Rowand44 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Feb 20, 2006 -> 06:57 PM) Well he did sign with the Sox over Texas who offered more money, did he not? Yes, that's a real bad example. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHarris1 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Feb 20, 2006 -> 07:04 PM) When Willie comes back to the Cell, I will clap. Hell ya. Gonna be the loudest ovation...ever! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSH2005 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 (edited) Didnt Dye later say that he was offered alot more money by another team, but stayed with the Sox because he shook Kennys hand, and said he is a man of his word? That would pretty much contradict that 1) Dye is greedy, and 2) There is no loyalty in sports, would it not? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Yep, Dye was offered more money by both the Rangers and the Diamondbacks but kept his word to KW because they had a handshake deal. Edited February 21, 2006 by SSH2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soxfest Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 To bad Mags your loss was the Sox gain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KevHead0881 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Feb 20, 2006 -> 06:44 PM) He did? Granted he wasnt the problem, but the Sox were in the playoffs once when Magglio was here. If Frank, or Paul, s***, even a guy like Podsednik left like Maggs did, I would have a hard time holding a grudge just based on what they brought me in 05. Maggs didnt bring us s***. Im sorry for the harsh posts, I really just have a HUGE hatred for Magglio. You have the right to feel that way. Thats fine. I just find it hard to hold a grudge like that. Believe me, I was as unhappy as anybody with him when he left. He could have handled a lot better, and there's really no debating that. But his departure hasn't hurt us that much, and for the most part, he hasn't been badmouthing us since last offseason. He got his money and moved on. My opinion is that we should to and just bury the hatchet. If you feel that strongly about it, thats cool. I won't criticize you for it. I'm just offering my two cents here. What I will challenge you on is what Maggs did for us when he was here. The guy will go down as one of the better hitters in our history. Yes, we only made the playoffs once when he was here. But how many great players have come and gone without many postseason accomplishments for us? That shouldn't discount their overall production. I'm not a big Maggs fan myself, but to think he was anything other than a great player for us is crazy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Feb 20, 2006 -> 07:10 PM) Yep, Dye was offered more money by both the Rangers and the Diamondbacks but kept his word to KW because they had a handshake deal. Maybe, but he didn't offer the A's a reduced rate even after they paid him $32 million for 3 injury plagued years. He wanted the money, and if the team that supposedly offerred him more than the Sox did, offerred it to him BEFORE HE AGREED to sign with the Sox, he would have signed with them. He and his agent had no idea the offer or offers where coming.These guys almost always go for the money, and really, who can blame them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSH2005 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 If you hate Ordonez, I'm sure you will enjoy watching him struggle to hit over 20 homeruns for the Tigers the next few seasons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Feb 20, 2006 -> 05:44 PM) He did? Granted he wasnt the problem, but the Sox were in the playoffs once when Magglio was here. If Frank, or Paul, s***, even a guy like Podsednik left like Maggs did, I would have a hard time holding a grudge just based on what they brought me in 05. Maggs didnt bring us s***. Im sorry for the harsh posts, I really just have a HUGE hatred for Magglio. His departure helped bring the financial wherewithal to field a world championship team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SSH2005 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 (edited) Maybe, but he didn't offer the A's a reduced rate even after they paid him $32 million for 3 injury plagued years. He wanted the money, and if the team that supposedly offerred him more than the Sox did, offerred it to him BEFORE HE AGREED to sign with the Sox, he would have signed with them. He and his agent had no idea the offer or offers where coming.These guys almost always go for the money, and really, who can blame them? