NorthSideSox72 Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Jul 26, 2012 -> 10:30 AM) Okay, you need to stop with messing up with prospects, because we gave up garbage spects (okay they have a pulse, but almost everyone thought they barely qualify as prospects), and yea we don't know the 3rd but I bet it isn't anything to special. I'll eat crow if it is, but we still got a ton amount of salary relief. The PTBNL likely falls into one of two categories: 1. 2011 draft pick not eligible for trade until August 2. The team is provided a list of prospects around some level of value, and they get to wait until end of season to choose which one. Those are the two common outcomes. In either case, it could be a good prospect the Sox will lose. But it is the #1 scenario that could be more painful, it it was a higher end draft choice. We'll find out soon. And who that PTBNL is will tell us more about the deal. As long as the PTBNL isn't, say, a top 5 pick from the 2011 draft, I'd say the Sox did pretty well with the trade. Walters and Heidenreich are not high end prospects - Walters is in the 20-30 range in the Sox system (which isn't a terribly deep one anyway), Heidenreich probably 25-35. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigruss Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Jul 26, 2012 -> 11:00 AM) The PTBNL likely falls into one of two categories: 1. 2011 draft pick not eligible for trade until August 2. The team is provided a list of prospects around some level of value, and they get to wait until end of season to choose which one. Those are the two common outcomes. In either case, it could be a good prospect the Sox will lose. But it is the #1 scenario that could be more painful, it it was a higher end draft choice. We'll find out soon. And who that PTBNL is will tell us more about the deal. As long as the PTBNL isn't, say, a top 5 pick from the 2011 draft, I'd say the Sox did pretty well with the trade. Walters and Heidenreich are not high end prospects - Walters is in the 20-30 range in the Sox system (which isn't a terribly deep one anyway), Heidenreich probably 25-35. I could see it being one of Johnson, Soptic, or Hernandez, none of which are guys that are going to kill you. Walters and Heidenreich would most likely not be in the top30 for most organizations, and that's pretty much saying they are borderline prospects and don't have much value at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted July 26, 2012 Share Posted July 26, 2012 QUOTE (bigruss22 @ Jul 26, 2012 -> 11:05 AM) I could see it being one of Johnson, Soptic, or Hernandez, none of which are guys that are going to kill you. Walters and Heidenreich would most likely not be in the top30 for most organizations, and that's pretty much saying they are borderline prospects and don't have much value at all. Johnson has a nice arm and could make it as a starter. He would be a tough loss IMO, but not the end of the end of world. The other guys I don't care much about. As long as the PTBN isn't Walker, it will turn out to be a pretty good deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChiliIrishHammock24 Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 What about Padres RHP Luke Gregerson? Local boy who is a real solid reliever, albeit he has pitched in Petco park. Arb eligible and under team control until 2015. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicago White Sox Posted July 27, 2012 Share Posted July 27, 2012 QUOTE (JoeCoolMan24 @ Jul 27, 2012 -> 03:10 AM) What about Padres RHP Luke Gregerson? Local boy who is a real solid reliever, albeit he has pitched in Petco park. Arb eligible and under team control until 2015. He'll cost way too much and we don't really need another RH reliever unless we move Reed or Jones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 My co-worker is old friends with KWs oldest son. Apparently, King Felix is in play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 11:14 AM) My co-worker is old friends with KWs oldest son. Apparently, King Felix is in play. Don't get our hopes up bro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SOXOBAMA Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 Ken Rosenthal @Ken_Rosenthal Sources say #WhiteSox’s Williams worked his tail off to get Greinke from #Brewers, trying to involve a third team. Just couldn’t find match. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 QUOTE (SOXOBAMA @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 11:18 AM) Ken Rosenthal @Ken_Rosenthal Sources say #WhiteSox’s Williams worked his tail off to get Greinke from #Brewers, trying to involve a third team. Just couldn’t find match. For the first time ever, our lack of prospects truly plagues Kenny Williams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 11:14 AM) My co-worker is old friends with KWs oldest son. Apparently, King Felix is in play. As long as Texas is still looking for a starter, I think the best the Sox can do is place in the King Felix sweepstakes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 11:20 AM) As long as Texas is still looking for a starter, I think the best the Sox can do is place in the King Felix sweepstakes. I'm actually willing to part with whatever for Felix. Quintana, Reed, Jones, Viciedo...take whatever you want Jack Z. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 11:20 AM) As long as Texas is still looking for a starter, I think the best the Sox can do is place in the King Felix sweepstakes. Unless the M's don't want to receive too much fan backlash trading him in division and seeing him for so many series per year. I dunno. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 11:26 AM) Unless the M's don't want to receive too much fan backlash trading him in division and seeing him for so many series per year. I dunno. Their last trade with Texas didn't really work out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 QUOTE (chw42 @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 11:20 AM) For the first time ever, our lack of prospects truly plagues Kenny Williams. Cabrera, Miguel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 11:27 AM) Cabrera, Miguel. I don't remember, but did we get Swisher before or after that Miggy trade? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 QUOTE (chw42 @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 11:29 AM) I don't remember, but did we get Swisher before or after that Miggy trade? After. Swisher was the consolation prize. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dick Allen Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 11:26 AM) Unless the M's don't want to receive too much fan backlash trading him in division and seeing him for so many series per year. I dunno. That's a good point, but the M's are going to suck for a few years anyway, and Felix will be a free agent in a couple of years and could sign with Texas anyway. If they are going to deal him, and when you think about it, they probably should, they have to go with the best package of prospects. KW can't come close to what Texas can throw at the M's. It is interesting that supposedly now the Rangers aren't too high on Josh Johnson. That could be gamesmanship or it could be gospel. I'd love the Sox to acquire Felix, but I don't know why they would want guys who are already on the arb clock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chw42 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 QUOTE (Jordan4life @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 11:30 AM) After. Swisher was the consolation prize. The Marlins got absolutely nothing out of that trade. Maybin is the only real Major Leaguer today in that package. Gio and Sweeney are actually productive Major Leaguers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 QUOTE (chw42 @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 11:37 AM) The Marlins got absolutely nothing out of that trade. Maybin is the only real Major Leaguer today in that package. Gio and Sweeney are actually productive Major Leaguers. Sweeney is a 4th OF. If he's starting for you anywhere, it's because there's no better option. Gio? Of course. Stud. Nobody thought (especially the white sox) that he'd be this good due to his lack of size. And I can't even remember if Gio was in the deal. Maybin and Miller were consensus blue-chippers at the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackBetsy Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 QUOTE (chw42 @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 11:29 AM) I don't remember, but did we get Swisher before or after that Miggy trade? I think the package that the A's got for Swisher (Gio 8.4 WAR, De Los Santos -0.3 WAR, and Sweeney 5.9 WAR Post-White Sox) is better than the package the Marlins got for Cabrera AND Dontrelle Willis (Andrew Miller -2.8 WAR, Badenhop 1.8 WAR, De La Cruz -0.9 WAR, Trahern 0.0 WAR, Rabelo -0.5 WAR and Maybin 6.6 WAR) Of course, at the time everybody thought Miller & Maybin would be All-Stars (Maybin actually had a pretty good season last year) so it doesn't look similar at the time. But the Sox prospects have had more major league value by a score of 14 WAR to 4.2 WAR. With hindsight, Florida would have to have taken the Sox package. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
royoung Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 QUOTE (BlackBetsy @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 12:08 PM) I think the package that the A's got for Swisher (Gio 8.4 WAR, De Los Santos -0.3 WAR, and Sweeney 5.9 WAR Post-White Sox) is better than the package the Marlins got for Cabrera AND Dontrelle Willis (Andrew Miller -2.8 WAR, Badenhop 1.8 WAR, De La Cruz -0.9 WAR, Trahern 0.0 WAR, Rabelo -0.5 WAR and Maybin 6.6 WAR) Of course, at the time everybody thought Miller & Maybin would be All-Stars (Maybin actually had a pretty good season last year) so it doesn't look similar at the time. But the Sox prospects have had more major league value by a score of 14 WAR to 4.2 WAR. With hindsight, Florida would have to have taken the Sox package. Crazy to think about the impact Cabrera would of had if he would landed with the White Sox rather then the Tigers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackBetsy Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 QUOTE (southside hitman @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 12:16 PM) Crazy to think about the impact Cabrera would of had if he would landed with the White Sox rather then the Tigers. Well, Cabrera had an offensive WAR of 6.6 in 2010 (lets assume he would have been DH or his defense vs. Paulie's defense would have been a wash) and Kotsay had an offensive WAR of -0.7 as the Sox's primary DH. Put together the delta and it's 7.3 wins. The Sox lost the division by 6 games. So, yeah, major impact. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jordan4life_2007 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 (edited) QUOTE (BlackBetsy @ Jul 28, 2012 -> 12:24 PM) Well, Cabrera had an offensive WAR of 6.6 in 2010 (lets assume he would have been DH or his defense vs. Paulie's defense would have been a wash) and Kotsay had an offensive WAR of -0.7 as the Sox's primary DH. Put together the delta and it's 7.3 wins. The Sox lost the division by 6 games. So, yeah, major impact. ok please stop (you're totally right by the way). I hate myself for even dredging that up. But I had to correct chw42. Edited July 28, 2012 by Jordan4life Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 The Nationals should trade for Joe Mauer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve9347 Posted July 28, 2012 Share Posted July 28, 2012 (edited) (My thanks to Wite for the contribution.) Edited July 28, 2012 by Steve9347 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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