Robin Ventura sacrifice bunted with the 3 hitter in the 7th inning

[greg775]

Are we in the worst era of White Sox history? Impossible for me to say, but it sure feels like it. I don't even remember the last time we made the playoffs.

The Cell is going to be a morgue this summer. Empty. You'd have to be a moron to support this offense and bullpen. If you like to go to games and stretch out and avoid crowds, go for it. Only exception. Cub series maybe. Half Cub fans at those games probably.

[GhostofDickeyKerr]

The Cell is going to be a morgue this summer. Empty. You'd have to be a moron to support this offense and bullpen. If you like to go to games and stretch out and avoid crowds, go for it. Only exception. Cub series maybe. Half Cub fans at those games probably.

 

The Cell deserves to be empty. This is the worst organization in the majors, bar none. When JR dies, I hope his family sells the franchise to Montreal.

[Y2Jimmy0]

The Cell is going to be a morgue this summer. Empty. You'd have to be a moron to support this offense and bullpen. If you like to go to games and stretch out and avoid crowds, go for it. Only exception. Cub series maybe. Half Cub fans at those games probably.

 

 

I'll still be out there a bunch. It's what I do.

[caulfield12]

And that idea of playing for one run would also have been defensible if Quintana's pitch count weren't relatively high.

 

There's just no way that Duke/Albers/Jones/Robertson were going to hold onto a one run lead or keep extending a tie game into extras with the way things have been going. You get conservative and noose gets even tighter for the hitters who have to come through.

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

Here is a better quote if he let Melky hit and he GIDP...

 

"With your most consistent hitter up there all season, you have respect his bat enough to let him hit. He's in the 3-hole for a reason, to drive in runs, and it just didn't work out this time. Baseball is a tough sport, but I you have to have faith in your 3-hitter".

 

I think we would have all respected that if the outcome was still a bad one and people had questioned the idea of not bunting.

[Panerista]

Finally I feel like we are all watching the same game. Bunting just doesn't work, especially when your best hitter bunts.

Edited May 30, 2016 by Deadpool

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

I'm of the group that believes that MLB manager affect the game's outcome less than any other coach in professional sports, and that we can't really measure how good a coach is because of it, but I am FULLY on board with Ventura being fired at this point.

 

MOSTLY because I hope it will shake up the team and change the attitude, but also because when he does make these odd choices that most managers wouldn't make (Robertson in there to allow 6 runs, Melky bunting, forcing Neil Walker to hit right-handed), they almost never work out (Walker smashed the ball to RF, but happened to be right at Eaton).

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

Finally I feel like we are all watching the same game. Bunting just doesn't work, especially when your best hitter bunts.

 

I'm not someone who says "Kill the bunt". But I think each team only has like 2 or 3 guys who should ever be bunting. Light hitting speedy players, a pitcher, or your #9 hitter, whom is theoretically your worst hitter in the line up that day. Your 3-5 hitters should NEVER f***ING BUNT, EVER.

[caulfield12]

It's actually a small miracle that Cabrera got it down effectively...

 

Imagine if he bunts into a DP? Or pops it into the air? How many sacrifice bunts has he had in his entire career?

[ChiliIrishHammock24]

It's actually a small miracle that Cabrera got it down effectively...

 

Imagine if he bunts into a DP? Or pops it into the air? How many sacrifice bunts has he had in his entire career?

 

Not sure, but someone tweeted that today was only the 4th time that a #3 hitter has had to bunt all season. I'm guessing the other 3 instances were a player pulled due to injury or something.

[SI1020]

Would love to see what half the people here can do managing. Monday morning quarterbacking is easy

I've been a baseball fan for almost 60 years and I can't remember a manager quite so inept as Robin Ventura. That is a strong statement in that I remember both Don Gutteridge and Terry Bevington. My opinion on the matter is hardly unique.

 

[Panerista]

I'm not someone who says "Kill the bunt". But I think each team only has like 2 or 3 guys who should ever be bunting. Light hitting speedy players, a pitcher, or your #9 hitter, whom is theoretically your worst hitter in the line up that day. Your 3-5 hitters should NEVER f***ING BUNT, EVER.

I can get on board with this. I can't believe a manager would bunt with a slow player having a strong season at the dish.

[caulfield12]

*Melky Cabrera then bunted both runners over. Cabrera has bunted against Robin Ventura's wishes in the past, so it might not have been called from the dugout, but it didn't work. Todd Frazier popped out and J.B. Shuck grounded out to keep the game scoreless.

 

SSS.com

 

 

Margalus is right, maybe. But we'll never know in a million years if Cabrera bunted on his own, because that would mean there's an issue with Ventura...Robin won't "out" Melky. Not sure which one is worse really, the White Sox doing things on their own because they're letting the pressure get to them and making their own strategic decisions that fly in the face of reams of statistical evidence about the best ways to manufacture big innings...or Ventura's decision-making process being flawed or outdated?

