greg775

What do you guys think of the fact Rios and Viciedo drew almost the exact same number of walks? Rios had 26 walks in 605 at bats; Viciedo 28 in 505 at bats and AJP 28 in 479 at bats? I didn't realize Rios doesn't take a walk.

QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Oct 6, 2012 -> 09:30 PM) I'd change... AJ - B Thornton - B Crain - A Reed - B Floyd - C Konerko - C Santiago - B The only thing I know about coaches is that their roles are incredibly overrated. I think you are right about coaches/managers.

QUOTE (Swingandalongonetoleft @ Oct 6, 2012 -> 09:30 PM) When a front office goes out and signs a manager up for 2 or more years, and then fires him before the playoffs even begin- that makes the manager look bad, but it makes the front office look incompetent as well. In Florida's case, that was well known for years. Very true. That's what may save Ozzie's job. By firing Ozzie after one season, Loria will look really really dumb. He may have to say the Castro stuff had something to do with it to save face, but that ship may have sailed. In retrospect, he could have canned him after the Castro thing and probably not had to pay him.

Please assess grades to every player you can think of. Please remember the last 2 weeks of the season count in the grading of a player. 1B - Paulie B (phenomenal first half can't be dismissed). 2B - Becks C. SS - Lexi C 3B - Youk C; Morel F LF - Viciedo B (do you realize he had almost the identical number of walks as Rios?) CF - DeAza B RF - Rios A- C - AJP A- DH - Dunn B Danks - INC Floyd - B- Sale - A Peavy - B Quintana - B, barely avoids B- Liriano - C, barely avoids C- Thornton - D Crain - B- Reed - A Veal - A- Lilly- D Hudson - C (didn't he have two walkoff singles? Or was it just one; change to C- if just one) Wise - C (tailed off badly at end) Flowers - B- Dan Johnson - B Danks brother - C (didn't he have a massive baserunning gaffe or two)? Robin Ventura - B. Cooper - C Manto - C Also grade yourself as a poster this season Greg - A (avoided suspension; finally proved to all that he may be wacky but he is not a troll)

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Oct 6, 2012 -> 05:45 PM) There are many things that make up baseball other than tobacco chewing and cussing. Respecting your employer, your players, other teams, and trying to win are all much more highly regarded than chewing tobacco (does anyone do this anymore? I feel like Big League Chew has to be more popular) and cussing in baseball. He's a mama's boy. Didn't earn it like Ozzie. You don't get to count being a 3B Coach. Unless you're Jeff Cox, that's impossible to f*** up. And did you forget 2006? That collapse was so much f***ing worse, because the Sox should have been on their way to a dynasty. This year proved once again how difficult it is going to be for the White Sox to win another WS in our lifetimes. Robin led a massive choke job and was simply horrible down the stretch. Cooper's pitching staff was helpless late as well. I didn't see Coop figuring out any ways to get the starters to go more than five innings or the relievers not be total horses***. And Manto's offense was ridiculously bad. As bad as any of Walker's lousy stretches. A few solo home runs as the Sox lost game after game. If Ozzie had engineered this epic collapse ... look out. There would have been so much blame laid on him and Walker. Sox had a ton of veteran players who choked. And Robin was our leader much like Oz was. The collapse would have been a lot more fun. Can you imagine the things Ozzie would have said about the Royals as Chen and Guthrie beat us game after game? And during that 1-9 death march at the end? At least it would have been exciting, not this funeral-like event of the last 3 weeks. Whether colorful Ozzie or dull Robin, it is all the same. It all boils down to 'Just win, baby.' And my point is Ozzie is the only manager in modern Sox history to win when it really counted: the season AND postseason both. World Series!!!! We won one and only one and are not gonna win another anytime soon. Yes I would be in favor of bringing back Oz in some capacity as soon as possible. p.s. Look at 'professional' Ron Washington. Three straight postseasons. No parades. It ain't easy to win it all. it takes a special team and leader. Ozzie was the man in charge of our only title.

