Sox Will Go Closer by Committee

[fathom]

Yes...but Billy Wagner hasn't sucked this year.

 

The only thing more frustrating than watching Jenks pitch these days is seeing posts trying to defend him. Greg, sometimes the hardest thing for a parent to do is to admit their child needs help.

[mcgrad70]

Billy Wagner blew a 2 run lead tonight.

Blown save.

 

Yeah, closers are automatic ... not.

 

 

So, perhaps there's another closer change uh?

Stuff happens.

But I don't care about Billy Wagner.

Get Soria.

 

[SoxAce]

Comparing Billy Wagner and Bobby Jenks is like comparing Michael Jordan and Craig Ehlo.

 

In other words.. they shouldn't even be in the discussion. Might as well add Mariano to the list if he happens to blow a rare save soon. (not to mention can.. you know.. get hitters out majority of the time 1-2-3) Then I can back it putting a Todd Jones stats year up.

[fathom]

Ozzie with some harsh words about Jenks' stuff. Cooper also needs to take some initiative and tell Jenks to stop throwing that sinker crap.

 

http://www.chicagobreakingsports.com/2010/...blown-save.html

[greg775]

i can just imagine what the vets were thinking when bobby f***ed them over again

 

Uh, they are veterans so I'm sure they realize that this is baseball and got in the chow line and snarfed down that good postgame food. Ballplayers eat after games and get in the chow line and eat. They don't f***ing sweat losses no matter how dismal they are.

 

Ballplayers are not like internet fans who freak the s*** out. They realize baseball is a marathon season.

 

I can't believe you guys just laugh off Wagner blowing a save. The Jenks hate slays me. Some people act like every time he's gone out there it's been like a Little Leaguer out there. Do you remember the stretch when the team was HOT as hell and he was getting save after save after save? And I shut up and not a peep out of the Jenks haters who just expect save after save.

Hilarity. The guy was excellent during our surge and he's sucked since the family emergency and to me he actually does look fatter than normal. That is up for debate.

Some people act like Quentin sits in a chair in right field and just watches everything hit out there fall and some act like Jenks has NEVER been good this year. It makes me laugh.

Edited July 22, 2010 by greg775

[bschmaranz]

How about Closer by Someone other than Bobby?

 

I like the cut of your jib

[hi8is]

Uh, they are veterans so I'm sure they realize that this is baseball and got in the chow line and snarfed down that good postgame food. Ballplayers eat after games and get in the chow line and eat. They don't f***ing sweat losses no matter how dismal they are.

 

Ballplayers are not like internet fans who freak the s*** out. They realize baseball is a marathon season.

 

I can't believe you guys just laugh off Wagner blowing a save. The Jenks hate slays me. Some people act like every time he's gone out there it's been like a Little Leaguer out there. Do you remember the stretch when the team was HOT as hell and he was getting save after save after save? And I shut up and not a peep out of the Jenks haters who just expect save after save.

Hilarity. The guy was excellent during our surge and he's sucked since the family emergency and to me he actually does look fatter than normal. That is up for debate.

Some people act like Quentin sits in a chair in right field and just watches everything hit out there fall and some act like Jenks has NEVER been good this year. It makes me laugh.

I just had two orgasims and peed.

 

( that information is just about as relevant as gregs post. )

[Lemon_44]

I agree with Greg. Jenks,in close situations,has been very good until these last 2. Every player goes through slumps and Bobby is in one because his stuff looks very average to below average right now. If he shakes it and gets his stuff back, the bullpen is again the best in the league. If he continues to struggle, the good thing is there are options. The bad thing is, with Jenks mentality, he seems like he may be useless if he's not in a closing role as evidenced by his performance in non-save situations. Let's face it, the team is at its best when Jenks is closing out games like he can and having Putz, Santos, and Thornton shuting down the game in the earlier innings.