 

And yet more reason/s not to bunt. You didn't have Melky or Abreu hitting 5th. You had JB FREAKIN' SHUCK. Now all of a sudden Robin has undue confidence or misplaced loyalty because he liked having him on the team last year and Shuck came through in a few key PH situations?

Edited May 30, 2016 by caulfield12

[Lip Man 1]

Are we in the worst era of White Sox history? Impossible for me to say, but it sure feels like it. I don't even remember the last time we made the playoffs.

 

Historically based on what is happening on the field it's the worst period since 1968-1980.

 

Mark

[caulfield12]

Outside of 1977, there wasn't really a competitive team in there.

 

 

[South Side Fireworks Man]

*Melky Cabrera then bunted both runners over. Cabrera has bunted against Robin Ventura's wishes in the past, so it might not have been called from the dugout, but it didn't work. Todd Frazier popped out and J.B. Shuck grounded out to keep the game scoreless.

 

SSS.com

 

 

Margalus is right, maybe. But we'll never know in a million years if Cabrera bunted on his own, because that would mean there's an issue with Ventura...Robin won't "out" Melky. Not sure which one is worse really, the White Sox doing things on their own because they're letting the pressure get to them and making their own strategic decisions that fly in the face of reams of statistical evidence about the best ways to manufacture big innings...or Ventura's decision-making process being flawed or outdated?

 

And yet more reason/s not to bunt. You didn't have Melky or Abreu hitting 5th. You had JB FREAKIN' SHUCK. Now all of a sudden Robin has undue confidence or misplaced loyalty because he liked having him on the team last year and Shuck came through in a few key PH situations?

Melky showed bunt several times before laying down that bunt. If Robin didn't want him to bunt he could have stopped him after he showed bunt the first time. But Robin said he called for the bunt in a post game interview anyway, so it's a moot point.

[South Side Fireworks Man]

Outside of 1977, there wasn't really a competitive team in there.

1972

[justBLAZE]

I'm not someone who says "Kill the bunt". But I think each team only has like 2 or 3 guys who should ever be bunting. Light hitting speedy players, a pitcher, or your #9 hitter, whom is theoretically your worst hitter in the line up that day. Your 3-5 hitters should NEVER f***ING BUNT, EVER.

 

Kevin Youkillis comes to mind.

[SoxAce]

I wonder what DA has to say about all of this.

[kitekrazy]

My biggest gripe is not against Ventura but those who decided to hire him. This has to top everything in baseball stupidity. He didn't go through the usual steps that lead to management. He was basically set up for failure.

[Lip Man 1]

Outside of 1977, there wasn't really a competitive team in there.

 

You must be to young to remember 1972.

 

Mark

 

[BigHurt3515]

*Melky Cabrera then bunted both runners over. Cabrera has bunted against Robin Ventura's wishes in the past, so it might not have been called from the dugout, but it didn't work. Todd Frazier popped out and J.B. Shuck grounded out to keep the game scoreless.

 

SSS.com

 

 

Margalus is right, maybe. But we'll never know in a million years if Cabrera bunted on his own, because that would mean there's an issue with Ventura...Robin won't "out" Melky. Not sure which one is worse really, the White Sox doing things on their own because they're letting the pressure get to them and making their own strategic decisions that fly in the face of reams of statistical evidence about the best ways to manufacture big innings...or Ventura's decision-making process being flawed or outdated?

 

And yet more reason/s not to bunt. You didn't have Melky or Abreu hitting 5th. You had JB FREAKIN' SHUCK. Now all of a sudden Robin has undue confidence or misplaced loyalty because he liked having him on the team last year and Shuck came through in a few key PH situations?

 

Based off Robin's comments it sounds like Robin called it

[Chicago White Sox]

My biggest gripe is not against Ventura but those who decided to hire him. This has to top everything in baseball stupidity. He didn't go through the usual steps that lead to management. He was basically set up for failure.

Did we even interview a second candidate when we hired him? I'm under the impression we did not, which is an epic fail in and of itself.

[elrockinMT]

Frazier being asked about the situation takes blame on himself. Really like this guy, leader.

 

Using that rationale Ventura throws no one under the bus, supported his players and takes responsibilty. I think he is a leader

Edited May 31, 2016 by elrockinMT

[caulfield12]

You must be to young to remember 1972.

 

Mark

 

 

Yeah, my first baseball card was Topps 1979 Claudell Washington, lol. First autograph, too. Sent it off in a SASE envelope and received it back the same week.

 

I vaguely remember hearing about the South Side Hitmen. First game was ironically enough at Wrigley (Cards/Cubs) that same year, but that was one of only two times in my life attending a Cubs' game in Chicago.

 

 

Just have a general idea about Chuck Tanner, Goose Gossage, Dick Allen, Forster, Wilbur Wood...some of the bigger names of that time.

Edited May 31, 2016 by caulfield12