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I guess I'm flat out wrong then according to you. Just because you think he wasn't pitching bad doesn't mean he wasn't. 4 hitters 2 hits . That's a .500 opposition batting average. That's bad. He also hung one pitch and missed his spots a couple times. He knew the plan going in. He knew he could be pulled early. That's just how it works in a do or die game. Should he have stayed in and given up a 3 run HR just to convince you he was pitching bad. Did his previous 2 starts not convince you that maybe the short leash was warranted ? The plan was to get some innings from him but scoreless innings hopefully or at the very least a scoreless 1st inning.. He didn't help himself by giving up 2 hits in 4 batters. How did this hurt the SOx more than the Crochet injury ? Do Heuer or Foster do any better ? You tell me who should ve started and how it would ve been better ? What's that ? You can't ? Why not ? Oh yea you're just a fan without a crystal ball that sees how things would've gone in an alternate universe 2nd guessing a decision that led to the Sox having a 72.4% win probability after Laureano struck out in the bottom of the 4th.

You are correct. Preaching to the choir Monsignor.

Hey I gave you credit in my recent post of the pitching and game plan analysis for alerting me in the game thread that LaStella had a bit of a history for getting Catchers Interference calls. Since it was during the game I wasn't prepared to look it up then and see what you were talking about. I don't think anyone said anything at the time in the game thread asking what you meant. So kudos for that tip.

You saying probably in the 1st paragraph means it's conjecture not fact. Why was that move foolhardy ? I'd like to hear your explanation before I respond. Maybe you are a baseball savant and I won't be able to refute your logic .

You really think that was the case and the forearm tightness reports we got were bogus ? Do you really think Crochet pitching a few MPH less wouldn't have been discussed beforehand ?

If he wasn't hurt then why did we get an in game report saying he had a forearm strain ? Have you seen reports that refute the reports we got ? You don't risk a kids future just because you are in a playoff game. The kids a gamer. He pitched in the past with a broken jaw. The Sox had seen Kopechs velocity drop and he ended up needing TJ surgery.

Look everybody has their way in their head as to who should have pitched when. There is no going back to see if your way would ve been better. I can tell by how it unfolded what the game plan was so here goes. Open with Dunning. Get a quick feel for how he's commanding his pitches. Can he get their lefties out ? The 1st 5 hitters should tell you this since 3 of them were lefties. Dunning did not pass the test however he did serve a purpose since he's righty. All the Lefties in Oaklands lineup would now have to face the Sox best lefty relievers for as long as they could go. Enter Crochet . The plan was now that Oakland doesn't hit lefties as well as righties was to make them face lefties as long as possible and leave Crochet in as long as he could go. That's probably 2 inning maybe a little longer . Unfortunately he got hurt . SO you still want them to face a lefty for another 2 innings. That meant either Bummer Fry or Rodon. They chose Bummer because he is their best lefty by far. The plan was working but the injury to Crochet changed things drastically. He could only go 2 batters ,both K's, 1 to finish the 1st inning and 1 to start the 2nd. Enter Bummer. It's only the 2nd inning and there's only 1 out and the Sox are on their 3rd pitcher. Can Bummer go 2 innings ? After getting 2 ground outs to finish the 2nd he starts the 3rd with a walk, a K ,and a single and appears to be tired. Well things are unraveling a bit. Your 2 best lefties can only give you 1.2 innings so its bring in Rodon or Fry with 2 men on or go to your most reliable RH's now. RR chooses RH Heuer. Sound decision Enter Heuer . Pinder PH for Lamb and singles. Bases loaded 1 out but Heuer works his way out of it with a popup and a K. That worked out well but pretty stressful work for Heuer. Bottom of the 4th Heuer starts with a GO, BB, K ,2 outs ,1 on. Maybe Heuer can give you those good 2 innings we need ? We're still trying to make up innings from the Crochet injury. Nope. Sean Murphy hits a HR cutting the lead to 3-2. Heuer is out. Enter Rodon. Still looking for the 3rd out. Just get 1 out Rodon . Bases are empty 2 outs. Nope. Walk , double, IBB . Well that IBB was interesting. Load the bases or have Rodon actually face another hitter. 3 batter rule. Hard call. Wasn't a wrong call , bad results followed but who thinks Foster is going to walk 2 runs in ? A single accomplishes the same thing , a double clears the bases and a HR would've sucked so yes it was bad to give up the lead but could've ended worse . Rodon's outing was terrible. His playoff ERA is infinity ( no lie). Enter Matt Foster. Surely the usually reliable Foster is more likely to get the out than Rodon against the RH Canha. Nope. Walks in the tying run. Then walks the LH Olson and A's lead 4-3. 3 pitchers, 6 batters 1 HR, 4 walks , and no one could get the last out,. Foster finally gets a Fly out to end that disaster of an inning. End of the 4th inning. Sox have used 6 pitchers , walked 6 guys, gave away the lead and they still haven't made up for the Crochet injury. The offense ties the game with a clutch 2 out hit from Mazara after a single and SB from Moncada. That's the 2nd hit and 2nd RBI for Mazara. Enter Marshall for the bottom of the 5th. Starts by getting 2 outs, a lineout and swinging K. Then a walk. Now La Stella is up . On an 0-1 count LaStella swings and misses a pitch. Wait what's this Catchers interference and we all start getting angry at Grandal. But wait ,whats this I find later thanks to a helpful hint from Fathom in the game thread ? LaStella actually has had more than his fair share of Catchers Interference calls. In June 2018 a tweet from Jesse Rogers says LaStella has reached base 6 times through catchers interference. How many he's had since then I don't know but he must stand as far back in the box as the ump allows so maybe Grandal isn't totally at fault here. Is this something that showed up in pregame reports ? Still seems pretty random but it's sort of a trend when 1 guy gets that many. So 2 on ,still 2 outs. Another walk now bases loaded without the benefit of a hit. Pinder singles in 2 . Another failure to close out the inning. Canha lines out to RF to end the inning. 2 runs, 1 ER, 1 hit ,2 walks, an error. In the 4th and 5th the A's score 6 runs on a total of 3 hits ,7 walks, a catchers interference. Marshall pitches the 6th inning with no runs. We finally get 2 innings from a guy but he ends up the Loser . Not the kind of 2 innings you wanted. While you get 1 scoreless inning apiece from Cordero and Colome . The Sox mount some rallies but could never get any key hits when they were behind in the 7th-9th. Season over. I did this as a learning tool so some could understand the thought processes behind some of the pitching moves. You can all question the thought process or be angry with the results but I don't see anything glaringly bad in how the pen was handled. Turns out it was just a bunch of strange stuff happening to our young pitchers. Whether that was a combination of youth in pressure situations along with the House of Horrors we all have come to expect who knows ? Lots of walks 2 key injuries a catchers interference and no clutch hitting or pitching and actually lucky we only lost by 2. Players didn't perform . Sox normally don't do a lot of BP games and certainly not in the playoffs . In the bottom of the 4th when Laureano K'd the Sox win probability was 72.4 % so I don't really have to question a lot of BP decisions until after that. The plan was working until the injury to Crochet . That's just a fact and it altered the plan significantly.

