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Opening up my mind to giving the season a clean slate


Richie
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27 minutes ago, Chimpton said:

They may be 9-7 over the last 16 but they are 5-5 over the last 10 and did just drop a series 3-1 to the Royals!

2 nice wins against the Guardians is good to see but lets not go booking World Series tickets just yet!

No reason to get excited until they defeat McKenzie Ramirez and Naylor head to head/convincingly.

Taking down a diminished Bieber was progress of a sort. 

Edited by caulfield12
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10 hours ago, The Beast said:

Sadly, I still think they have a shot in a weak AL Central.

After taking two from Cleveland and watching Minnesota sort of stumble. Yeah, no one's running away with this. With a bunch of games upcoming against our weak division as well? It still wouldn't shock me to see us reel some wins off.

But again... here we are with me thinking about this on a Dylan Cease day, going into a game that we "should" win. I will likely be very frustrated and pissed off by 2-3 PM this afternoon. 

A surge would remind me a little of the 2001 season. After we won 95 games and had high expectations. Started 14-29. Wound up getting back in it quickly and finding .500 at 36-36. Obviously, that year, we didn't follow through on that run and sort of hovered around .500 most of the year. 83 wins, Cleveland won 91, and A's got the only AL Wild Card with 102 wins. 

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7 hours ago, Greg Hibbard said:

9-7 over their last 16 since cratering at 7-21. 

if they keep playing 9-7 ball over every future 16 they end up at 82-80.

just sayin’…

The division is shitty enough to where a .500 record (possibly a game or two over/under) wins the division.

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4 minutes ago, Richie said:

After taking two from Cleveland and watching Minnesota sort of stumble. Yeah, no one's running away with this. With a bunch of games upcoming against our weak division as well? It still wouldn't shock me to see us reel some wins off.

But again... here we are with me thinking about this on a Dylan Cease day, going into a game that we "should" win. I will likely be very frustrated and pissed off by 2-3 PM this afternoon. 

A surge would remind me a little of the 2001 season. After we won 95 games and had high expectations. Started 14-29. Wound up getting back in it quickly and finding .500 at 36-36. Obviously, that year, we didn't follow through on that run and sort of hovered around .500 most of the year. 83 wins, Cleveland won 91, and A's got the only AL Wild Card with 102 wins. 

19-31 Nationals is going to get a lot of play the next week or so... the year they won it all. 

2005 Astros

One of those years the Cardinals only won 83-84 but took the WS. 

1987/1991 Twins, etc. 

 

The problem is that every team BUT the White Sox in the AL Central (except for the Royals?) have lost AT LEAST two starting pitchers or more to significant injuries already. 

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9 minutes ago, Richie said:

After taking two from Cleveland and watching Minnesota sort of stumble. Yeah, no one's running away with this. With a bunch of games upcoming against our weak division as well? It still wouldn't shock me to see us reel some wins off.

But again... here we are with me thinking about this on a Dylan Cease day, going into a game that we "should" win. I will likely be very frustrated and pissed off by 2-3 PM this afternoon. 

A surge would remind me a little of the 2001 season. After we won 95 games and had high expectations. Started 14-29. Wound up getting back in it quickly and finding .500 at 36-36. Obviously, that year, we didn't follow through on that run and sort of hovered around .500 most of the year. 83 wins, Cleveland won 91, and A's got the only AL Wild Card with 102 wins. 

Great memory. In this weak division where they will eventually get Hendriks and Jimenez back and they have gotten hot as of late with the bats, it is possible to come back. It might just be a spark that doesn’t last, but they could also go on a tear and get back to winning. That hole they dug at the beginning of the year left me wondering what it would have been like if they didn’t have all of the injuries to start this year even with the awful pitching performances they had in April.

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6 hours ago, hi8is said:

Puke.

Are you suffering poop blockage?

4 hours ago, Chimpton said:

They may be 9-7 over the last 16 but they are 5-5 over the last 10 and did just drop a series 3-1 to the Royals!

2 nice wins against the Guardians is good to see but lets not go booking World Series tickets just yet!

It’s fun to have a little excitement and hope after the first six weeks, even if we acknowledge Cleveland without Ramirez is pathetic.

Hopefully guys that can perform better like Anderson, Benintendi, Cease and Kopech will improve, Eloy will return and can cover RF, and Crochet and Liam can return and be effective.

  • (1) Cleveland Guardians
  • (3) Kansas City Royals
  • (3) @ Cleveland Guardians
  • (4) @ Detroit Tigers
  • (3) Los Angeles Angels
  • (3) Detroit Tigers

If the team can go 11-6 or better during this upcoming stretch, perhaps they can have a shot at the Division. This is far below the threshold a rebuild should net, but still a far better place for fans to enjoy the season than entering this series.