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> You're assuming that the A's wanted Dye back. They didn't. The A's bought out Dye's contract for $1.5 million because they had other options for their outfield (Eric Byrnes, Bobby Kielty, Mark Kotsay, Nick Swisher, and Charles Thomas). Also, the A's sure weren't going to pick up Dye's $14 million team option. Edited February 21, 2006 by SSH2005 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSGuy406 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 QUOTE(KevHead0881 @ Feb 21, 2006 -> 01:20 AM) What I will challenge you on is what Maggs did for us when he was here. The guy will go down as one of the better hitters in our history. Yes, we only made the playoffs once when he was here. But how many great players have come and gone without many postseason accomplishments for us? That shouldn't discount their overall production. I'm not a big Maggs fan myself, but to think he was anything other than a great player for us is crazy. There really should be no debate as to this part of your post. Maggs' peak years for the Sox ('01-'03) was really the best three-year offensive period since Frank Thomas ('95-'97). Really, I'm not greatly concerned about Magglio. He's obviously peaked (2002), has had knee problems (among other things) on-going for the past two seasons, and is on the wrong side of 30. It's one of the few things I can probably hang my hat on and say, "I was right". Even a healthy Magglio, back when he was asking for a contract extension, wasn't worth his asking price, which was 5/$75. Few players are, really. He wasn't an elite hitter -- a step below -- and it's not like he played defense at a particularly important position. I guess the broken clock saying applies here, though... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 Mags was a great player when he was with the Sox and one of my favorites. He was a quiet guy that lead by posting an OPS north of .900 for 4 straight seasons from 2000-2003. He got injured in 2004 and suddenly became a pariah. He rightfully had reason to argue he was not "injury prone" and demand the the market value for his services. Was he wrong to be secretive about his injury and not take a hometown discount? Not in my estimation. I won't fault a guy in a capitalist society--which is built on the "faireness" of the market--for taking what the market would give him. However, I will fault him for complaining after the fact. He took the money and ran, nobody but the most optimistic could have forcasted what the Sox did in 2005. Mags should look at his bank account and smile, not worry about what could have been. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iWiN4PreP Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 chitownsportsfan does a good job of summing my opinion up. =) I agree with him completely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevin57 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 Mags was my favorite player when he was here. That said, when he left, I was in the "don't let the door hit your ass on the way out" camp. If he had stayed here, he would have had the hearts of Sox fans. That's a commodity we do not give to a lot of our players. As it is, he'll make his $$$. From the quote in this thread, it sounds like that might not be all he covets. (Can anyone say 'World Series Ring'?) I also was interested in the comment that had Mags still been on the Sox, we wouldn't have won the WS. Hard to argue with history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I find it hard to believe that players are sitting around crying, wishing they won the WS last season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elrockinMT Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Feb 20, 2006 -> 07:59 PM) If Ordonez was still in Chicago...we wouldn't have won it. It does say something about what has become of the game as far as loyalty or just the love of it. When is enough money--- enough money? He was offered a lot by the Sox, but when you have an agent they always push for more and more. In the end the fans pay. I was always a Maggs fan, but I am not sorry he wasn't on this pennant winning team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chitownsportsfan Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I agree with your conclusion about loyalty elrockinMT, but I don't think that necessarily hurts the game. I think we've seen the evolution of the game from player based to team based. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
witesoxfan Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 QUOTE(Texsox @ Feb 20, 2006 -> 03:10 PM) I wonder if 750 players on MLB rosters were all crying in their beer this off season because they didn't become free agents and sign with the White Sox at any price? HA HA those dumb bastards Thomas will be the next one to sing the blues. He should have begged Kenny to keep him at any price. And what about Sandy Alomar? dumb ass signs with Texas! They were out of it in June. Since, of course, the Sox very much wanted both Thomas and Alomar to come back. That's the difference. The Sox offered Magglio a more than fair contract to come back, whereas they didn't bother offering contracts to Alomar, Thomas, Valentin, and perhaps others too who aren't coming to mind. That would be why Maggs is being referred to as a dumbass and Thomas and Alomar are not. If anything, Thomas is being referred to as a dumbass for b****ing after having signed with Oakland, and holding a grudge against the Sox for not showing loyalty, but at the same time being good businessmen while also being able to make the overall team better. Unless Frank were to show up to spring training hitting left handed with tons of power, thus alllowing him to hit a tailing slider for righties, his use to the Sox is very limited, as he is very similar to almost every Sox hitter in the lineup, aside from Podsednik, Thome, and Pierzynski. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YASNY Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 QUOTE(Texsox @ Feb 20, 2006 -> 09:18 PM) I find it hard to believe that players are sitting around crying, wishing they won the WS last season. In general, I agree with all the stuff you've said about loyalty in baseball. There's not much on display through the Majors, by players or teams. I don't have any problem with Magglio leaving the Sox for more money. He's only in the game for so many years and understandably wants to capitalize as much as possible. However, it's more of the way Magglio left the Sox than his leaving that causes me to have total disregard for the guy. He went from being one of my favorites to just being another Tiger. His actions basically told me he didn't want to be a White Sox player any more. He got his wish. Now he's regetting it. Tough s***, Ordonez. Deal with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmbjeff Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 this is like the girlfriend who u had dated for 3 yrs. when u first met her, she was hot, fun, a sexual predator, but after the 3 yrs,she lost it all. put on 50 pounds, was a downer and never did anything. so u dump her, cause u know/think u can do better. then a year later, u go out to a bar and u see your ex and she lost the 50 pounds, is out having a fun time, only this time, she is with another guy while your depressed and miserable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Lopez's Ghost Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 Look, don't blame Magglio. Dmitri Young assured him that the Tigers would be in the playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Milkman delivers Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 QUOTE(Al Lopez's Ghost @ Feb 21, 2006 -> 07:39 AM) Look, don't blame Magglio. Dmitri Young assured him that the Tigers would be in the playoffs. Speaking of Dmitri Young, is he even on a team right now? On his player page on ESPN.com, it still says Tigers at the top, but I'm pretty sure he was a free agent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al Lopez's Ghost Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 QUOTE(Milkman delivers @ Feb 21, 2006 -> 06:43 AM) Speaking of Dmitri Young, is he even on a team right now? On his player page on ESPN.com, it still says Tigers at the top, but I'm pretty sure he was a free agent. Congratulations Milkman. We've managed to hijack the thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 QUOTE(Jordan4life_2006 @ Feb 20, 2006 -> 07:39 PM) You would have the same hatred for Konerko if he had bolted for the Angels. And the only thing that stopped that from happening was the Sox going 5 years. And that's bulls*** to hold it against Maggs that the Sox never won a title while he was here. Just like everyone was pissed off when the Robin Ventura left for the Mets? Sox fans are not that ignorant when their players leave. They know the difference between pathological players and bottom line management moves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 QUOTE(Texsox @ Feb 20, 2006 -> 10:18 PM) I find it hard to believe that players are sitting around crying, wishing they won the WS last season. Tigers outfielder Magglio Ordonez, who says he's 100 percent healthy after a hernia kept him out the first half of last season, is hurting in another way these days. It turns out he hasn't gotten over the White Sox winning the World Series the year after Ordonez left. "I was feeling sad I wasn't there," Ordonez told the Detroit Free Press. "It's hard to see your teammates win the World Series. You spent your whole career there and left one year early. I didn't know they were going to win the World Series." Sure didn't sound happy to be home in October to me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Texsox Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 Of all the comments, I still like SS's Who? The best. Sitting around like jilted lovers, saying I hate this guy, seems so funny to me. Decisions are made all the time in baseball regarding who plays where. We should be grateful that winning a WS isn't the only criteria. If it was, imagine everyone wanting to play in NY for the MLB minimum salary. Players talk about wanting to win a WS, and for most that is true, but it doesn't dominate their entire existance. They know how uncertain anything is in sports. Outside of hardcore Sox fans, who would have predicted a Sox WS win? Did Dye make his decision on best place to win it all? Maggs is gone, long live Dye. Frank is gone, long live Thome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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