Chisoxfn

Grossman will probably be the #2 starter next Sunday.

QUOTE(Jordan4life_2005 @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 02:06 PM) How one sided is the Adewale Ogunleye for Marty Booker trade looking now? An elite pass rushing end for a second rate wr. Thank god for the salary cap. Booker is better than a 2nd rate WR, imo. Problem is he hasn't had any QB in Miami the past couple years. Still a very good deal for the Bears. They needed that premiere pash rusher and when healthy Ogunleye is just that. Plus Alex Brown is a mad man of late.

QUOTE(3E8 @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 01:41 PM) Well how short is your leash? Does he have to stink two games in a row, three? Any more than that and we will have a new QB going into the playoffs. There is no exact definition. If he was horrid for 2 or 3 straight weeks he'd be gone and that wouldn't give much time for Grossman, but thats life. I'm not benching him because someone else looks good in practice. Not when he's gotten better each and every week and has been a part of this offense. He's not costing this team wins, he's helping them win more than some of you think because he's doing his job. Trent Dilfer didn't need to throw for 300 yards with the Ravens, he needed to limit turnovers and try to convert the key 3rd downs when needed. He did that and went to the superbowl and won it. The Ravens d was the reason it won, but it wouldn't have won if Dilfer didn't protect the football and help move the chains just enough. I'm also not even going to speak of the insane lack of depth the Bears have at WR right now. I'm looking forward to Berrian, Berlin and Currie to get some more playing time (especially Berrian) because it would open up a little more things.

QUOTE(Jordan4life_2005 @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 01:43 PM) Alright, I'm not saying you're lying, I just know what I read and heard here in Chicago. I just think people need to let it go. The Bulls won 47 games and made the playoffs last year. We have a chance to match that and maybe even win a round this year. People need to focus on that. I wasn't commenting on it. Whats done is done. I hated dealing Artest (I loved that guy), but he ain't coming back. Chandler isn't near as bad as some of you fools say he is. I just hope he's healthy because he's a key to the improvement of this team. He's got the ability to be a DOMINANT defender.

QUOTE(Palehose13 @ Nov 26, 2005 -> 05:36 PM) What is laughable is that only one person (I believe) realizes that the $22 million coming from Philadelphia is to pay Jim Thome. I think everyone knows that.

QUOTE(timotime @ Nov 26, 2005 -> 02:51 PM) dont underestimate the clutch bloop single! Don't underestimate what Timo brings to the clubhouse. Plus he is a solid defensive player whose versatile. I knock Timo's offense as much as the next guy, but when your the 25th guy sometimes there are more important things and Timo never complains and really keeps guys lose. Plus he has gotten enough big hits to warrant him getting limited playing time. That said I don't think he'll be around this next year (but he may still be).

QUOTE(Jordan4life_2005 @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 01:36 PM) I read in multiple newspapers at the time that Brand wanted out of Chicago as soon as his rookie contract was up. The losing had become too much for him. Especially for a guy that spent his college career at Duke. I remember he was quite sad with the trade and there was some talk that even after the trade that he wanted to come back to Chicago (this was the talk out here in LA) when he became a FA. The Bulls were just never in a position to get him back and the Clips are finally good.

