Balta1701 Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 13, 2018 -> 09:59 PM) Wonder what fans in Arlington and Seattle are thinking with this news...? They’re both in no man’s land. Angels probably need to shoot for WC against AL East. The Rangers won that division in 2016. They need the guys they have to play better, first and foremost. Way too many guys disappointed last year. Mazara had a ton of RBI but his numbers overall got worse last year as he got older. Odor's batting average dropped 70 points last year. The guys they needed to step forwards took steps back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleHurt05 Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jan 13, 2018 -> 06:28 PM) Pirates really are a disaster. Shouldn’t have picked a clear direction a few years ago instead of playing the middle. Their owner is just stealing millions from the people of Pittsburgh. Already a billionaire, but still no interest in winning, just making more money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GreenSox Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 13, 2018 -> 07:50 PM) This is something the White Sox are going to have to figure out at some point - what do you do when frontline talent is 2 years from free agency and not behaving like a star? Hold onto them and hope they become a frontline player and you're 1 year from free agency or take the best deal you can? Heck, that's the same scenario we have right now with Garcia. If you are actually contending, you keep the player or trade for a younger major leaguer; if you are trying to contend, but haven't been, it's a tough call (Pirates). But the Sox are in the position of not contending and they have 2 of these players...they really should trade them or extend them over the next year. (Abreu and Avi). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southsider2k5 Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 I honestly can't believe someone like the Yankees didn't out bid this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrathofhahn Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 13, 2018 -> 08:50 PM) This is something the White Sox are going to have to figure out at some point - what do you do when frontline talent is 2 years from free agency and not behaving like a star? Hold onto them and hope they become a frontline player and you're 1 year from free agency or take the best deal you can? Heck, that's the same scenario we have right now with Garcia. I think the difference for Garcia is right now we'd be selling high. The Pirates sold low on Cole. If he bounces back and has a solid season which has decent chance of happening considering his stuff and pedigree that package is absolute garbage compared to what they would have gotten at the deadline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dominikk85 Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 QUOTE (frogsplash31 @ Jan 13, 2018 -> 07:30 PM) Seems a little light, but coming off of two disappointing seasons, the Pirates were selling low anyway. The Pirates may still get two mid rotation starters and a average third baseman out of it. Not really, moran is 25 years old, he doesn't have enough power for third and at his age there is no room for development left. Feliz is a reliever and musgrove either a reliever or back end starter (longenhagen said innings eating 4 starter). There really is no upside as both musgrove and moran are old prospects. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmags Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 14, 2018 -> 12:32 PM) I honestly can't believe someone like the Yankees didn't out bid this. Yanks did reportedly offer Frazier Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Sacamano Posted January 14, 2018 Share Posted January 14, 2018 QUOTE (bmags @ Jan 14, 2018 -> 01:06 PM) Yanks did reportedly offer Frazier Only were willing to do one of Frazier and Adams. Everyone else you can think was off the table (Torres, Andujar, Sheffield, Florial). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jan 14, 2018 -> 01:30 PM) Only were willing to do one of Frazier and Adams. Everyone else you can think was off the table (Torres, Andujar, Sheffield, Florial). Cole is a solid pitcher, but clearly everyone was over estimating what his market was for the Pirates to accept that offer. With only two seasons of control remaining he was not going to warrant a huge haul. Cole is essentially a #3 starter in my eyes. Yankees would reportedly offer Frazier or Adams, not both, and most of their other top guys were off limits. This deal is great from the Astros perspective since they do not deal anything they will not miss. Musgrove has potential but is blocked in the rotation, and Moran is also blocked behind Bregman. Lets see how this shakes out before criticizing the Pirates too much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eminor3rd Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 Admittedly, Moran's bounceback/helium makes this look better than it did at first glance. In my head, Moran was a bust/post-hype sleeper, but it seems like his value has already started to climb again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 How did the Pirates not take the Frazier offer from the Yanks.. My God.. Frazier is light years ahead of anyone they got.