Jordan4life_2007

QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 03:28 PM) Well I'm going to have check this team out along with Atlanta and Milwaukee. OF course I get the DBs and hopefully I can go to the park before the season ends. Last season I probably watched the NL playoffs far more than the AL. I'm getting to like the NL style of play. There's a lot more strategy since there is no DH. I'm getting sick of the DH. I was listening to Stone talk about how much more difficult it is to be a successful GM in the NL. You don't have the DH to cover up your mistakes. You also have to invest in having a quality bench. I did notice that the NL teams in contention were still making moves after the deadline. Unfortunately the NL races seem set. How frustrating it must be for Atlanta having 82 wins and 9 1/2 out. Hopefully I wont forget to see them play the Phillies tonight. I thought the NL was a joke 3-4 years ago. Now I watch more NL ball than AL (not including the Sox) by a pretty good margin. The pitching inventory the NL features is pretty staggering. And the Braves really have nothing to be frustrated about. The Phillies were the heavy favorites going into the year. And with Uggla being the second worst regular in baseball through July and Jason Heward's sophomore slump, I'd say they'd have to be pretty ecstatic to be a virtual lock for the postseason. QUOTE (chw42 @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 03:42 PM) My roommate's a Phillies fan and he watches all the games (I watch it with him at times) and I am jealous of that team. They have a chance to win every game because of the rotation and while their bullpen isn't that good, it's not going to hurt their chances to win it all. Their offense after getting Pence has also been a lot better. No more pitching around Howard to get to Raul Ibanez or John Mayberry. Once they get Rollins back, that lineup will be pretty legit. They just kick it up a notch every year. They were a laughing-stock just five years ago. They're on the best run the game has seen since the late 90's Yankees teams. They got to the top and stayed there. And there's no end in sight.

QUOTE (Jenksy Cat @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 02:38 PM) Let me know where you're getting a "top 20 hitter" for Floyd or Thorton. Are you insinuating Longoria/Braun are unavailable?

QUOTE (greg775 @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 02:08 PM) Geez. It is so depressing to think we could start April with the same team. I hate reading about Dunn's assured return to normalcy as much as you guys hate me talking about how great Ozzie is. That is going to grow so old this winter. Dunn is just going to magically start hitting 30 home runs. I would rather trade a batch of guys than return with the same team if I had to choose one or the other. Don't know where that's comin' from. After this year, even the most optimistic of posters can't be looking at Dunn as anymore then a wildcard going into '12. I have no expectations for him whatsoever. Everything he's done prior to this season is meaningless. He has to prove himself all over again.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 12:40 PM) They had similar amounts of money last year and came away with Benoit. Martinez doesn't count?

QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 12:36 PM) With the money Tigers are supposed to have available to spend on someone like Jose Reyes this offseason, there's no reason they're not the heavy AL Central favorites for the next few years. Yikes, that would be really, really bad. Even at 135-140 games.

QUOTE (Cali @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 12:35 PM) Anyone else get a feeling it's gonna be the Tigers and Indians the Sox will have to battle with in the upcoming years in the central? Seems like some lean years coming for Minnesota after a pretty incredible decade long run. Mauer and Morneau look like walking (sometimes) injuries waiting to happen every game. Seems like every year they could plug anyone in from their minor league system and they'd immediately have an impact, but that's not happening this year. Of course they've had to plug in A LOT of people with all the injuries. This could very well be the case. Although I'm not close to ready to dismissing the Twins yet. Thing that really scares me about Detroit is they have quite a bit of money coming off the books after this year.

QUOTE (LittleHurt05 @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 12:29 PM) Benoit has gotten on track since his bad 1st half, & Coke has had to transition from a start to reliever. Of course, Valverde has been perfect in save opps. Benoit since the ASB: 19 G, 2-0, 11 HLDs, 2 BS, 1.83 ERA, 0.66 WHIP Coke in August: 12 IP, 8 H, 2 BB, 20 K, 0.00 ERA, 0.83 WHIP Al Al on the season: 37.2 IP, 59K, 2.15 ERA, 1.27 WHIP Didn't know what the exact stats were. But I did notice their 'pen had been trending upward. I think the Tigers have an excellent chance at beating the Yankees. Hell, the winner of game 1 could decide that series. Not so much the Red Sox, though.

QUOTE (Greg Hibbard @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 12:08 PM) Let's say we took 2/3 from Detroit over the weekend, something that people say we would have had to have done in order to be in this. They would be currently at 78-64, and the Sox would currently be at 73-67, 4 games out (3 in the loss column). Does anyone really believe that being 4 out with 3 left to play with Detroit, as hot as they are, that Detroit could be caught even if we had taken 2/3? For the record, I did believe that the division was bad enough to win with the Sox's slow start, but I also believe our pitching set us up to go deeper in the playoffs than other teams. So basically, we swept a series from the Twins last month in which you believed both teams had a legitimate shot to win the division, correct? Let's say I agree with you (I don't). What exactly does this mean for this season and next? Have the tables been turned?

QUOTE (kitekrazy @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 11:47 AM) Rochester has lost 90 games. Maybe their farm system isn't in the best shape either. W-L records in the minor leagues are totally meaningless.

QUOTE (fathom @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 11:45 AM) Matt Moore...couldn't have been more impressed with him when I've watched him pitch. Definitely the top pitching prospect. Skaggs, Teheran and Bauer are all right there as well.