QUOTE(Jordan4life_2005 @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 01:32 PM) Agreed. I know we're not the 01 Rams or last years Colts. I'm just worried about when Orton actually has to go out there and make some things happen. I especially worry about this in the playoffs. Like I said. i'm praying Orton proves me wrong. The White Sox stuffed a s*** load of crow down my throat. I can definitely go for some more. The Bears aren't a whole lot different than last years Steelers. Just watch the Steelers with Big Ben last year. He wasn't asked to do much anything, the Steelers handed the heck out of the ball and played strong defense. Ben made some plays but not too many (he didn't make mistakes and was smart enough to continue to win). When Ben was asked to put the team on his back he couldn't (no rookie can). Ben has improved this year but just wait a year or two longer and than he's the type of guy that can really go out and win games for you. This year he's been hurt but he's getting closer to that point already. This years Bears have a superior defense to last years Steelers (they had a damn good one too) but the Steelers had a lot more offensive weapons last year than the Bears do this year (RB's is similar, but the WR's the Steelers had with Plaxico, Hines, Randle El was a big advantage). Sure it may bite us in the playoffs, but Orton is developing and improving each week and is doing an amazing job for a rookie. He has a strong arm and improving footwork (once it gets better and he sees more defenses and improves his route reading and familiarity, plus when the Bears WR's develop a bit more, you'll see him improve and turn into a good NFL QB). I don't see why people think he sucks. The Bears are developing a QB and winning with him and he's doing whats asked of him. Next year you'll probably see the Bears call a little more open game. You'll never see a wide-open game though, not with this defense. It would be totally foolish to do that. The defense is our strenght so your offensive play calls need to be conservative enough to make sure you give your defense rest and win the field position battle. When you do that you allow your defense to tee off on the opponents. Obviously the best thing would be long scoring drives but look at it this way, the Bears have put together some real long offensive scoring drives this year. They will put together more and the offense will continue to improve. The Bears offense looked solid enough today against the 3rd ranked defense in the league. Last week was about the best the offense had looked all season against one of the best defenses in the league (Carolina). The point is this is a team thats getting better each week and Orton is a part of this team.

QUOTE(Jordan4life_2005 @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 01:24 PM) Rex has been hit hard by the injury bug. All i'm saying that is if Rex comes out and looks really good in practice and impresses the coaching staff, you might have to put him in. But I agree with the thinking that as long as we're winning, Orton should be the guy. No, you don't. Orton has made the plays he's asked to. Now if Orton starts stinking, than fine by me. I don't expect that to happen.

QUOTE(Jordan4life_2005 @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 01:21 PM) Jason, I understand everything you're saying. The offense is extremely conservative, and it has to be. We can afford to be conservative due to the fact we have the best defense the NFL has seen since the 2000 Ravens. All I'm saying is that at some point, Orton is gonna have to go out there and win a game. Lets assume Bryant makes that fg, then the pressure goes straight to the offense. You can't be as conservative in a tie game or if you're behind. Your qb has to make some plays. I personally don't think Orton can do that. I would love to be proven wrong, but I haven't seen much to suggest he can actually go out there and "win" a game. Did Orton not make all the passes necessary two or three weeks ago when he led the Bears into field goal range to set up the game winning field goal? In fact, I think he's right around the top rated QB in the final 2 minutes of each halves. Of course he's the worse rated starter in the other 56 minutes. Point is, we aren't going to win games if were putting the ball in the arms of Orton needing score 30 points. If that happens we have failed as a team. Thats like asking the Sox to score 10 runs a game last year because we didn't have the type of offense that can do that. Your asked to win your style of games. We won't win a shootout, but thats not our style.

QUOTE(Jordan4life_2005 @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 01:04 PM) People need to get over the Brand/Chandler trade. We were terrible when we had Brand. He wanted out of Chicago the first chance he got anyway. How many times have the Clippers made the playoffs with Brand? Don't get me wrong, I like Brand. But we didn't trade Shaq, Duncan or KG. People act like Tyson has been a bum. As shown earlier, he's still in the top 10 or so in boards. Tyson will NEVER be a great offensive player. He's got horrible hands, foot work, ect. His stregnths are boards, blocked shots and defense. As long as he's doing those things, he's fine. Brand did not want out of Chicago.

QUOTE(qwerty @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 03:57 AM) Or he is one of the best big man defenders in league. Top 10-15 defender in the league and has been for years now. Especially this year. The guy is in some kind of shape.