I'm just calling it Post Traumatic Tatis Syndrome.

I don't think you can ever blame the GM on moves not made. That falls mostly on Jerry's budget. For moves he did make sure.

To use her own words she should be thrilled if Rodon can become an "elite reliever". That would mean his endless string of injuries is over and he can make some money instead of ending up being some minor league contract addition when she realizes that nobody is going to take a chance on him starting with that injury history for more than petty cash. Yes by all means stick by your husband and aim high but don't be surprised if it doesn't happen.

I think if you get Bauer he is a big fish like Wheeler would've been or the guys we didnt go after like Cole and Strasburg ( dodged a bullet there) were. If we land him the 2nd pitcher probably could be a Quintana or Stroman and not many would be upset .

Ha you changed it to 2/80 after thinking that 2/$70M wasn't enough ?

He just didnt look as dominant as he usually did. Someone did have to step up and maybe he was the least likely between the 3 guys I mentioned to go 2 innings but he did look tired when they removed him. Just another guy who got added late to the roster because of injury and maybe expected too much from him to find a groove.

I might've wanted Miley but I think that was near the end of the off season when he was still unsigned . He did sign late didnt he ? Late as in February ? Same with Gio ? I also remember talking up Bumgarner so I'm never ashamed to say I was wrong . But I can't remember if there was someone else I really liked.

but but Covid , huge losses of revenue, looming players strike yada yada etc etc. wouldn't take our performance clause. It's always something.

Gio was not my idea of someone that qualified as another starting pitcher . I forget who i wanted ( really I did) Time for old threads revival but we had so many in the for season could be difficult to find the one where i was always told it wasn't necessary or the Sox wouldn't pay for it. Sucks that Wheeler chose not to sign with us . He had a great year .

Ive been using that young pitchers take time argument forever and wanted 2 pitchers in the the off season last year and was constantly shot down here. Everyone thought the shiny new toys could just step right in and contribute just as most wanted to keep the same toys at the trade deadline during the season. SO yea we all saw what happens with young pitchers against the A's.

Ive been using that young pitchers take time argument forever and wanted 2 pitchers in the the off season last year and was constantly shot down here.

Exactly how I see it playing out.

