Squirmin' for Yermin Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 2 hours ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said: Sox traded another generational talent for a utility infielder, a volatile reliever, a corner outfielder rocking a 144 ISO in AA, and a ++ Catcher. Crochet lead the Red Sox to the playoffs (not a playoff team without his starts and record), and then just dominated one of the best offenses in the game to carry his team to a game 1 win. Meanwhile, people are posting videos of Kyle Teel hitting homers for a 60 win baseball team and saying "thank you Crochet." 😂 In year one the Red Sox have undoubtedly won the trade. On to year two! You're so silly. of course the Red Sox were going to "win the trade" in year one.. we received a bunch of prospects. None of which may I add, took a step back. 3 2 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
77 Hitmen Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 1 hour ago, oldsox said: The real losers in this trade are Teel and Montgomery, If they're talented enough, the Sox will trade them at some point for more prospects and then they can join the long list of ex-players who say they were thankful to get out of that train wreck of an organization. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 Ray it's been a minute but you're back on your BS again. Gotta call you out here. Why are you choosing this particular moment to take a victory lap? There's no way to judge this trade for another 3-4 years. There's so much still to happen. Lord knows we've had trades like fine or even great after one or two seasons only for them to look horrific 4-5 years down the road. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Look at Ray Ray Run Posted October 1 Author Share Posted October 1 47 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said: Ray it's been a minute but you're back on your BS again. Gotta call you out here. Why are you choosing this particular moment to take a victory lap? There's no way to judge this trade for another 3-4 years. There's so much still to happen. Lord knows we've had trades like fine or even great after one or two seasons only for them to look horrific 4-5 years down the road. If there's no way to judge this trade for 3-4 years, how can Getz get a passing grade this past season because of the Crochet trade? I agree by the way. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 8 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said: If there's no way to judge this trade for 3-4 years, how can Getz get a passing grade this past season because of the Crochet trade? I agree by the way. Eh, the trade right now looks to be a win win for both teams. Calling it anything else seems premature at best. And let's be cognizant that Crochet has already had TJS and will carry an elevated injury risk on a large contract for the next 6 years. There's downside risk the Sox avoided by getting cost controlled young position players for him. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestEddy Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 6 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said: If there's no way to judge this trade for 3-4 years, how can Getz get a passing grade this past season because of the Crochet trade? I agree by the way. I think we all recognize that this team wasn't going to compete during Crochet's arb-time here. Therefore, a trade looked like a clear path to goosing the current rebuild. In the initial analysis of the return, it does look like Getz got back two impact prospects in Teel and Monty, a serviceable player in Meidroth, and a possible bullpen piece in Wikelman. So, in grading this particular season, Getz did what was required and didn't cause consternation with the horrible return. As far as a long term grade, obviously, Crochet, Monty and Teel have their entire careers in front of them and it really can't be judged until we see how these guys turn out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 2 hours ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said: You're so silly. of course the Red Sox were going to "win the trade" in year one.. we received a bunch of prospects. None of which may I add, took a step back. And in plain English, the White Sox were going to trade Garrett Crochet at some point if he was at all successful. News Flash: Jerry Reinsdorf is never going to sign off on the type of deal it took to keep Crochet long term, especially with his injury history and TJS already on the books. It was never going to happen. The question was never going to be what happened if the Sox kept him. The question was could Chris Getz have gotten more for him, either at the time he was dealt, or would it have been worth betting on his health to hold up and his asking price to go up over time. We all know what I think of Getz's ability, but I wouldn't have been willing to bet that kind of a high stakes return on Crochet's future health. Betting on a guy like Dylan Cease who has a history of taking the ball is one thing. Cease had took the ball every single turn for three straight years with the White Sox, good for 170 IP+ each of those seasons. You bet on a guy like that. We already saw what betting on Luis Robert to stay healthy looks like. Argue the return all you want, but the assumption that Getz had a choice here is one I can't get with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Look at Ray Ray Run Posted October 1 Author Share Posted October 1 14 minutes ago, chitownsportsfan said: Eh, the trade right now looks to be a win win for both teams. Calling it anything else seems premature at best. And let's be cognizant that Crochet has already had TJS and will carry an elevated injury risk on a large contract for the next 6 years. There's downside risk the Sox avoided by getting cost controlled young position players for him. I think there are a few things that count against the Sox. 1. Continuing to bet on Crochet, even just to trade him at the deadline, I believe would have netted more than they got. 2. Crochet extension is going to end up being well under market value which will add to his value as the deal goes on, even though it was signed post trade 3. True #1 SP are the most valuable asset in baseball in the playoffs these days - especially as the league shifts towards more arms and shorter outings. Crochet is more and more rare of an asset as time goes on imo. I believe they could turn around and trade Crochet tomorrow for more than the Sox got. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 so you traded a guy who can only win once every five days for some guys who play more than once every five days. Amazed how baseball overvalues pitchers. Sure you need them but I think they are overvalued compared to other positions. Whats even worse is the overvalue of pens that can be quite inconsistent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ducksnort Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 9 minutes ago, kitekrazy said: so you traded a guy who can only win once every five days for some guys who play more than once every five days. Amazed how baseball overvalues pitchers. Sure you need them but I think they are overvalued compared to other positions. Whats even worse is the overvalue of pens that can be quite inconsistent. Those elite starting pitchers are incredibly valuable in the post season. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 1 minute ago, Ducksnort said: Those elite starting pitchers are incredibly valuable in the post season. too many times it's putting the cart before the horse 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 2 minutes ago, kitekrazy said: too many times it's putting the cart before the horse Yea man I’m sure the entirety of baseball has it wrong on value of pitchers vs position players 2 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 16 minutes ago, Kyyle23 said: Yea man I’m sure the entirety of baseball has it wrong on value of pitchers vs position players they are Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 8 minutes ago, kitekrazy said: they are except in October Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 2 minutes ago, caulfield12 said: except in October hopefully they get that far..........they can have an injury where they miss over a year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wegner Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 I am going to look on the bright side....I was worried the Sox were gonna trade Schultz and Smith after they showed MLB what they can do....but now it looks like they will be bad enough that the Sox will keep them. Progress, not perfection. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted October 2 Share Posted October 2 6 minutes ago, wegner said: I am going to look on the bright side....I was worried the Sox were gonna trade Schultz and Smith after they showed MLB what they can do....but now it looks like they will be bad enough that the Sox will keep them. Progress, not perfection. Trust the process. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caulfield12 Posted October 2 Share Posted October 2 30 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said: Trust the process. Would rather have Sam Hinkie as GM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted October 2 Share Posted October 2 1 hour ago, caulfield12 said: Would rather have Sam Hinkie as GM. I would rather have Mr. Hankey as GM. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteSox2023 Posted October 2 Share Posted October 2 (edited) 4 hours ago, kitekrazy said: so you traded a guy who can only win once every five days for some guys who play more than once every five days. Amazed how baseball overvalues pitchers. Sure you need them but I think they are overvalued compared to other positions. Whats even worse is the overvalue of pens that can be quite inconsistent. He was the 10th most valuable player in the entire MLB by WAR during the regular season. https://www.espn.com/mlb/war/leaders Your opinion is an interesting one to say the least… Edited October 2 by WhiteSox2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloydBannister1983 Posted October 2 Share Posted October 2 10 hours ago, caulfield12 said: Montgomery was never going to get an opportunity in that outfield...Teel maybe, eventually, but not over Narvaez in 2025. Missing WS rings...?? Maybe Kyle but still think the Mariners or Dodgers win. Cough … joke … cough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wegner Posted October 2 Share Posted October 2 58 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said: I would rather have Mr. Hankey as GM. Best Christmas episode ever!