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hi8is Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 QUOTE (cjgalloway @ Jan 15, 2018 -> 09:26 AM) How did the Pirates not take the Frazier offer from the Yanks.. My God.. Frazier is light years ahead of anyone they got.. I agree but to answer your question I believe they became "sold" on the "15 years of controllable assets" idea Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balta1701 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Jan 13, 2018 -> 08:28 PM) Pirates really are a disaster. Shouldn’t have picked a clear direction a few years ago instead of playing the middle. The Pirates have been pretty darn snakebit the last 2 seasons. They started as a 98 win team in 2015 looking like they could compete with the Cubs and Cardinals, and take a look at what happened. In 2016, McCutchen went from being an MVP caliber player to a scrub and Cole went from being a Cy Young contender to an injured scrub. Your top hitter and top pitcher fall apart and it's pretty hard for any team to keep up. On top of that, Liriano fell apart - maybe you could have seen that one coming, but the dude had an ERA of 3.26 over a 3 season stretch with Pittsburgh from 2013-2015, then suddenly dropped a 5.46 ERA on them. Yeah he's been inconsistent over his career, but he was legit for 3 straight years. In 2017, McCutchen went back to having a good but not All-Star worthy year after a weak start, but Starling Marte got his butt suspended for steroids, Jung-Ho Kang got himself a DUI in Korea that wound up making him lose his visa/miss the entire season, Cole was an average pitcher at best, and they had a couple more disappointments in guys like Meadows. Maybe you could see a couple of those coming, some of the injuries do happen, but an MVP turning into a weak hitter overnight? A guy losing his visa over a DUI arrest? Marte's suspension? If you're expecting that kinda stuff to happen to your franchise then you might as well never try. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boopa1219 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 (edited) This is an awful trade for the Pirates. It's like you're playing as the Astros in OOTP and you force the Pirates to accept a s*** trade but in real life Edited January 15, 2018 by Joshua Strong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Squirmin' for Yermin Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 QUOTE (Joshua Strong @ Jan 15, 2018 -> 02:38 PM) This is an awful trade for the Pirates. It's like you're playing as the Astros in OOTP and you force the Pirates to accept a s*** trade but in real life THIS IS EXACTLY RIGHT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveno89 Posted January 15, 2018 Share Posted January 15, 2018 QUOTE (Joshua Strong @ Jan 15, 2018 -> 02:38 PM) This is an awful trade for the Pirates. It's like you're playing as the Astros in OOTP and you force the Pirates to accept a s*** trade but in real life Quintana obviously had 3 1/2 seasons of inexpensive control remaining, but Sox really did well considering what the Pirates just accepted. Musgrove might be a reliever, Moran might be a AAAA player, Feliz could be a solid pen arm, and Martin was a guy the Astros were comfortable losing in the rule five draft last month Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWSpalehoseCWS Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jan 15, 2018 -> 04:15 PM) Quintana obviously had 3 1/2 seasons of inexpensive control remaining, but Sox really did well considering what the Pirates just accepted. Musgrove might be a reliever, Moran might be a AAAA player, Feliz could be a solid pen arm, and Martin was a guy the Astros were comfortable losing in the rule five draft last month Really paints a good picture of why Q didn't end up on the Astros. Hahn certainly looks like one of the better GM's in the game when it comes to negotiating deals. Cole, hurt or not, should have netted a better package that this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wrathofhahn Posted January 16, 2018 Share Posted January 16, 2018 QUOTE (CWSpalehoseCWS @ Jan 16, 2018 -> 12:33 AM) Really paints a good picture of why Q didn't end up on the Astros. Hahn certainly looks like one of the better GM's in the game when it comes to negotiating deals. Cole, hurt or not, should have netted a better package that this. Cease the 2nd player in the deal is better then any of the prospects they got back as a headliner. Crazy. Pitt got robbed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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