southsider2k5

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 28, 2017 -> 02:31 PM) Yes, it's more in the lines of, if you pay his entire salary, and we give you back basically nothing we may have some interest in acquiring him. At this point, someone has to pitch. Unless you are getting someone with a plus tool, and not your typical 25 year old in high A stinking up the joint, you might as well let him get killed for you. Did I miss someone expecting a big return for Holland?

Another interesting piece of this, and almost more important is that TV ratings are down around 15% for this season. http://www.chicagobusiness.com/article/201...pointing-season

Melky is in the starting line up again today with three days to go until the deadline.

The fun part will be that a guy like Jay Cutler couldn't find a job either, so it isn't just him.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 28, 2017 -> 11:08 AM) Typical SS2k5 response. Doesn't add a thing to the discussion just a jab at a poster who has a legitimate point. I wouldn't really call it legitimate, just more of the same. This isn't an either/or. I think even you know that. The coaching/experience are more important than the actual results of the games at this point. They are going to take their lumps, whether it is now or 2020.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jul 28, 2017 -> 10:46 AM) Rookie pitchers sometimes struggle? Forget it, he's rolling.

MLB‏Verified account @MLB 16m16 minutes ago .@RedSox LHP David Price headed to DL with arm soreness, @IanMBrowne reports. http://atmlb.com/2tPiZFg Club hasn’t confirmed Buster Olney‏Verified account @Buster_ESPN 23m23 minutes ago Because of discomfort similar to what he experienced in spring training, David Price had an MRI on his elbow... http://www.espn.com/espn/now?nowId=21-0682603365158361163-4 …

670 The Score‏Verified account @670TheScore 14m14 minutes ago #Blackhawks sign 23-year-old goalie Collin Delia to a 2-year deal http://cbsloc.al/2vQ88IE

Chris Cotillo‏Verified account @ChrisCotillo 5m5 minutes ago Source confirms: Mariners trade Steve Cishek to Rays for Erasmo Ramirez. @Feinsand and @jonmorosi on it.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jul 28, 2017 -> 09:39 AM) How many guys do we have that need to be added to the 40-man by the cutoff date? Tilson is one for sure since he is currently off the 40-man. Putnam as well. With is arb status, it wouldn't shock me if Putnam is a non-tender for 2018. Not sure on who needs to be added still, but I get the feeling there will be plenty of room. Melky, Holland, Pelfrey and MiGo are all gone at some point, at a minimum. We could still find deals on others.

QUOTE (flavum @ Jul 28, 2017 -> 07:56 AM) Yes, and yes. If the Sox 40-man is at 37 the morning of the Rule 5, they can take as many as three. The Sox have a few guys who are FA's a the end of the season too, if they don't trade them first.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Jul 27, 2017 -> 08:04 PM) I mentioned one prospect below aa in that whole post so ya, lower minors indeed. Whatever, this argument isn't going anywhere. You can call me prospect drunk all you want because I think there's more than a 0 percent chance they're good in 2019 and I'll continue to think you've hated this whole thing from the beginning and are just going to keep rolling with that. So lets hear it then. HOw many games do the Sox win in 19 and what are their playoff odds?

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Jul 27, 2017 -> 06:33 PM) The rotation at least on paper is going to consist of: Rodon, Kopech, Rey, Gio, Adams/Guerrero/Stephens/whoever all of which will most likely spend sometime in the bigs in 2018. That's 3 of our top 10 prospects just right there. And of course all these guys have giant ?'s that's how this is going to be, nobody is arguing that. That doesn't mean Moncada can't be a superstar by then or Anderson got his s*** together or one of Gillaspie, Cordell or Delmonico have become solid major leaguers. Maybe Leury and Avi are for real. They don't need 9 superstars by then. I'm honestly not even going to speculate on the bullpen yet. There's a lot of our minor league pitchers that might be in there at that point and if anything the Sox have proven they can take some random ass guys and make them good relievers. And I couldn't disagree more about free agency. They're going to be players in the 2019 field, I'm not saying they're going to bring in Manny or Bryce but they're going to start dipping their feet in the pool to bring in some guys who can be part of the long term plan. If they see the arrow starting to go way up on Rey and Gio and Moncada and Kopech by the end of '18 and think Eloy is going to be ready at the beginning of '19 they're going to start filling in some holes to make that team competitive. It's not ridiculous that you don't see this stuff happening, it's ridiculous that you keep running around telling everyone there's absolutely 0 chance they could be a contender in 2019. I'm certainly not betting on it but that rotation has a chance to be phenomenal and who the hell knows what can happen if that is indeed the case. That takes a lot of ifs. A ton of them. Way too many to have any real chance at happening. Prospects take time. Especially ones who are in the bottom levels of the minors. I think a lot of people are prospect drunk right now.