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaliSoxFanViaSWside Posted October 2 Share Posted October 2 16 hours ago, Kyyle23 said: Yea man I’m sure the entirety of baseball has it wrong on value of pitchers vs position players Not sure what this even means. With prospects position players are more highly valued than pitchers and it's not even close. With teams needing a large boost to their rotations a true ace like Verlander or Bumgarner can be a difference maker but those guys are truly exceptional . To get to that level of reliability you have to have a good record of health and success. You can name a lot more current very good to great hitters than you can pitchers who can go deep into games and truly dominate . The chances of getting a Verlander or Bumgarner type post season run become less every year. Dominant lefthanders like Crochet, Sale and to a lesser degree Rodon all had quite different paths. Sale stayed pretty healthy while Crochet and Rodon were written off as too injury prone . Most people were OK with drafting Hagen Smith as another one of those lefties the Sox have had success with until his development path didnt stay linear but most probably wanted a hitter. Since Tommy John surgery is so prevalent in the development of pitchers position players are deemed as much more valuable. I highly doubt the Red Sox have the rest of the horses necessary to make a postseason run not when Romy Gonzalez still is getting crucial PT. Crochet may never get the chance that Sale did. And Sale wasn't dominant in his 1 World Series Start in 2018 but he was as a 1 inning reliever in game 5. His postseason performances in general have been mediocre at best. Rodon didnt hit it big until he was 28 after many injury prone years and getting non tendered then resigned by the Sox . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyyle23 Posted October 2 Share Posted October 2 24 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said: Not sure what this even means. With prospects position players are more highly valued than pitchers and it's not even close. With teams needing a large boost to their rotations a true ace like Verlander or Bumgarner can be a difference maker but those guys are truly exceptional . To get to that level of reliability you have to have a good record of health and success. You can name a lot more current very good to great hitters than you can pitchers who can go deep into games and truly dominate . The chances of getting a Verlander or Bumgarner type post season run become less every year. Dominant lefthanders like Crochet, Sale and to a lesser degree Rodon all had quite different paths. Sale stayed pretty healthy while Crochet and Rodon were written off as too injury prone . Most people were OK with drafting Hagen Smith as another one of those lefties the Sox have had success with until his development path didnt stay linear but most probably wanted a hitter. Since Tommy John surgery is so prevalent in the development of pitchers position players are deemed as much more valuable. I highly doubt the Red Sox have the rest of the horses necessary to make a postseason run not when Romy Gonzalez still is getting crucial PT. Crochet may never get the chance that Sale did. And Sale wasn't dominant in his 1 World Series Start in 2018 but he was as a 1 inning reliever in game 5. His postseason performances in general have been mediocre at best. Rodon didnt hit it big until he was 28 after many injury prone years and getting non tendered then resigned by the Sox . Do you believe that baseball overvalues starting pitchers, in this instance Crochet 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kitekrazy Posted October 3 Share Posted October 3 On 10/2/2025 at 10:07 AM, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said: Not sure what this even means. With prospects position players are more highly valued than pitchers and it's not even close. With teams needing a large boost to their rotations a true ace like Verlander or Bumgarner can be a difference maker but those guys are truly exceptional . To get to that level of reliability you have to have a good record of health and success. You can name a lot more current very good to great hitters than you can pitchers who can go deep into games and truly dominate . The chances of getting a Verlander or Bumgarner type post season run become less every year. Dominant lefthanders like Crochet, Sale and to a lesser degree Rodon all had quite different paths. Sale stayed pretty healthy while Crochet and Rodon were written off as too injury prone . Most people were OK with drafting Hagen Smith as another one of those lefties the Sox have had success with until his development path didnt stay linear but most probably wanted a hitter. Since Tommy John surgery is so prevalent in the development of pitchers position players are deemed as much more valuable. I highly doubt the Red Sox have the rest of the horses necessary to make a postseason run not when Romy Gonzalez still is getting crucial PT. Crochet may never get the chance that Sale did. And Sale wasn't dominant in his 1 World Series Start in 2018 but he was as a 1 inning reliever in game 5. His postseason performances in general have been mediocre at best. Rodon didnt hit it big until he was 28 after many injury prone years and getting non tendered then resigned by the Sox . It's really logic but that is overlooked in baseball and other sports. A guy who works every 5th day vs, people who play a lot more games. It would not be wise to trade a stud pitcher for more pitchers who are not proven but more as a budget move. Oh for a farm system that can produce both. Amazed what some teams pay for an "over the hill based on age" pitcher on they way to the Hall if they can get one season out of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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