https://www.mlb.com/whitesox/news/jj-wetherholt-colson-montgomery-excelling-on-defense

Good read, thanks for sharing.

"I was never asked about my defense," Montgomery said. "Everyone assumed since I was a taller, bigger shortstop that I was going to move to third base. They were only worried about me having to hit homers at third base and stuff like that. I take a lot of pride in my defense because I was overlooked."

It's incredible that things like this still happen. How do scouts get paid to watch a guy full time and not only miss on him as a SS, but miss on him as an elite defensive SS?

Well, it appears that Veneable also has missed the boat as have the White Sox as an org. Heck there's some fans that refuse to give him his due and think he and Acuna are similar.

1 hour ago, chitownsportsfan said:

It's incredible that things like this still happen. How do scouts get paid to watch a guy full time and not only miss on him as a SS, but miss on him as an elite defensive SS?

Cuz they're copycats. Baseball is full of them at every level.

1 minute ago, oldsox said:

Cuz they're copycats. Baseball is full of them at every level.

I think it's some form of bias but I think it's more bias towards (often wrong) conventional wisdom. I guess that's a form of copycat, just going with the accepted conclusion (with no real evidence) that taller SSs can't stick at the MLB level.

1 hour ago, chitownsportsfan said:

It's incredible that things like this still happen. How do scouts get paid to watch a guy full time and not only miss on him as a SS, but miss on him as an elite defensive SS?

The Colson one is fascinating because by all intents and purposes, he passes every eye test. In fact, guys like Colson sometimes get graded up because they're ++ athletes and athletes sometimes get the benefit of the doubt in areas other players won't.

I've watched Colson for 120+ games now, and he's elite as the word can get. He has huge range, gets to everything, but also has a great first step. His arm is probably only a 40 in strength, but it's an 80 in accuracy and his timing is so impeccable that I'm convinced he probably has more MPH's under there but just never needs to get to them.

I'm just happy to see someone write about Colson. He has to be the most underrated first-year player (first 162 games) in my life of watching baseball. He's on a 6.5 WAR pace over his first 160! That ranks Colson as having a top 15 Rookie Season of ALL-TIME. In the HISTORY of baseball!!! He never gets any pub, doesn't even get to play his natural position everyday on his own club.

Colson is a Superstar, but the league covers him like a supporting piece and the team treats him like some developing player.

Edited yesterday at 05:49 PM1 day by Look at Ray Ray Run

Speaking of shortstops, I'm looking for an opinion here. One of the key plays yesterday was McGonigle beating out that hit to deep short in 9th or 10th inning. I think it was 9th. Acuna was the shortstop. Very close play. Could Colson have made the play?

5 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I've watched Colson for 120+ games now, and he's elite as the word can get. He has huge range, gets to everything, but also has a great first step. His arm is probably only a 40 in strength, but it's an 80 in accuracy and his timing is so impeccable that I'm convinced he probably has more MPH's under there but just never needs to get to them.

It was obvious within like 2 weeks of watching him last year. He never gets a bad hop as he has some of the best reactions you'll ever see despite unorthodox mechanics. Like they don't teach you to take a step back on a chopper and field a ball at your waist but he does all the time. He looks unorthodox because as you said he doesn't rely on a cannon like many elite SS but he gets to the ball so quickly and his transfer is so quick it really doesn't matter.

Per lipman and Jeff Agrest, Venable thinks Acuna and Colson are equals defensively at SS.

26 minutes ago, oldsox said:

Speaking of shortstops, I'm looking for an opinion here. One of the key plays yesterday was McGonigle beating out that hit to deep short in 9th or 10th inning. I think it was 9th. Acuna was the shortstop. Very close play. Could Colson have made the play?

It was Jahmai Jones in the 9th. Acuña appeared to double clutch before throwing. In fantasyland, any play not made gets made by anybody else the manager didn't put in that spot. Also in fantasyland, Taylor doesn't give up the 8th inning HR to Dingler, Dominguez pitches over the infield hit, and Colson catches the ground ball to his left that scored Jones.

29 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

It was Jahmai Jones in the 9th. Acuña appeared to double clutch before throwing. In fantasyland, any play not made gets made by anybody else the manager didn't put in that spot. Also in fantasyland, Taylor doesn't give up the 8th inning HR to Dingler, Dominguez pitches over the infield hit, and Colson catches the ground ball to his left that scored Jones.

The fact that you can't admit that Colson makes the play because he's a better Shortstop is incredible. It's your obsession with critiquing anyone who critiques perceived authority.

One guy is an elite defender, the other isn't. The point of playing your best players at their best positions is to maximize outs. The Sox not playing their elite SS at SS cost them the win. It's really that simple.

In fact, some have been screaming that this would cost them all year. Now it does, and you act like people are playing Monday morning QB.

5 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

The fact that you can't admit that Colson makes the play because he's a better Shortstop is incredible. It's your obsession with critiquing anyone who critiques perceived authority.

One guy is an elite defender, the other isn't. The point of playing your best players at their best positions is to maximize outs. The Sox not playing their elite SS at SS cost them the win. It's really that simple.

In fact, some have been screaming that this would cost them all year. Now it does, and you act like people are playing Monday morning QB.

U do commit to a bit, I'll say that.

we could've drafted Wetherholt 🥲

17 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

The fact that you can't admit that Colson makes the play because he's a better Shortstop is incredible. It's your obsession with critiquing anyone who critiques perceived authority.