QUOTE (bjm676 @ Jul 27, 2017 -> 04:47 PM) Saw McCartney last night in Tinley Park. Probably the best concert I've ever been to. Lots of Beatles and Wings songs. Played 39 songs in about 3 hours. Not bad for a 75 year old. Saw him about 10 years ago and thought the same thing then.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Jul 27, 2017 -> 05:10 PM) There's plenty of "real talent" that are going to be making their debuts between now and the end of 2018. Our rotation is going to be stacked with "real talent" who debuted before 2019. The offense is going to be slower paced but there's a chance that you at least go into that season with Moncada, Anderson, Abreu and Avi as a starting block and a s*** ton of money to spend. Like I said, I'm not expecting 2019 to be the year but the pitching staff has a chance to be incredible so you just never know. Well you do I guess. There is not "plenty" of real talent that will be here early. There isn't even close to enough early talent to replace the talent we have lost over the last year, let alone enough to overcome the 10 extra games that this team was missing the playoffs by. They will also not be spending s***ton of money until the team after the team is actually competitive. I mean out of the four base players you listed for now, 3 of them have fairly significant questions marks associated with them. Abreu is literally the only guy in our line up that can be called anything close to a known quantity. Tim Anderson has regressed significantly. It is the personal problems off of the field, or did the league figure him out? Avi put up 3 incredible months so far, but is that really him? Moncada is another who could well be taking his lumps for a period of years. The rest of the roster early on is going to be guys that if everything goes right are 45's and 50's. Past that? The starting rotation is going to be weighted by Shields and a bunch of unknowns. The bullpen is going to be a horror movie hodgepodge of reclamations, the inexperienced, and rookies. Literally everything has to go right for this team to be able to win 90 to 95 games in 2019. You are absolutely right that I don't see that happening. Looking at the rebuilds around baseball that have happened already, I don't see that as crazy.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Jul 27, 2017 -> 04:49 PM) I've said 8 billion times that I don't expect them to make the playoffs in 2019 and I think 2020 is the most realistic timeline. That said, there's going to be a boatload of talent on that 2019 team and some with at least some service time underneath their belts and to say they have absolutely 0 shot to make the playoffs is just wrong. It'd be a year ahead of time for sure but things like that happen too. Most of the real talent will be making its major league debuts in 2019 and 2020. Giving them a couple of years is optimistic already.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Jul 27, 2017 -> 04:20 PM) It's absolutely untrue but good luck getting him to admit that. What odds would you like on the Sox having a playoff team before 2020, and how much would you like to put down? 5:1?

CSN Chicago‏Verified account @CSNChicago 16m16 minutes ago Shunning hypotheticals, #Bears aren’t setting a timetable for Pernell McPhee: http://bit.ly/2v2jjAo

Jon Morosi‏Verified account @jonmorosi 8m8 minutes ago Sources: Multiple teams continue to show interest in #Tigers catcher Alex Avila; #Cubs and #Rockies are among them. @MLB @MLBNetwork

Bruce Levine‏ @MLBBruceLevine 50m50 minutes ago Told Cubs and Tigers having difficulty matching up talent back for Verlander. No traction on this right now. Not totally dead.

QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Jul 27, 2017 -> 03:16 PM) I'd be shocked if we see Kopech before 2019. Kopech is about to hit 100 IP in a season for the first time.. in his life. He is also still walking 5 guys per 9 innings. While there is a lot to be excited about with him, he is still under construction at this point. Let's get him to stop walking guys and start pitching into the 7th inning more regularly, and get him up to around 150 IP in a season before we start talking about him in Chicago.

