Dick Allen

Unless the plan is to keep him until he retires, which could be possible, I think the Sox have to trade Abreu before the season starts. If they dump Frazier and Melky, there is zero motivation for the opposition to ever throw him a strike. Unless he accepts that he is going to walk 150 times, his numbers are going to drop because he is going to to swinging at a lot of crap.

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2016/12/2018...ree-agents.html That is the list. It isn't a bad list but I do think except for Harper, Machado, and probably Kershaw, it is a bit overrated. I don't think the Sox have even a slight shot at Harper or Kershaw. JR saving his money until then might be able to shock the world and get Machado, but the odds have to be huge against it. Donaldson will be 33 in 2019, which is almost considered a fossil these days.

QUOTE (daa84 @ Dec 7, 2016 -> 08:42 PM) scouting ranks on the fastballs for some of the guys at the top of our farm: Giolito: 80 Kopech: 80 Lopez: 70 Fuller: 70 Burdi: 75 Hansen: 70 Thats nuts. How does Burdi get a 75 on his gas?

QUOTE (iamshack @ Dec 9, 2016 -> 10:28 AM) We seem to actually be able to scout/develop decent pitchers Fangraphs ripped him. We will see what happens. Anderson had an incredible BABIP, but someone compared him to Marte, and he has similar BABIP for his career. This guy just hasn't played much, and has never been on the same level for long. I don't think there is any conclusion that can be drawn until we see what he does. He could be a guy who makes major adjustments, strikes out less and walks more, or he could be a guy with a .268 OBP in July 2017. He looked a lot better to me than expected, and the ball does jump off his bat. I'm sure there are tons of guys who have become pretty good hitters who fangraphs would have written off as someone with Anderson's experience.

Can I ask why we should be pessimistic about Anderson, but a guy like Giolito should excite us?

I don't see how anyone can come to any conclusion that Tim Anderson won't be a decent hitter based on where he is in his career and 2016 numbers. TBH, his numbers were a lot better than I thought they would be. Sure, he could be a guy like Avi who had a nice run with the bat but it wasn't sustainable, or he could be a guy that develops. If his walk and k rate remain the same, Fangraphs has a point. If he adjusts, it's silly talk.

QUOTE (Deadpool @ Dec 9, 2016 -> 08:25 AM) You and Greg are on your own plane of special. Good one.

If Lunhow doesn't want to take on any pain for his package for Q, he can sign Derek Holland.

Eaton was great with the White Sox. Averaged only about 0.5 WAR a year less than Bryce Harper the last 3. Definitely will be missed on the field, and seemed like a really good guy off. I really don't know where Deadpool is coming from. He probably would have a different take if Eaton was going to the Cubs.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 8, 2016 -> 06:48 PM) One thing I actually do find interesting about Jones's Blown Save stat is that 1/2 of them in his career happened last year, in 2016 he has 9 blown saves. Compared to the rest of his career, his 2016 peripherals aren't bad. His K rate is normal, maybe even a bit high. His walk rate was the lowest of his career. His extra base hit rate was the best of his career. However, his home run rate spiked. From those numbers, I look at Jones and wonder if he wasn't slightly unlucky last year - a few extra HR and a few well placed hits cost him a lot of games and maybe even inflated his ERA a bit. With him blowing 9 saves, I can make a decent case that if he does the same thing next year (or if he's even slightly stronger being farther removed from TJS) he could look even better in 2017. Unlucky is probably accurate. 71 games pitched. 13 games he gave up runs. 9 of the 13 he gave up 1 run, and had 9 BS. The opposition had a hard time hitting him. The last month it was silly.

Nate Jones has entered a game in the 9th inning and blown a save exactly zero times in his career.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Dec 8, 2016 -> 05:30 PM) Question for the board. What if Houston caved in and said they would trade Bregman but the trade would be Bregman for Q straight up. Would ya do it? At this point, for sure. The extra control alone is worth it. Bregman, Anderson, Moncada could be 3/4 of a monster infield.

Kim seems sweet on Dylan. I hope she is right. Lot of garbage time this year to give him some innings. I think his stuff would really have to be short to get offered back

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Dec 8, 2016 -> 05:54 PM) I think you need revisit the definition of "blown save". Yes. In 2014 Wade Davis had an ERA of 1.00. His WHIP was 0.85. He struck out 109 in 72 innings, and he had 3 saves and 3 blown saves. Using that stat for set up guys is crazy.

