Chisoxfn

QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Nov 1, 2005 -> 12:48 AM) Ichiro wants out of Seattle? http://www.insidebayarea.com/davedelgrande/ci_3164136 "DATELINE: In front of Bonds. The baseball off-season has gotten off to a very quiet start in Seattle. Too quiet. Rumor has it Ichiro has grown tired of the Mariners' losing ways and wants out, but Seattle-area reporters aren't publicizing it because they like dealing with the Japanese hitting star on a daily basis. They're hoping the All-Star changes his mind before his request for a trade becomes a demand. Believe it: The Mariners are accepting offers right now for the standout leadoff hitter, and the price is only going to go up if/when Ichiro's true feelings about wanting out become public, prompting more teams to get Bill Bavasi on the phone." If this is true would you give up Garland and Rowand for Ichiro? Then, you could have an outfield of Podsednik in left, Anderson in center, and Ichiro in right with Dye as the DH. It would be a light-hitting outfield but they would have good OBP and speed. Iguchi would have to be the #3 hitter then though. Eh, maybe it isn't a very good idea. No...I want to make one thing clear and I think this is how KW feels. The 5 man rotation is off limits (Garland, Buehrle, Garcia, Contreras, and Bmac). The Sox got here with pitching and they aren't about to give it up.

If your talking trade...Mark Texiera should top the list. Problem is the Sox sure as hell aren't going to give the Rangers the pitching they covet. I can guarantee one thing, El Duque is the only starting pitcher the Sox have on the block. Barring injuries next years rotation (99.9% sure) will be Jose, Buehrle, Garland, Freddy, Bmac

QUOTE(nitetrain8601 @ Oct 31, 2005 -> 02:48 PM) I don't know about Byrd, but I can tell you that they plan on using the other Molina as their starter. Many Angels fans have told me he's better defensively and probably just as good offensively. Plus they will be looking to trade Erstad and/pr Finley's contract. They're definately going to be making a run at PK. Hell, Manny makes 24 million or something like that and the Angels plan on making a strong run at him. Arte Moreno is the latin George Steinbrenner. He'll go after them. Oh yeah, they also have Salmon coming off the books too. Rofl, if an Angel fan told you that they are a total idiot. Jose Molina is pathetic. I'd rather have Widger over him to be honest. Molina is a poor hitter, isn't as good defensively as Bengie (still has a strong arm though) and would be an awful choice for the Angels. The Angels needs to resign Bengie, although they may not. If they don't, they better find a better stop gap than Jose (Jeff Mathis is not yet ready to take over).

QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Oct 31, 2005 -> 02:45 PM) Yep. Thank god we have the picture of health that is Frank Thomas. You won't hear me ask for either of them. The last thing I want the Sox to do is have a hole at DH like they did this year. I'll pass on a defending champ having a hole at DH when they will have the financial resources to plug it. Other holes will probably open up as the off-season/season progresses and quite frankly DH shouldn't be one of them. Find a hitter like Giles, resign Konerko, move Duque and maybe Marte and add another reliever (to replace Marte if he's moved). The only moves you'll see are potential moves on the bench with guys like Timo, Widger, Gload, etc.

Fudge...just as he was really starting to look good. Best of luck in the rehab. Oh ya and I f***ing hate turf.

QUOTE(Steff @ Oct 31, 2005 -> 11:03 AM) The value is only what someone would be willing to pay, which is likely why Scott says they don't pay attention to those figures. Ya, those numbers really don't mean much anything until the owners want to put it up for sale and sell it at a price near them.

Well my fantasy team may be losing both Daunte and Boldin. However, I just accepted a Jimmy Smith/Jerome Bettis for Matt Hasselbach deal so at least I'll have a viable fantasy qb. I have no interest in the Bus and I'm just going to cut him. I just hope if Boldin is done for the year that Fitzgerald can replace him. I even got as desperate to pick up Roy Williams hoping he'll rebound and have a good 2nd half and be able to replace Boldin. My other WR is Mushin.

QUOTE(Steff @ Oct 31, 2005 -> 12:55 PM) I think you need to lay off the pipe. Financially it can be done. Doesn't mean it would happen.

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Oct 31, 2005 -> 12:50 PM) What has Brian Giles done over the past few seasons to convince anyone that he'll suddenly drop off in production. The man has been a model of consistancy and has atleast 2 very good years left in him. A guy who can put up a 1.000 OPS is most definetly worthy of $10M a year. I think a lot of people haven't look at his stats. Well over .400 OBP, high average, tons of xtra base hits and all that in Petco park with what is a rather meager offense. Giles would put up a near 1.000 OPS if he were playing half his games at the cell. That said if the Pads offer him 3yr/30 he's gonna be staying in San Diego.