[Dick Allen]

I agree with Greg. Jenks,in close situations,has been very good until these last 2. Every player goes through slumps and Bobby is in one because his stuff looks very average to below average right now. If he shakes it and gets his stuff back, the bullpen is again the best in the league. If he continues to struggle, the good thing is there are options. The bad thing is, with Jenks mentality, he seems like he may be useless if he's not in a closing role as evidenced by his performance in non-save situations. Let's face it, the team is at its best when Jenks is closing out games like he can and having Putz, Santos, and Thornton shuting down the game in the earlier innings.

I think you see what you want to see with this guy not the facts. Jenks has allowed seven runs on seven hits while walking two in 2 2/3 innings covering his past four outings since the All-Star break.

 

He's made a lot of outings interesting this year. He has cost the Sox 2 wins in 4 days. Only one counted as a blown save because once he was so awful they pulled him before the other team took the lead. When you have other options, better options, like Putz and Thornton, its time to let go and realize Bobby isn't nearly as good as those two and shouldn't be the guy counted on to end games in his final couple months as a White Sox.

[hogan873]

Ah, the great closer debate. Bobby sucks, no he doesn't, he sucks...

 

If you blow two save opportunities in a row, you're not doing very well. On some saves, he's looked very good for sure. But Randy Williams has looked good here and there. Bobby is not a good closer. I've said this before and I'll say it again. He was a better pitcher when he threw 98 mph fastballs and that wicked curve. His slider and sinker and other stuff that he's developed have never been as effective. He was bad his last two save opportunities, and he blew those saves. I don't need to see him again when the Sox have a 1, 2, or 3 game lead.

[Dick Allen]

Shingo was 8-9 in save opportunities when he lost his job and ultimately was DFA'd. Jenks has been pretty bad this season save for a pretty good stretch in June and part of July. He was pretty bad in 2009. Its time to move on. He cannot be trusted with the final outs. The division should be close. These 2 games may make a huge difference at the end. I know closers are perfect, but a 3 run lead in the 9th on Sunday, you don't have to be perfect and still get the save. Seattle hadn't scored a run forever before Jenks entered last night.

[beck72]

In a perfect world, Jenks would be the sox lock down closer. He hasn't been for a while, though he went through a decent stretch before the break during the sox long winning string. Yet without 1 go to guy in the 9th, it throws off the rest of the late inning guys. Ozzie and Coop like to have the bullpen in set roles and they are set up for that his year. Putz, Santos and Matt have had the 7th and 8th innings. While it might be easy to flip flop Jenks with one of those guys, the sox have always given proven vets extra leeway to work through slumps--hitting or pitching. Jenks is in a slump and want him to work it out before they have to disrupt the entire bullpen.

 

Putz and Thornton will get most of the chances to close, and go depending on match ups. If a few LHB's are up in the 8th Matt will come in and Putz will close. Or RH batters are up in the 8th, Putz will come in and Matt will have the 9th. I could see Santos in the mix as well. Yet Jenks also will get a few chances to turn it around--albeit on a very short leash, say one batter gets on and they have an option to come in the 9th after Bobby.

[lostfan]

"You guys keep saying he's a bad husband but really let's look at this objectively, he only beats his wife like once a week and the rest of the time he treats her like a queen! Every marriage has ups and downs."

[EvilJester99]

This isn't the same Bobby from 05'. Quit living in the past... the man just isn't a good closer anymore.

[lostfan]

This isn't the same Bobby from 05'. Quit living in the past... the man just isn't a good closer anymore.

Or '06. Or '07. Or '08. I defended him when he had the occasional sloppy outing then. This has been long enough to be a pattern though. Is he overall a bad pitcher? No. Is he an elite closer worth the money he'll cost if we keep him? Hell no.

[bjm676]

Are "closers by committee" ever successful? This has bad news written all over it. Stick with one guy (Putz or Thornton) and ride with it.