QUOTE (nitetrain8601 @ Oct 6, 2012 -> 01:11 PM) I would like to hear gregs excuses for this man: 1) Checking out before the season is officially over and admitting to only caring about himself only on a personal level. "Where's my boat? I can't wait to go to Madrid after we lose these last few games!" 2)For the darling that everyone thought Joey Cora was, apparently he's not the funnest of guys to work with. I have heard a few Sox players not having the greatest of time with him on personal training sessions as well. Either way, greg, do you think Ozzie walks away if Joey is fired? If not, what does that say about the loyalty of this man? 3)Sounds like what we have all said for the longest time now. This guy isn't professional, hasn't been professional, and doesn't help keep the pressure off the team. It moreso just keeps the spotlight on him, just like Ozzie loves to do. We were all sick of his kids, especially the one who seemingly doesn't believe in working or doing anything other than collecting allowance from his dad and spewing dumb things on twitter. Last, but not least, we all know how much Ozzie cares about money, moreso than he cares about the team or the job he's doing. Is that something we should want in a manager greg? 1.) My answer: Loria is crazy. I guess he wanted Ozzie to self mutiliate himself with words, blaming himself over and over for the season instead of being honest that he was headed to Spain. This backs my point that Loria was flat out enraged when Ozzie called out his firing of many other managers. I'm sure at this point Ozzie would love to get paid for three years of no work if Loria fires him. IMO Loria is torn right now. He doesn't want to pay Ozzie, but he sure wants him out of sight. Ozzie had the audacity to call him out like Girardi did. Bye bye. 2. No, Ozzie won't give up the money and quit if Cora gets the axe and Ozzie is invited to stay. Most people will not take the financial bullet for a buddy. They'll do it for a family member, but not a pal. I would think Ozzie might blast Loria again though if Cora is the fall guy. The Marlins seem to be interested in finding scapegoats for their record. 3. Ozzie is infatuated with the money, but so are most all baseball players. They live in a dream world. Ozzie's ego and love of the media is a problem for any owner or GM who also has a huge huge ego. He'd be better off in a place like KC with dull David Glass. He was fine in Chicago with Jerry, but the conflict was with equally ego-driven Kenny. I will say Ozzie probably needs to work on his English this offseason and be lead analyst for Fox or ESPN for a year or two. He's still a good manager and funny as s*** in interviews, but guys like Loria can't stand forking over a paycheck to a guy like Ozzie who they deem ungrateful if that is the right word. Too bad, Loria, you hired him. Now they are pointing out all these things they don't like about Ozzie. These are the same things that make him lovable when he is winning. Didn't Loria count all the 'f***s' Ozzie blurted out in that first speech to the team in spring training? Loria was laughing like everybody else. Now the Marlins' record sucks and it is 'unprofessional?' Give me a break.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Oct 5, 2012 -> 09:01 PM) Only Greg would look at a parody of a parody from a reality TV show as someone's legit opinion on something. You are truly a wonder on this board. My only hope is that in real life you are the same. I'm too dumb to understand that post, Rock. I thought that article was serious. The guy wrote that some players thought Ozzie was all voodoo-ish with his different religion.

QUOTE (SOXOBAMA @ Oct 5, 2012 -> 08:08 PM) Most Presidents lose their first debate. Reagan got his ass kicked by Mondale and yet Reagan destroyed him in the election Reagan might have had the most succinct message for those who think incumbents have the advantage in debates: "Shut up." That was what an angry Reagan yelled at David Stockman during preparations for his first 1984 debate with Mondale. Stockman, Reagan's budget director, was playing Mondale in the prep sessions, and Reagan biographer Lou Cannon reported that his attacks on Social Security left the president "shaken" and angry, provoking his outburst. Stockman and Reagan's other top aides knew that the president had been lazy in his approach to the debate and had grown soft and unprepared for his showdown with Mondale. The result, as Reagan himself acknowledged, was that Mondale clobbered the president in Louisville, Ky. Shaken by a performance that he immediately called "terrible," Reagan told reporters a few days later that he had found debating as an incumbent much more difficult than debating as a challenger. "I think the incumbent is—unless he drops a bomb on the other fellow—is going to automatically be tagged as not having done well because he didn't destroy somebody." Asked if an incumbent is always at a disadvantage, Reagan responded, "Sure, because he's under attack. I look back now at the times in debates when I wasn't the incumbent and never realized how easy it was to be on the other side." Very interesting stuff. I do sense in looking back that Obama seemed very perturbed that he had to defend himself.