QUOTE(Steff @ Oct 31, 2005 -> 12:39 PM) Perhaps he'll want to play with a team with some recient post season success... Obviously Ozzie loves him, but I don't know if the Sox go after him with Uribe and Crede emerging the way they have. That said, the Sox could very well opt for another speed guy and creating some sort of ultra platoon situation. However, with the way Uribe played down the stretch, I just can't see the Sox spending 10 million on a shortstop thats not 6.5 million better than the guy were currently paying 3.5 million or so. If they decided to move Tadahito and have Uribe or Furcal at 2nd, than that would be a possibility. Or of course if they plan on dealing Crede/Uribe (one of them) than it opens up things. I think the Sox need to resign Konerko, sign Brian Giles, deal El Duque, potentially move Marte and maybe sign one more reliever (you can never have too many). For the most part I think they have a team thats already one of the best in the bigs (with Konerko).

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Oct 31, 2005 -> 12:24 PM) No, but he may very well get that if we do the smart thing and sign him a 3 year deal instead of risking arbitration and losing him. I agree with you. I've long been a propopent of a 3 or 4 year deal averaging near 8 million a season. Of course you do run the risk of this being a career year, but I think Garland will consistently put up similar numbers to what he did this past year.

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Oct 31, 2005 -> 10:48 AM) I'm not really sure how high the trade value is on a 33 year old reliever with a horribly bad back and who's also comming off a career year. He's also signed to an affordable deal and I don't think the Sox should move him. Both him and Politte are very affordable and are going to be keys to the success of next years club. Plus we need to be prepared for growing pains with Jenks and its great to have those extra options. In the AL a strong bullpen is almost as important as a strong rotation.

QUOTE(Wedge @ Oct 31, 2005 -> 10:45 AM) I just don't think the Angels have the finances to make a significantly better offer to Konerko than the Sox do without moving some talent on that team. If they make such a move, then I'm not sure if they're upgrading or not. They have some serious starting rotation issues that need to be resolved, since they'll potentially lose Byrd and Washburn. This line is BS. They'll be fine for the rest of their lives whether Paul gets $12 million for 4 years or $15 million for 5 years. If Paul really cares about winning, he's going to probably end up back here. The Mets and Dodgers may be willing to overpay, but I don't think either of those teams would seriously contend for another season or two, despite some of the star power on those teams (especially the Mets). If he's not back here, then he's not really serious about being a part of the White Sox. If it comes down to Anaheim, Boston and the Sox the team that has the least history of winning is the Sox. Boston looks on there way to becoming a perennial playoff team, the Angels are a perennial playoff team, and than the Sox are in a tough division and while I think they are set to go a long way (with that pitching staff) they'll have the smallest payroll of any of the 3 despite playing in the largest market. We can't get bias here. Sure we all love Chicago and I think Paulie likes it here and knows the Sox have done a lot for him, but thats not to say him leaving now and going to Anaheim or Boston would be him just running for the money, both of those teams are capable of winning it all (out of the 3 I'd probalby choose Chicago or Anaheim simply because Boston's pitching staff is in shambles, that said, Boston will spend money and may just land AJ Burnett via FA and another starter via trade). If all 3 teams offer the exact same $ figure, I think it comes down to Chicago and Anaheim (Anaheim trains in Tempe, a little closer to his home and during the season Anaheim is a lot closer to his home, don't really know how much of an effect that has). Konerko isn't stupid and he's going to be in a great position and he can and will take advantage of this situation. Lord knows if we were in the same spot we'd do the same.

QUOTE(Steff @ Oct 31, 2005 -> 12:35 PM) A bit OT.. what is Furcal's status..? FA, looking to command a contract in the neihborhood of 8-11 million and If I were to guess, he'll get something like a 4yr 40 mill deal (basically Jimmy Rollins type numbers). The Cubs are going to be hot after Furcal and Damon (don't know if they'd be willing to sign both, but the Cubs are going to make it a priority to get at least one of them).

I think Giles has to be the #1 FA target of the Sox. He's a left handed bat whose done nothing but hit and get on base his entire career. A 3 yr 24 mill deal with some incentives would be pretty fair if you ask me. His numbers could warrant bigger pay, but it doesn't seem like that many people are overly interested in him (although this is a bit premature since the FA period has yet to start). The other nice thing about Giles is that he can play all 3 outfield positions solidly and thats a nice feature.

Carl will be in a place like Tampa.

About 3 feet in the air.