QUOTE (Superstar Lamar @ Jul 27, 2017 -> 01:58 PM) If trading with the Dodgers, what about one of their catchers? They have some redundancy there and while Will Smith was a high draft pick a couple of years ago, he's already been surpassed in rankings. Why would the Dodgers want Melky? I am not seeing the fit.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jul 27, 2017 -> 01:51 PM) Gonzalez may have some suitors but no significant return. Who would want Holland and Pelfrey on the mound for them in a pennant race? I don't think they want to trade Abreu, so really Melky and Gonzalez, and Melky may be an August guy are the 2 left to move. Then this winter will be incredibly dull. Everyone will be in their best shape and look better than ever on the field for spring training. Then the season will commence, as will the long losing streaks. The draft will occur. Everyone will declare Hostetler a genius. Then more losing, maybe a couple of call ups in August and September for some hope, then offseason 2018-2019 which will be either extremely interesting or extremely dull, depending on the development. We will get the next Colton Turner for him.

QUOTE (beautox @ Jul 27, 2017 -> 01:55 PM) strangers things have happened, but i put the odds of that happening at less than 5%. Here is what we're likely looking at for the opening day 25 man roster. DH -Abreu C - Narvaez* 1B - Gillespie# 2B - Moncada# SS - Anderson 3B - Davidson LF - Cordell CF - Leury# RF - Engel SP - Shields SP - Rodon* SP - Giolito SP - Santiago* / Tillman - FA SP - Lopez CL - Petricka SU - FA / Rule V SU - FA MR - Goldberg MR - Danish LO - Bummer* LR - Holmberg* or Rule V C - Smith UT - Hanson# CI - Delmonico* OF - Tilson* no amount of squinting gets you close to .500 for the year. Maybe post deadline they play around .500 with other promotions and give the appearance of being a dark horse for '19 but thats how I'm seeing them. The bullpen provided they can stay healthy should be better than what we're going to run with after the deadline in Petricka, Putnam and Jones. But Giolito, Lopez and Rodon are going to go through growing pains, and hopefully whomever they sign to bridge to the next wave of starters can be moved for something and shields can ride off in the sunset after '18. This is a 65 win team at best in 2018 if there isn't a lot of bad luck.

QUOTE (Buehrlesque @ Jul 27, 2017 -> 01:45 PM) I think the tide is going to turn significantly faster than you do. But in any event, there is simply no defending the statement "this team has no chance at competing until next decade." That is categorically false. This team absolutely has a non-zero chance to compete. "Competing" does not equal "prohibitive Word Series favorites." Are they likely to win 90+ games in 2019? Probably not. But there is more than enough young talent making its way to Chicago by the end of next year to construct a slightly-above-.500 team if enough goes their way. And guess what, that constitutes competing in the two-Wildcard era. Obviously, the ultimate goal is a juggernaut team in the early '20s, but I don't know why you would 100% dismiss the idea that nothing will happen sooner. Sometimes I think people are so used to the "all-in/win-or-bust with patchwork veterans" Sox underacheiving and imploding that they don't realize how easy it is to be in a playoff race until late in the season these days, especially in the two-Wildcard era. If you aren't able to win 90 games, you really aren't competing. An 83 win team isn't competitive in my eyes. That is an average team. Realistically we would need a ton to go right to be able to see even that .500ish team by 2019. Even the Cubs weren't above .500 until the fourth season after hitting bottom. That would put us at 2020 or even 2021 if next year is worse than this year. The Cubs not only burnt the ground down, but they were also going out and signing free agents during that span to start to build the roster. At this stage the White Sox are still burning down the house. 2018 is going to be a terrible team. IMO even with the prospects coming in, it is going to be closer to 2003 Tigers than .500. These kids will need time. I get the prospect sheets look great now, but I think a lot of people are WAY too optimistic in their hopes for these kids as a whole, and have to realize that a lot of prospect flat out fail, and for every Kris Bryant that hits from his first day in the majors, there are a lot more guys like Avi Garcia and Kyle Shwarber who spend seasons struggling as well as guys like Tim Anderson whose development is up and down. Already this year we have seen steps back from guys like Giolito, Fulmer, Anderson, and Collins. This could be blips in the road, or it could be the tip of the iceberg for them. It is a statistical certainty that some will bust. Who and how many? Well that is the fun part.