot more than 1.76 billion when it's eventually on the open market for sale. 

There are only 30 of these MLB teams and they aren't being sold very often. Once the Sox are for truly for sale, there will be many extremely rich billionaires who will covert owning a MLB team like the Sox, especially one in the third largest market. These rich billionaires will bid high and be willing and able to pay way over the valuation of the team. 

Unfortunately that day cannot come soon enough!

When the Sox go up for sale, it will truly be such a rare opportunity. Seldom is a MLB team in a major market like Chicago made available.

 

Edited January 10, 20233 yr by Joshua Strong