SNB will be joining the mods rank as the newest mod of the Pale Hose forum. SNB (Steve) has been a loyal member of this site for a long time and has been a great poster since joining the site. SNB has always stayed clear of fights and will make an excellent mod. Anyway, please give a warm welcome to SNB

QUOTE(IITsox @ Oct 29, 2005 -> 03:25 PM) Manny in left, Rowand in right, Podsednik moves to center. For those who belive Podsednik would butcher center, his 2003 and 2004 fielding statistics show that he actually played better in center in Milwakee than in left in Chicago. Also, his fielding percentages in Milwaukee are nearly identical to Rowand's fielding percentage in 2005. Fielding % means nothing. Rowand gets to way more balls than Pods would ever get to in CF. Pods isn't anything more than an average LF (at that) and would be a poor CFer. By the way, welcome aboard

QUOTE(greasywheels121 @ Oct 29, 2005 -> 03:00 PM) 7th Heaven. With the Camdens.

Also, for those that say Damon would be a bad #3 hitter, I totally disagree. He may not hit for a lot of power, but he finds gaps and is a great hitter. I'd have no problem with him in the 3 spot. If the Sox dealt Aaron in a package for someone else, I'd have zero problem going after Damon (problem is I think the Cubs or someone else will overpay). Stick him in the 3 spot and find a way to get Manny to DH in the 4 spot and you aren't too bad. Basicall you have 3 small ballers at the top of the order (kind of like the late 90's indians who had Lofton, Vizquel and Robbie Alomar before turning over to the likes of Thome/Manny) and than you turn the order over to Manny and Jermaine Dye, AJ, etc. I just don't see the Sox making major changes this off-season. Of course it could happen. Personally I think the biggest change you could see is Manny or a bat of his caliber in as a DH and Paulie being brought back. At most you could see them bring in two bats (one to replace Paulie who left) and another to replace Thomas/Everett. Brian Giles is definately the type of guy that would be a solid fit though.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Oct 29, 2005 -> 01:25 PM) If the Sox replaced Konerko with a viable replacement -- such as Manny -- the fanbase, IMO, wouldn't be in arms. If we're going to be built around pitching and defense, why not market it? It seems pretty simple to market one of the majors best pitching prospects entering next year's rotation, under the wings of guys like Buehrle and Garland, along with diversity of guys like Pierzynski, Iguchi, and Uribe. Then again, the marketing department is what I'm worried least about. Winning Markets itself, imo.

QUOTE(Gene Honda Civic @ Oct 29, 2005 -> 01:10 PM) Which is why you offer the package I quoted earlier in the thread. Rowand, Marte, Duque. -- Rowand can easily be replaced, both offensively and defensively, by Brian Anderson. Marte is as good as gone anyway, why not use him to get Manny?. Cotts proved we don't need him. Duque is a league average pitcher, who can throw from the pen(where boston needs help) or the backend of the rotation. Those are three players who essentially are easily replacable from the White Sox perspective. You're not losing anything. Except Salary. Oh, and it's a nice chunk of change too. Rowand $3.25, Marte 2.25, and Duque 4.5+. -- $10M is a lot. If Boston doesn't want to got for it. Fine, but those three are the first 3 players to go from the current team. They are the most easily replaceable. Use them to fill your weakness (LHed bat, DH, and 1b?) through some other team. And Boston would make that deal. They'd love to have Rowand roaming in CF and he's the blue collar type player that Red Sox fans would love (they love Nixon and he's a similar type player in terms of grittiness). Mix that with Marte being able to help there pen and Duque can give them some leadership and be there 5th starter. The Red Sox aren't going to get a Chris Young type prospect unless they shell out quite a bit of cash. The Sox lose those 3 guys, get Manny and like you point out finacially we aren't adding all that much. Plus the club has opened up spots for two of its top young players (Brian Anderson and Brandon McCarthy) and they still have the financial resources to resign Konerko or opt to find a left handed 1st baseman to replace him. Than you go and add another reliever and maybe sign a swingman/4th outfielder (who can pitch in if something happens with Anderson).

QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Oct 29, 2005 -> 12:56 PM) This is why Kenny and Reinsdorf are in a hole. The average fan doesn't care about stats, they care about their fan favorites. Trust me...average fan and anyone for that matter has to know that Manny >>> Paulie. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out. You can't even compare the two. Manny is quite possibly the greatest run producer to ever play the game (he's an RBI machine).

QUOTE(redandwhite @ Oct 29, 2005 -> 12:43 PM) exactly, and it is almost inevitable that that is what they will do. good post. Mark my words...Boston will not get much for Manny. Most inside of baseball know Boston wants him gone and they are going to move him this off-season. 90% sure of that and Boston wants to move his entire contract (without eating much of it) and with that being the case they best thing they can hope for is 1 good prospect and a couple filler type prospects. Thats at least whats being talked about and rumored out here (Angels are pretty interested).