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I keep pointing to he fact that history cannot be the gauge as to what the future will hold.  

Looking back over he history of baseball there were times when the playoffs consisted of 2 teams, now it is 12.  There were schedules that were more weighted to divisional foes now that is reduced.  This impacts travel and knowing the pitcher and opponent much less then in the past. 

I can only judge by what I am seeing. 

The bullpen is shaky but has gotten better and the bats seem to be better as Moncada and Burger are back and the third string catcher is not the DH.

All that being said, they did lose 3 of 4 in KC last week....but KC just beat the Padres so who knows lies ahead.

I do think the order needs to be reconfigured.

 

 

 

 

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10 hours ago, Greg Hibbard said:

9-7 over their last 16 since cratering at 7-21. 

if they keep playing 9-7 ball over every future 16 they end up at 82-80.

just sayin’…

If they continue to play 9-7 over the next six weeks they will still end up being sellers at the deadline and then it will get uglier.

 

The hole they dug for themselves ensures they will be sellers at the trade deadline.  It is inevitable.

Edited by FloydBannister1983
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I still believe the Twins will win 85 and the Sox won’t ever get to .500, but here’s the math to make you believe…

Sox need to go 4-3 vs the Twins and be 7 games better than them over the other 111 games. Yes, it’s possible. 

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Cleveland may be in trouble, as they've played the weakest schedule (or so it looks to me).
But the other teams have played tough schedules.   And despite the record, I don't see the Royals as the absolute patsies they've been for the last few years (patsies, that is, to every team but the Sox).

Even if they Sox are in it in July, they've got to use July productively to bring young talent into thos org.  And that includes trading at least  Giolito.  
Now they have to do this right to pull it off. That's a big ask from Hahnber.  

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2 hours ago, South Side Hit Men said:

Are you suffering poop blockage?

It’s fun to have a little excitement and hope after the first six weeks, even if we acknowledge Cleveland without Ramirez is pathetic.

Hopefully guys that can perform better like Anderson, Benintendi, Cease and Kopech will improve, Eloy will return and can cover RF, and Crochet and Liam can return and be effective.

  • (1) Cleveland Guardians
  • (3) Kansas City Royals
  • (3) @ Cleveland Guardians
  • (4) @ Detroit Tigers
  • (3) Los Angeles Angels
  • (3) Detroit Tigers

If the team can go 11-6 or better during this upcoming stretch, perhaps they can have a shot at the Division. This is far below the threshold a rebuild should net, but still a far better place for fans to enjoy the season than entering this series.

Eloy might have a worse throwing arm than Benintendi.

He’s not a RFer, any more than AJ Pollock is or was in 2022-23.

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Just now, GreenSox said:

Cleveland may be in trouble, as they've played the weakest schedule (or so it looks to me).
But the other teams have played tough schedules.   And despite the record, I don't see the Royals as the absolute patsies they've been for the last few years (patsies, that is, to every team but the Sox).

Even if they Sox are in it in July, they've got to use July productively to bring young talent into thos org.  And that includes trading at least  Giolito.  
Now they have to do this right to pull it off. That's a big ask from Hahnber.  

If they’re competitive in June and July still, that’s just going to be seen as another White Flag with absolutely nobody behind Gio on the depth chart.

It’s 2001-03 bad…probably worse.

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14 minutes ago, flavum said:

I still believe the Twins will win 85 and the Sox won’t ever get to .500, but here’s the math to make you believe…

Sox need to go 4-3 vs the Twins and be 7 games better than them over the other 111 games. Yes, it’s possible. 

Do you think the Sox will have the same team, an improved team, or a diminished team for the next 111 games?

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From the MLB.com web site:

American League Central: White Sox-Tigers
Current: Tigers up 4 1/2 games
Projected Standings: White Sox up 1

First off, yes, we know: These are hardly the top two teams in this division. But we’re focusing on them for two reasons. First, the projections are incredibly high on the Twins, giving them an eight-game cushion on the Guardians and a double-digit-game cushion on both of these teams. The real reason, though, is how different the expectations were for both the Tigers and the White Sox coming into this season. The White Sox were thought, with a new manager, to be legitimate AL Central contenders; the Tigers were just considered fortunate to have 2022 finally be over. But the Tigers have been plucky in the early going, spending most of the season in second place. The White Sox? The White Sox have not been plucky, let’s say that.