QUOTE (Cali @ Oct 5, 2012 -> 09:12 PM) I like how Ozzie is now a 2 time World Series champion manager because waving his arm in a circular motion really did wonders for the 03 Marlins. I put two WS to be factually correct.

QUOTE (RockRaines @ Oct 5, 2012 -> 05:54 PM) LOL, I still cant believe Miami traded us actual players for Ozzie. AHAHAHAHAHAHAHA I imagine KW and Jerry doing a Chill-town type skit when they found this out KW: Ring JR: Yes Kw: Jerry, you cant believe what just happened JR: What KW: Remember that moron manager we were about to fire? JR: Yes KW: Well I just talked to Miami and they want him JR: Seriously? KW: Yeah, and they said they'd give us two actual players for him JR: Wow Kw: Yup KW/JR: HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA Moron manager? One with two WS rings? I don't think he's a moron. Just curious what you think of Robin. I know, Robin gets a free pass because he was a rookie manager even though he's seen about 9 million baseball games as a great player. I like Robin, but if Ozzie engineered this epic collapse, many of you would have mocked him and/or demanded his firing. Please don't deny that if this collapse woulda been run by Ozzie you'd all have wanted him on a platter.

I can't argue with trying to get Thome a ring. I love Thome. But if he can't win. DETROIT!!!! Win every game and enter next season fat and happy. Detroit needs to win it all so the Sox can win over the overconfident Tigers and pesky Royals next season.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Oct 5, 2012 -> 12:06 PM) You really need to erase your love for Ozzie and realize this is not about who makes more money, this is not a microcosm of our society, and this is a case of a failed manager who additionally called out his boss on top of failing as a manager, and will probably get fired. Your attempt to get thoughtful on the topic here is pretty funny though, in your attempt to rationalize Ozzies failings yet again. I dont know who said it, but they were right when it comes to you, "Ozzie never fails, people only fail Ozzie" At least you read my post. Thank you. QUOTE (ptatc @ Oct 5, 2012 -> 05:02 PM) You obviously have something against people with money. I didn't realize it was a crime to to have money. I also didn't realize that only stupid buffoons have money. I'm not sure what you do for a living but "telling off your boss" will get you fired in almost every profession. The fact is I am one of Ozzie's supporters. I think he is a good manager. However, his mouth and antics got him pushed out of here (after the most successful run of any manager in Sox history) and he seemed to escalate it in Miami and didn't give himself a chance to succeed. It's not Loria's fault that Ozzie acted the way he did. Loria should have known about it and not hired him if he didn't like it however. PTATC, I realize some people who have money are not buffoons. My brother is a rich tax lawyer and he is not a dick. But a lot of people like Loria are out of control, rich mama's boys. Joe Girardi told him to shut up and he wanted him fired after the game. He waited til after the season. I read that article and my god. If they want to fire Ozzie for those reasons. That is so laughable. If you reversed Miami's record this year, all that stuff that was printed would be considered AWESOME. They'd all be Ozzie being Ozzie. Reverse the record and Ozzie is satan. that is the first article I've ever read that indicated the manager was hexing the team and part of some sort of satanic religion. Geez. That would be criminal if the Marlins fire Cora just to pray Ozzie quits. But that is truly possible. But that article. Ozzie unprofessional? What is this, the world Chess association? This is baseball, baby. Tobacco chewing, cussing, BASEBALL! That article made me laugh. My god.