QUOTE(Jordan4life_2005 @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 01:09 PM) All this is fine as well as long as the D continues to do it's thing. The minute Orton is asked to actually win a game for us, we're in trouble. Point is, I don't see the Bears wanting that. They are trying to protect the young QB and aren't asking him to drop back 35 times. They aren't asking him to throw 25-30 yard slants all game long. They are asking him to make good decisions on 2nd (ocassionally) and more importantly on 3rd and 5 or short. He's thrown some damn good slants and when he does drop back and throw the ball he's made good decisions and found the open guy. I saw him float Gage on the 1st drive of the game, that was about the only ball I saw floated the entire day. The more the game went on the more accurate he was and to close out the half he was very accurate and made all the good sideline throws. Point is, when he's stepping back and throwing he's making the plays and most importantly he's not making mistakes. The Bears aren't putting him in a position to throw 30 times and go for 250 or 300 yards. Thats not what this offense is trying to do and you can't say Orton sucks because they do that. Its a freaking brilliant tactic by Turner and the offense to protect him and run the ball, which rests the defense and keeps the offense very balanced. If you guys start seeing Orton drop back and drop back and drop back and just constantly make poor reads or throw the ball all over the place I'd see the case in point. But can you show me a bunch of plays each week that he missed? I don't think so. Especially these past two weeks. Why assume Grossman would do anymore, I don't see the Bears missing big plays. They don't go for many of them, but Orton is hitting his guys.

QUOTE(Tmar28 @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 01:08 PM) 108 yarder was total luck. not even funny how much luck that was. could also throw in the fumbled punt by SF. you could even say any of peterson's runs he has had in any game have been luck. against the saints, saints fumble on the bears 15. thats mostly luck, a little skill though. against panthers, their best linebacker morgan got injured, could easily say that was some big help for the bears. that missed field goal by bryant is right at the top of the list of lucky breaks the bears have gotten. Umm....the field goal wasn't luck, they did the blocking and made the return. That game wouldn't have even been close if the coniditions were normal anyway. How are Peterson's runs luck? Are you a freaking idiot? He finds holes and gets rolling. The Panthers got clocked with or without Morgan they got clocked. Great defenses make plays and when you get the pass rush the Bears do your going to force turnovers. In fact there were a few times today that the Bucs narrowly escaped Turnovers. I saw Simms float a few balls into the middle of the field and he was just lucky the Bears weren't in the right position a few times.

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 12:59 PM) Oregon is the team that plays in a lousy conference.

I don't understand all this Orton hate. When he drops back do you see him making mistakes? The Bears run a conservative offense, because of this he's not going to put up prolific pass numbers. That said I don't see Orton making poor reads and for the most part when he drops back he makes good throws. The Bears don't call an offense and its a good thing imo (since we have a rookie QB) thats ever going to put up 300 yard passing games (and if we do, its a bad sign right now because it means were playing catch-up). If I saw Orton dropping back and missing wide open guys all game I'd say something different. He made two bad decisions all game (one was an early pass to Gage that Barber damn near picked and the other was on the pump fake to Gage which should never have been thrown that was picked). He's making good decisions with the football and is throwing pretty darn accurate balls for the most part.

I remember when some of you fools were calling for the Bears to lose out and get Matt Leinart.

Awesome win. 8-3 now Thats just a huge win on the road and the defense came through once again. They looked a little tired right near the end, but they got enough of a rest to make the final stops. We did have a little luck in the missed field goal though, but thats about the 1st game this year we've won with a little help. Plus I still say we dominated the whole game.

QUOTE(danman31 @ Nov 27, 2005 -> 10:31 AM) Penn St. blows dude. They'll prove it in their BCS game. I hope its ND they match up against. I don't want an ND OSU game. Although I'll just take ND in any game, but I think they'd beat up on PSU. I think PSU and Oregon are two of the more over-rated teams in the country.

Bucs have some field position here.

Just want to say, Wade did the right job letting that bounce where it did. Damn thing hit around the 7 and somehow died.

f*** were on the 6 or so.

Well we are gonna get the ball back. Hopefully Wade holds onto it. Ogunleye would have had a sack without that holding. Nice pass rush there.

This thread will be moved into the free agent resource thread. Thats what that thread is there for

Alright defense...stay strong