If the Tigers are in a position to finish higher than the White Sox -- a team that is farther along its hypothetical “contention window” than their Michigan counterparts -- that would say something very clear and fascinating about where this division is standing moving forward. But the tell here is that even with the White Sox’s supposed “surge” to catch up with the Tigers, they’re still projected for 74 wins. If the White Sox are running at that pace come the Trade Deadline, it’s fair to presume that they will look a lot different after Aug. 1 than they would before -- a lot worse. The Tigers probably aren’t a .463 team. But they sure look like the third-place team in this division. That is progress, anyway.

Believe the projections? No

They also have another story with 10 players generating real trade interest. The White Sox have four of the 10, Anderson, Cease, Grandal and Giolito. 

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3 minutes ago, FloydBannister1983 said:

Do you think the Sox will have the same team, an improved team, or a diminished team for the next 111 games?

Obviously, it depends. Let’s look at the standings on June 18 when the Sox are flying home from Seattle.

Edited by flavum
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4 minutes ago, Lip Man 1 said:

From the MLB.com web site:

American League Central: White Sox-Tigers
Current: Tigers up 4 1/2 games
Projected Standings: White Sox up 1

First off, yes, we know: These are hardly the top two teams in this division. But we’re focusing on them for two reasons. First, the projections are incredibly high on the Twins, giving them an eight-game cushion on the Guardians and a double-digit-game cushion on both of these teams. The real reason, though, is how different the expectations were for both the Tigers and the White Sox coming into this season. The White Sox were thought, with a new manager, to be legitimate AL Central contenders; the Tigers were just considered fortunate to have 2022 finally be over. But the Tigers have been plucky in the early going, spending most of the season in second place. The White Sox? The White Sox have not been plucky, let’s say that.

If the Tigers are in a position to finish higher than the White Sox -- a team that is farther along its hypothetical “contention window” than their Michigan counterparts -- that would say something very clear and fascinating about where this division is standing moving forward. But the tell here is that even with the White Sox’s supposed “surge” to catch up with the Tigers, they’re still projected for 74 wins. If the White Sox are running at that pace come the Trade Deadline, it’s fair to presume that they will look a lot different after Aug. 1 than they would before -- a lot worse. The Tigers probably aren’t a .463 team. But they sure look like the third-place team in this division. That is progress, anyway.

Believe the projections? No

They also have another story with 10 players generating real trade interest. The White Sox have four of the 10, Anderson, Cease, Grandal and Giolito. 

They have been without Mize, Skubal and Manning, 3/5ths of their projected rotation…not to mention Austin Meadows.

Eddie Rodriguez and Lange as closer have been huge positive surprises.

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22 minutes ago, flavum said:

I still believe the Twins will win 85 and the Sox won’t ever get to .500, but here’s the math to make you believe…

Sox need to go 4-3 vs the Twins and be 7 games better than them over the other 111 games. Yes, it’s possible. 

I agree with you. Just because the Twins lost 2 of 3 to the Dodgers does not mean they are falling apart. Guess what, the Twins lost to the Dodgers who have the best record in the NL and 3rd best in MLB. 

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I just can't quit this team or franchise.  I despise them but get so damn happy and hopeful when things start to click the way we expected them to click.

Fact is we had the most difficult schedule in MLB through April and it wasn't particularly close.  We dealt with injuries and missing players.

Schedule has lightened up considerably, we're getting healthy, we're starting to see some power numbers increase, bullpen is trying to settle and will improve with Liam and Garrett coming back.  Unless you're worried about Billy or Elvis, we're essentially healthy now except for Eloy's freak appendectomy.

I don't know.  I think it's at least possible we truly turn a corner and this team starts playing with some swagger instead of pressing.  When that happens?  Anything is possible.

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16 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Eloy might have a worse throwing arm than Benintendi.

He’s not a RFer, any more than AJ Pollock is or was in 2022-23.

You are probably right. Then put him in left and tell him to stay away from Robert. Let Benintendi play right. 

The good news with Robert and Benintendi, they can cover 3/4 of the outfield and tell Eloy just stay out of the way. lol

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22 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

If they’re competitive in June and July still, that’s just going to be seen as another White Flag with absolutely nobody behind Gio on the depth chart.

It’s 2001-03 bad…probably worse.

Not if you do it right.
And the big problem with White Flag was its poor execution.

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35 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

Eloy might have a worse throwing arm than Benintendi.

He’s not a RFer, any more than AJ Pollock is or was in 2022-23.

Sheets has zero business playing defense.

Rick Hahn roster construction with six guys who can't play defense on the roster beyond 1B before letting Abreu go (Vaughn, Grandal, Sheets, Burger, Eloy).

 

Edited by South Side Hit Men
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