QUOTE (Jake @ Oct 5, 2012 -> 04:12 AM) I think he really liked DJ and wanted to continue to work with. I don't know about what happened with Wimpy, but you can tell they love each other nowadays. Stone just happens to be as big of an asshole as Hawk, but he doesn't love the White Sox like Hawk does. Easy to pick who stays. I never realized Stone was a dick, but you might have something there. Two assholes in one booth won't cut it. Remember before Stone got paired with Hawk? You'd hear about Stone being a good GM candidate and stuff like that? He has taken second fiddle to Hawk. You make an interesting point. QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Oct 5, 2012 -> 12:45 PM) Please tell me that you understand that Hawk has ZERO effect on what happens on the field. I know, but it seems a lot of Sox fans just want the franchise to be boring. No Ozzie. Check. Boring Robin. No Hawk. Check. Bring in boring Steve Physioc. Why do you guys want our team to sink so far into oblivion we finally become the Bill Melton-era White Sox where 28 home runs is something to get excited about and 100 losses? Give me Ozzie, Hawk, wimpy, et all. QUOTE (SI1020 @ Oct 5, 2012 -> 03:03 PM) I've been a long time supporter of Hawk but for me he jumped the shark this year. The cliches are too often and too predictable now. Worse, he totally lost it when the Sox collapsed in September, and is on the verge of driving out another competent co announcer. Sooner or later we'll get the pablum bland "professional" announcer some of you seem so hot for. One more thing. Let me make my cyber voice as loud as possible. Let the computers logged in shake a little bit. Len Kasper is awful. He is everything I dislike in the current generation of borrrring sports announcers. At least he'll never yell "stretch!" or "he gone!" Good points. QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Oct 5, 2012 -> 03:11 PM) People write about Hawk's ego, but isn't if all this stuff is true, the problem Stone's ego? Nice post.

How the hell can Jake as the article stated "be one of the most sought after" free agents this winter? Bye bye Jake. I do hope he goes to the NL so we don't have to face him, although I could picture Dunn hitting some bombs off Jake who throws a good number of meatballs up there per game. He's a good pitcher, but by no means dominant. And the fact he demands to stay in the game gives you some extra hacks against him in the later innings when he's done.

QUOTE (BlackBetsy @ Oct 5, 2012 -> 04:19 AM) This White Sox team was 21 games over .500 against the Twins, Mariners and Indians (33-12). They were 13 under .500 against the rest of the American League (43-56). I think the season was a mirage - they looked good when playing crappy teams (except the Royals and Red Sox) and were less than mediocre against the rest of the league (except the Yankees and Rangers for some reason). Sure, if they split with the Royals they are in a one game playoff with the Tigers...but that just means you lose to Verlander one more time. I'm sick of people talking about Sox play against various teams. The Sox stunk against the Angels and Red Sox and Orioles and of course the Royals and Tigers. The Sox beat up the Rangers and Twinks and did OK against a lot of other franchises. The Sox need to get to the point they are not so dysfunctional. I mean there's no reason they have to get swept in four-game series by a good team like the Angels or the Tigers or whomever or take four from some lousy team. Start playing less dysfunctional ball. Split against the Yankees and Red Sox or win one of three or two of three. This crazy s*** hits the White Sox ALWAYS where they win four or five in a row and lose six in a row or something. It's crazy. We need some consistency at some point. My pet peeve is people looking at the schedule and saying it's favorable. When have the Sox taken advantage of "favorable" stretches. Just play ball!!!! Just win series!!!! We're never going to be a division winner again until we start winning series and avoiding this crap.