[beck72]

I know everyone is frustrated at Jenks. But his June was about as lights out as it gets. http://espn.go.com/mlb/players/gamelog?playerId=5910

 

He was absolutely rolling when he left the team in late June. Came back decent in July, w/ 3 of 4 scoreless to start, and had his lowest ERA of the season at the ASB. It's his last 3 of 4 games that look so horrible. Is or will Jenks be the closer of June, or of April, May and now recently? Probably somewhere in between, which is his career norms. If his stuff is good, there's hope and putting him in with someone backing him up makes sense right now. His location on both Figgins and Gutierrez hits were horrible.

 

I'd still go with Putz or Matt for a few games. But Bobby will get his chances to turn it around.

[jhonnydanks]

bobby was a better pitcher when he still drank. we don't need quitters on this team.

[hogan873]

"You guys keep saying he's a bad husband but really let's look at this objectively, he only beats his wife like once a week and the rest of the time he treats her like a queen! Every marriage has ups and downs."

I laughed when I read this, then I said, "Wait, he's right!" Obviously losing a baseball game and beating a spouse are VERY different, but your point is true. He has one job, and as good as he's been sometimes, he's been just as bad...maybe even worse. I see defenses of Bobby out there saying if he gets the three outs it doesn't matter how he does it. I disagree. A closer has to be very good at their job, and having said closer come into a game should make the manager, team, and fans feel confident that he will get the job done. Bobby has lost the confidence of his manager and the fans for sure.

[lostfan]

I laughed when I read this, then I said, "Wait, he's right!" Obviously losing a baseball game and beating a spouse are VERY different, but your point is true. He has one job, and as good as he's been sometimes, he's been just as bad...maybe even worse. I see defenses of Bobby out there saying if he gets the three outs it doesn't matter how he does it. I disagree. A closer has to be very good at their job, and having said closer come into a game should make the manager, team, and fans feel confident that he will get the job done. Bobby has lost the confidence of his manager and the fans for sure.

I know that was probably a really crass analogy to make but all my other attempts to make the same point have failed. If Bobby can get three outs occasionally that's not really very high praise on its own, it makes him the same as about 95% of other major league pitchers.

[LittleHurt05]

I know everyone is frustrated at Jenks. But his June was about as lights out as it gets. http://espn.go.com/mlb/players/gamelog?playerId=5910

 

Wow, I didn't realize how good he was in June. The problem is that's only one month out of 4. His numbers for April, May, & July are pretty awful.

[hogan873]

I know that was probably a really crass analogy to make but all my other attempts to make the same point have failed. If Bobby can get three outs occasionally that's not really very high praise on its own, it makes him the same as about 95% of other major league pitchers.

Yep. Like I said before, Randy Williams would occasionally get three outs. And Threets got 6!

Edited July 22, 2010 by pittshoganerkoff

[beck72]

Wow, I didn't realize how good he was in June. The problem is that's only one month out of 4. His numbers for April, May, & July are pretty awful.

June is pretty recent. He seemed to be ready to start the 2nd half, after coming back from his absence w/ 3 of 4 scoreless appearances in July. Like Ozzie said post game, Bobby didn't seem to have his stuff. If he can only throw lollipop breaking stuff and batting practice fastballs, he should be sitting just ahead of Linebrink in the depth chart. Yet if he can throw like he did in June, Bobby will come back as the closer. He'll get his chances to turn it around. If Bobby is fully healthy, I don't see why not.

[soxrwhite]

What's wrong with Jenks? His velocity is good. He is not throwing the curve as much but when he does it seems to be good. Keep him in the mix and if no one becomes a lock down closer then give it back to him. I hate when we lose, but the way we lost the last game in Minnesota and the last game in Seattle really hurts.

[daa84]

guys, closer by committee means its going to be putz in 1 run games, thornton in close games vs. the likes of mauer and morneau, and probably bobby in 3-4 run games (yes i know 4 run games aren't save situations)....stop freaking out that its Closer by Committee and not just putz as the closer. This is honestly the way every bullpen with this many good arms should be.