One guy is an elite defender, the other isn't. The point of playing your best players at their best positions is to maximize outs. The Sox not playing their elite SS at SS cost them the win. It's really that simple.

In fact, some have been screaming that this would cost them all year. Now it does, and you act like people are playing Monday morning QB.

1984 isn't just a memorable year for Sox fans...

1 hour ago, WestEddy said:

It was Jahmai Jones in the 9th. Acuña appeared to double clutch before throwing. In fantasyland, any play not made gets made by anybody else the manager didn't put in that spot. Also in fantasyland, Taylor doesn't give up the 8th inning HR to Dingler, Dominguez pitches over the infield hit, and Colson catches the ground ball to his left that scored Jones.

Of all the things listed here, my biggest issue is Dominguez crapping down his leg...again. There were two outs with a runner on first. A good closer pitches over that.

1 hour ago, chitownsportsfan said:

It was obvious within like 2 weeks of watching him last year. He never gets a bad hop as he has some of the best reactions you'll ever see despite unorthodox mechanics. Like they don't teach you to take a step back on a chopper and field a ball at your waist but he does all the time. He looks unorthodox because as you said he doesn't rely on a cannon like many elite SS but he gets to the ball so quickly and his transfer is so quick it really doesn't matter.

It's honestly difficult (for me anyway) to grade his arm at this point because he's so elite at reaction/first step you very rarely have to see him put max effort into a throw, he makes it all look easy.

52 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

U do commit to a bit, I'll say that.

I've been saying since the year started that playing Montgomery at 3rd and someone else at Short would cost the team and was not optimal.

Fast forward to a situation where that exact thing happens and you put your head in the sand and claim there was nothing that could be done and everyone is wrong.

Weird stuff!!!

Edit: And while I have some great bits, this isn't a bit. Colson should play short every day he plays like all other elite Shortstops in baseball history have done.

Edited 22 hours ago22 hr by Look at Ray Ray Run

Most fielding run value, INF, 2026

1-T. Bobby Witt Jr., SS (KC): +12

1-T. JJ Wetherholt, 2B (STL): +12

3-T. Colson Montgomery, SS (CWS): +8

3-T. Luis Arraez, 2B (SF): +8

5. Dansby Swanson, SS (CHC): +7

Where's that pud David Kaplan now?

12 minutes ago, JoeCredeYes said:

It's honestly difficult (for me anyway) to grade his arm at this point because he's so elite at reaction/first step you very rarely have to see him put max effort into a throw, he makes it all look easy.

Being an all-state level three sport athlete who could have gone D1 in literally any of the three sports means this is the first time in his life he has dedicated more than a few months at a time to a single sport. He doesn't have clean baseball actions, because he was also a D1 level QB, and D1 level SG. You can definitely see his football actions in his throwing style, and you can see his guard work in his footwork. It isn't ideal, but he makes it work better than most SSs who can play a textbook SS.

16 minutes ago, southsider2k5 said:

Being an all-state level three sport athlete who could have gone D1 in literally any of the three sports means this is the first time in his life he has dedicated more than a few months at a time to a single sport. He doesn't have clean baseball actions, because he was also a D1 level QB, and D1 level SG. You can definitely see his football actions in his throwing style, and you can see his guard work in his footwork. It isn't ideal, but he makes it work better than most SSs who can play a textbook SS.

For sure, I think his well above average size for SS also just makes him look a little less clean than a typical MLB SS. Anyway, it's fun as hell to watch and he's quickly become one of my favorites on the squad.

1 hour ago, WestEddy said:

U do commit to a bit, I'll say that.

Eh, @Look at Ray Ray Run has definitely been consistent about his critique of moving Colson off of SS. The posts are definitely there. It’s not a bit.

4 hours ago, chitownsportsfan said:

It's incredible that things like this still happen. How do scouts get paid to watch a guy full time and not only miss on him as a SS, but miss on him as an elite defensive SS?

physically he doesn't look like a traditional SS. I think that's the bias.

41 minutes ago, JoeCredeYes said:

For sure, I think his well above average size for SS also just makes him look a little less clean than a typical MLB SS. Anyway, it's fun as hell to watch and he's quickly become one of my favorites on the squad.

I can see how his defense got bad attention as he was coming through the system, because nothing about what he does is traditional. But I think most mistook non-standard for bad and figured he would have to change to standard in order to be good. Well his results at the major league level speak for themselves. Dude is a top notch SS. Hell, maybe they should teach some of the guys what Colson is doing, as it seems to work.

1 hour ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I've been saying since the year started that playing Montgomery at 3rd and someone else at Short would cost the team and was not optimal.

Fast forward to a situation where that exact thing happens and you put your head in the sand and claim there was nothing that could be done and everyone is wrong.

Weird stuff!!!

Edit: And while I have some great bits, this isn't a bit. Colson should play short every day he plays like all other elite Shortstops in baseball history have done.

I'm really happy for you that you have opinions. One can complain about anything being a crisis, and if you wait long enough, something will happen. I suppose I should be flattered that you really need my validation, to the point where you seem obsessed with not getting it.

Yes, Colson is probably the better shortstop. Does it matter in the one or two games a week he plays 3B? No. Acuña is a very good shortstop, also. There is not much drop off when Acuña platoons in. Your shtick is pretending it's costing the team games, when it really isn't. I support you in fantasizing that Colson gets Jones out.