QUOTE (Greg Hibbard @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 11:39 AM) Your entire argument this thread has been "we haven't beaten the Twins when it has been meaningful". This is exactly what I have attempted to respond to. In summation, I have just argued that there was a meaningful series that we not only beat Minnesota in, but we swept them, and on the road to boot. I understand this may not be meaningful to most people. It appears as though the only thing that is meaningful is clear division winner and advancement in the playoffs. Nevertheless, with the luck/lack of skill we have had against Minnesota directly, effectively ending their potential fairy-tale chance of a comeback in 2011 was pretty f***ing meaningful to me on August 5th, 6th and 7th. We obviously have different criteria for what "meaningful" is. After that 4-18 stretch, I was pretty much convinced that was it. I knew that we'd go on some type of run at some point. As this is not a 95-100 loss type of team, even with so many guys being terrible. You assumed that it would only take 83-84 wins to take the division. You never really 'believed' in the Sox. You believed that the division was bad. If that's all you have to hang your hat on, then said team is really not that good. Especially with the Sox's history of being mediocre in August/September. As for The Twins? Yeah, I'll concede that I thought they were going to go on a run. That was more of me being spooked by them. We've seen it so many times before. But realistically, they never had a shot.

For those that regularly or even semi-regularly follow the minors leagues, who's your top overall prospect in baseball right now? Has to be a guy that hasn't seen the majors yet. And no Bryce Harper. That's too easy. Mine is Jurickson Profar. Kid's tools are off the charts.

QUOTE (Greg Hibbard @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 11:22 AM) What is with the straw man responses? Yes, we made it interesting on August 5th, 6th and 7th, against a Minnesota team we had not beaten, IN Minnesota. Yes, we are done before labor day. Do you see how those two things are not mutually exclusive? Do you also see how the point of making it interesting on August 5th was that we beat the Twins when it actually counted a great deal? Because nobody really cares about beating the Twins under this year's circumstances? I mean let's say you're 100% correct. Who cares? What, have we solved the Twins now? You're forever scraping and clawing and trying to find something to be positive about. And that's fine. But don't be surprised when nobody is really feeling you. Most are not going to look back at this season and say to themselves, "Well, we're sitting at home once again this October. But hey, we've figured out the Twins!"

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 11:00 AM) 2nd place? I am still in it for first place Sure you are.

Mike Trout won the BA minor league player of the year award. I thought Lawrie should've won it. Guess Trout won out because of his age.

QUOTE (Greg Hibbard @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 10:41 AM) Of course I'm not referring to these last three games. I'm referring to the three games from August 5th-7th, when the Twins were a game and a half behind us at 8 out, many here argued they were still even in the division race. We were 6.5 out with 6 left to play with the Tigers. The Tigers had also just gone 22-22 over their preceding 44 games, which suggested to many that they weren't going to finish too many games over .500. I know the revisionists here will pretend like all of these things are irrelevent, but the fact of the matter is that we could have folded up and headed for 5th place but made it interesting and effectively ended Minnesota's season. So when does the cookie tossing start? Could've folded and headed for 5th? You're really grasping.

QUOTE (Greg Hibbard @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 09:09 AM) That we beat them in meaningful games this season, which you seem to have disputed. Were those games meaningful at the time they were played or not? Well you can't possibly be referring to these last three games. The 5-1 record against them last month? Again, from a technical aspect, they meant something to us. As we were still 'in it'. It meant nothing to them. Seems like you're trying to say us beating them now when they're down is the same as them sending us home in '02, '03, '04, '06, and last year. It just isn't. But if you can find some type of joy in beating this thrift shop version of the Twins, while at the same time finishing a distant second to the Tigers, then by all means.

QUOTE (BigSqwert @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 09:01 AM) At the expense of having a clubhouse in disarray? I'd pass. I'd put up with it for a year if they meant getting rid of Rios.

QUOTE (Greg Hibbard @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 08:52 AM) Also, I think if you're saying it didn't matter that we went up and swept them when we were 6.5 out with 6 left to play against detroit on August 5th-7th, you're lying to yourself (Minnesota was 8 out of first entering that series) What are you trying to prove, exactly?

Zambrano in the AL would be Fausto Carmona bad. His stuff has deteriorated considerably.

And this also proves that overpaying in years/money for 'proven' free agents come with just about as much risk as prospects do. I'm still laughing at the Jason Bay signing. That had 'DON'T DO IT!!!' highlighted in permanent red ink the minute he became a FA.

QUOTE (Greg Hibbard @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 08:31 AM) In other words, the Sox going 11-7 against the 2005 83-79 Twins after they had won 3 division titles in a row - that meant absolutely nothing. If the Sox go 6-12 against that Twins team, Cleveland might win the division. Well by that measure, sure, it was definitely beneficial to win the season series against them. But when it's come down to the Twins/Sox for the Central division title, only in '08 have we overcome them.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 07:56 AM) They have the 6th best offense in the NL on the season but 3rd best in August. There ya go.

CERA is pretty much worthless on it's own.

QUOTE (Greg Hibbard @ Sep 7, 2011 -> 08:16 AM) Just so I'm clear... in 2012 if we lose to the Twins it's the absolute end of the world, because they are so bad. However, if we beat the Twins, it does not matter or count, because they are so bad. Is this essentially correct? Yes. Beating the Twins when neither team is in contention is worthless. Other then game #163, we've never beaten them when it actually meant something.