Royals axed Kevin Seitzer today. All because of Hosmer's sucking. Hosmer had a wasted season basically. He stunk.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Oct 5, 2012 -> 03:42 AM) Rotating broadcasters in and out of the booth is complicated, it hurts the chemistry between PBP and color guy, you don't develop a rhythm as much and it's a bit confusing to viewers at home. Normally that's true. But Hawk can't work with somebody on a steady basis. He gets threatened. So he has to have revolving color men. Remember how damn happy he was to get Wimpy back? He'd be the same way I bet if DJ came back for a series. Get Hawk the scenario I presented and it'd be awesome. Big Hurt for 20 games?? Wow. Ozzie for 20? Amazing. Wimpy and/or DJ or Huff. Bring it on.

QUOTE (Cali @ Oct 4, 2012 -> 07:37 PM) So basically, what I said all season. He continued to play hurt instead of getting it taken care of early and possibly coming back to actually help the team in Septemeber he chose to "play through it" and shug his shoulders every time he swung the bat. If it was a problem, the team should have shut him down. How come last year you all blamed Ozzie for not benching Dunn and Rios and this year you blame Paulie for not shutting himself down? How come Robin or KW didn't just tell Paulie he was going to get it fixed and come back AFTER surgery?? Why is this on the player who f***ing tried to help his team like a true captain??? QUOTE (Cali @ Oct 4, 2012 -> 08:07 PM) Be honest you'd give lifetime contracts to Paulie and AJ and Buehrle no matter what age they were just because they won a Series with the Sox. Age be damned, right? And yes 36 is 100% old in the baseball world. Unless you're a roided out freak like Bonds you will start getting worse after 35 Mark should be with the Sox still. I firmly believe we'd have won the division with him. AJ deserves another 2 year deal for current production. Paulie the same thing. Two more years.

Dan Johnson did himself a favor on the last day of the season in a meaningless game. He assured himself a spot on an AAA roster again next season. If he doesn't want to get on with his life, it was a great moment for him.

QUOTE (GREEDY @ Oct 5, 2012 -> 02:25 AM) Haven't posted in awhile and felt the need to come out of retirement to say: Baseball is a big part of my life. I watch a great deal of games all across the league, and I cannot stand Hawk. For all of the previously mentioned reasons in every other previous Hawk thread, ever. BUT My three year old son LOVES him. Well, he doesn't know he loves Hawk, but he sure as hell loves: " (Insert Hawkism here)". In fact I imagine 90% of his takeaway from baseball right now is thanks to Harrelson. And I am grateful. Grateful enough to support putting up with him for another half a dozen years. I will speculate that Hawk is good for a large percentage of White Sox game TV viewers, many of whom may think they dislike Hawk but wouldn't watch as much without him; and Harreslon is definitely a positive for the very casual fan that management is surely trying to reach. Now that is one helluva post. I don't get White Sox fans. They just seem to WANT to be bored. First they want Ozzie out, colorful Ozzie. They get their wish with very very dull Robin. Now they want Hawk out. It'd serve you Hawk haters right to get the Royals' Steve Physioc. Mr. Enunciation. AWFUL. What's with this desire for dullishness???? I just don't get it. Keep Hawk. Let Ozzie be his color man 20 games since he's getting the boot in Miami; Big Hurt 20 games; DJ 20 games, Wimpy 20 games, etc. It's obvious Stoney is gone after that interview.