Well lemme see. I thought the Mazara signing was worth a shot and stuck up for him as a guy who if he puts up his usual numbers against LHP we are in great shape and if he breaks out even better. Then I stuck up for him during the season thinking he had Covid , got a late start,maybe was having problems trying a more lift and pull approach . I finally gave up when Leury was reinstated thinking Mazara had all season to figure things out and looking at his final numbers was more like Tilson and Delmonicos 2019 numbers. Ha wrong again. Leury was just too rusty and Mazara finally came to life. When he came to life the the rest of the team died except Robert and Grandal but the clutch hitting went down south. Last off season I didn't like the EE signing thinking with Abreu, McCann ,and Grandal plus possibly giving Collins and Mercedes a shot wasn't bad. But I understood the move to add a more trusted bat instead of going with untested bats . Srt of sucks Mercedes never really got a shot but that would've been very hard to accomplish except for when the Sox used Castillo and AJ Reed way too much. I was more than happy with the Grandal and Keuchel signing but like everyone else kinda bummed that we didn't land Wheeler or a better option other than Gio Gonzalez but I kept being told we didnt need another starter or the Sox wouldn't put up the money for it. Yes I wanted to contend in 2020 and not just be happy with making the playoffs. In keeping with that theme I wanted us to add Lance Lynn at the trade deadline. Wasn't to be .Tx.probably was asking too much but I thought for sure we would add at least another BP arm since Bummer was out. Also didn't happen but we kept the prospective minor leaguers who everyone didnt want to trade and turn into another Tatis, Semien, etc trade. Post Traumatic Tatis Syndrome. Management did manage to extend some key guys and that's always good. But Moncada getting sick screwed his season and our LH depth once Mazara also turned into a pumpkin. But we did also manage to get Yolmer back which at the same time left Mendick the odd man out . Sanchez played fine so nothing much there to scream about. We needed another BP arm and was fine with the Cishek signing. Oops props to anyone who saw that implosion coming. Madrigal was the lightning rod around here. He hit really well and looked terrible at things most of us took for granted that we thought he was already good at. I never advocated Vaughn being used this year. This coming off season ? Wow like so many others Bauer looks like the prize but I have no idea whats going to happen next season. If they are letting a certain amount of fans in for this years ALCS and World Series and not sure what that can lead to next year. I have no idea what Jerry's going to let Hahn spend. I'm leaning towards not a lot since they couldn't accomplish it at the trade deadline nor did they really open up the pocket book to make this season better from the start. I'm leaning towards non-tendering Rodon and Mazara and trading for Mike Yastrezmski but SF seems to always want to contend so doubtful he's attainable. Never liked the idea of Pederson . My 1st idea last off season was Corey Dickerson and thought Brett Gardner was an OK idea . Plus if the Sox make a trade and give up young talent I'll always wonder why they just didn't do it at this years trade deadline to make 2020 better and 2021 at the same time. Looks like Bauer is the clear choice but might end up Quintana which in my eyes would be typical of not finishing off what you started.

Wasn't a panic move . You keep ignoring the fact he wasn't reliable his last few starts and the facts that the normally reliable guys are the ones who gave up the lead except for Rodon who just wasn't ready to come back and contribute. Lots of youth , lots of rust ,lot of injuries , no clutch hitting, no clutch pitching, and still hung in there. I just can't blame RR when the players failed so much more . Dunning was also 1 pitch away from putting us behind by 3 runs if you want to talk about possible what ifs.

It wasn't knee jerk It was planned. Give Dunning a look and see how he pitches. Maybe just maybe he gives you 2-3 innings I was hoping for 3 or 4 and I said so before the game. If he hangs too many gave up a walk and hit or a couple of hits he was going to be out of there and that's just what he did. I'm still amazed Heuer Bummer and Foster could all just die on the vine the way they did. Someone had to step up and no one did . Zero zilch nada (and the one who might have gets hurt) ,not the pitchers with the lead or the hitters throughout the game.

Maybe but I'm sure Crochet didn't feel that way about it. I don't think he will ever say he was overused and he never really got a chance to be overused in that game because of the injury. He pitched 6 innings in the regular season and none in the 1st 2 games of the series.I can't say he was overworked. They made sure he was well rested for the 3rd game.

Dunning just wasn't the guy you hang your hat on. Tell me you thought Heuer , Bummer and Foster looked any better when we were up 3-0 . Fathom didn't like opening with Dunning because there were 6 other guys he thought should start ahead of him. I though the 1st 3 lefty hitters would let you know how Dunning was doing . RR didn't wait for the 3rd lefty to face him. You're arguing that Dunning wasn't given enough rope to hang himself and put us behind in the 1st inning . Sure maybe he gets out of it but that doesn't change the fact that it was our normally reliable guys who didn't get the job done. You can't even put Dunning in that normally reliable category.

There's some of it video clips in the thread before you posted .