QUOTE (Tuna @ Oct 5, 2012 -> 01:24 AM) The hardest part of leaving that life is how boring normal life can get. When you're in the streets all night doing drugs and commiting crimes you get addicted to the adrenaline that comes with that. I have focused my time on work 6 days/60 hrs per week, family, sports (big into fantasy sports as well). It's really about occupying your time in a positive way. I don't think I'm destined to go back to that life. I think about consequences before making decisions, if I hit this drunk idiot tailgating next to me, the cop will see my record, they'll arrest me, let him go and I won't be going home to my family tonight. Looking like a p**** means nothing to me anymore. My family and my freedom is what matters. Great, tuna. You seem like a very good person.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Oct 4, 2012 -> 05:10 PM) OZZIE IS MAKING MONEY BABY AWESOME!! SO AWESOME!! You guys need to please erase your disdain for Ozzeroo a moment to hear me out. Olney's scoop proves Oz is out of a job. Ozzie is without a team (KC should hire him TOMORROW but that's a different topic). However I want to make a point about the whole issue. This whole thing is a microcosm of society. What Ozzie did a few weeks ago was anger a rich man, a man who has a bunch of yes men around him. This rich man (Loria) was called out (sort of) by Ozzie. Ozzie said something like, 'Why do they have so many managers that have been fired?' Or something like 'Why has he had so many managers?' When the rich f***, Loria, read those statements, that was it for Ozzie. This tells us a lot about Loria. By god, NOBODY in that man's life talks down to him; nobody in Loria's life can get away with calling him out publicly. Case closed. Ozzie said something about Loria and that is that. Oz was gone on that day. It just obviously INFURIATED Loria. Now the question is: Is Oz smart as a Fox? Did he do it to get 3 years salary for no work? Realizing that Loria is a buffoon and working for him is something you do not want to do? Or did Ozzie get caught being Ozzie again? If you hear the interview it is totally obvious Loria is overreacting. But Loria is acting like the spoiled rich boy he is. Wow! An underling like Ozzie called him out; bye bye. This is a lesson for all of us in real life. You call out your 'boss' and you are GONE! The difference here, Mr. Loria, is Ozzie is also rich. And he's a former spoiled ballplayer. Mr. Loria, if you want a yes man, butt kisser then you better hire somebody who needs the job. Ozzie never said anything bad about Jerry cause Jerry was like his second dad. The joke is on Ozzie and Loria both. Cause Loria is now the new Steinbrenner. He goes through another manager?? Wow. Or is Ozzie laughing all the way to the bank? Did Ozzie do this for the quick cash? I'd think probably not; he probably likes going to the ballpark every day ... but going to the park and having to talk to Loria and his yes-men including his adopted son??? I dunno, folks. Ozzie may be smarter than we all think....

QUOTE (Tuna @ Oct 4, 2012 -> 10:18 PM) I received a 6 year sentence in 1998, got out for a few months, went back in on a parole violation, was out for 6 months and then got another 5 year sentence. In those few months I got a girl pregnant. When I got out and introduced myself to my daughter for the first time, it was a game changer. I didn't care enough about myself to change, but I was able to for my daughter. The self esteem came back after a couple years. @ greg, I'll answer all of your questions tonight when I have more time. That's cool your child was a life-changer, so to speak. My latest question to you is: Do you think the fact you committed crimes (tell us what they are if u can) means that you have inner evil in yourself that will come out again in the future? Or have you truly seen the light and the rest of your life you are a kind, law-abiding citizen? Are you destined to relapse or are you fine? Forgive me for my bluntness. I just wonder if you fear there is evil in you for some reason and that evil will always try to take over your body? I personally think God can help you with that, but those are my beliefs, may not be yours. I thank you for answering all my questions.

QUOTE (MexSoxFan#1 @ Oct 4, 2012 -> 09:49 PM) I'll be watching FOX news on election night for s***s and giggles. If Republicans think last night's debate was a game changer, they'll be disappointed. Yeah the msbnc crew was horrified at Obama's performance and still was ripping on Romney, trying to "say the things Obama should have said." That Chris Matthews guy really hates the Republican party, wow.

If somebody else is willing to give AJP 18 million for 2 years, why can't it be the Sox? The team that signs him will also be well aware of his weaknesses (arm and his slumps; he can be the king of the pop up and routine grounder). Why not offer him 16-18 mill for 2 years? I mean, AJ has a horrible arm now. Why would any team offer him 12-15 million a year?? Is that actually going to happen? I'd say 18 mill for 2 years; ask him for a hometown discount of 16 mill or 17 mill for 2 years.