QUOTE (heirdog @ Dec 8, 2016 -> 01:53 PM) Curious to know if Tim anderson was prospect eligible right now, where would he rank in top 100? If you want to see something unreal, look at Anderson's splits ahead in the count and behind in the count. Someone should beat that in his head all winter. If he ever gets somewhat patient, there is no telling how good he could be.

QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Dec 8, 2016 -> 02:39 PM) The threads that have very little to do with the actual game of baseball being played are always dominated by DA. I'm always fascinated when the reason for attendance being so low goes from lack of consecutive playoff appearances to people really don't go for the game. They go to be entertained by something else. The Sox don't do this and even though their ticket prices are below league average, they charge way too much. Wrigley, with the highest prices in baseball do it right. They entertain the s*** out of you. I haven't been there myself in a couple of years, but something must of changed. Other than the horrible guest conductor during the 7th inning, it always seemed like a typical baseball game experience except the park is older and I can stare at weeds hiding the brick OF walls.

QUOTE (The Mighty Mite @ Dec 8, 2016 -> 02:37 PM) They had a nice team in 1990 but the main reason they doubled the attendance from 1989 was because 1990 was the last year for old Comiskey. That helped, but not to double it.

QUOTE (heirdog @ Dec 8, 2016 -> 01:47 PM) He's inserting his credit card into the seat back slot right now to release the "airplane phone" and make some calls. He's home right now doing bong hits after spending the last 96 hours nonstop with KW.

QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Dec 8, 2016 -> 02:19 PM) :lol: What's laughable is you think all those people who come to games with their White Sox swag on really aren't there for the game, they are there to be entertained by something else. The game may be icing on the cake. Bizarre. It might be true at Wrigley Field to a certain degree. I once read a story where a big time marketing guy said they could turn the seats around and have them face away from the field and still sell out. But that is really not the case on the South side or probably anywhere else. Look at how many people on this board say the Sox fans go to games when they win. And what exactly do they do at Wrigley that creates a fun atmosphere? The vast majority of the 40k there for a game don't spend the day at the neighborhood bars.

QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Dec 8, 2016 -> 02:08 PM) Sure I can. Both things matter. How do you think teams like the Cubs draw when they suck? They draw because Wrigley is really fun. Why is it fun? They cultivated a fun atmosphere. Winning is the icing on the cake that takes it to a new level. Life is nuanced Dick Allen, not everything is as black and white as you'd like it to be. Yes, you can find cheap tickets, but the entire package is expensive. The Sox need to think of creative ways to attract attendance. It's been done before. You say they don't care about the game because they went to the game but not for the game. So the result of the game shouldn't matter. If it does matter, like you now claim as "icing on the cake" the White Sox won 45 out of 81 home games. You say price matters. White Sox average ticket prices are below league average. Most people who go to White Sox games have a lot of fun. Maybe before you knock it, you should try it.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Dec 8, 2016 -> 02:05 PM) I'm not doubting this "total rebuild" thing ... but until they make the next wave of moves (Robertson, Quintana, Frazier, Melky, Lawrie, Abreu) they haven't committed themselves to a total rebuild yet. Right now, you've got two new starting pitchers for the rotation to replace Sale next season and you've got a new second baseman. Again, I'm EXPECTING those guys all to be traded soon, but again, as of now, the rebuild is not completely underway. s***, three of the guys we've acquired will be contributing next season (the two Nats pitchers and the new second baseman). Whether you like it or hate it, they traded Sale and Eaton. Not to finish it off cannot happen and will not happen. They may keep Abreu or Jones, Hahn mentioned Lawrie can play 3B or something, but anybody else that can get them anything are gone. We haven't heard anything about Melky. I bet he is one guy the Sox throw a little money in to get something decent.

QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ Dec 8, 2016 -> 01:57 PM) Well, don't forget a key contributor to the low attendance figures in years '87-'89 was due in large part to the infamous owner casting a pall over the ballpark with his threats to move the club to Florida and the blackmailing tactics he employed to secure his sweetheart lease deal from the state. They broke ground on the new park in 1989 when attendance was at it's lowest. And the evil JR drew 2 million in 1990. The difference was the team was good in 1990. You don't really believe White Sox fans are going to rally behind this rebuild and come to games in droves do you?

QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Dec 8, 2016 -> 01:53 PM) Winning creates a fun atmosphere. There are other ways to create a fun atmosphere. You know this. You're just doing that really boring thing you do in every thread. No, you just realized you went a little too far and are trying to change the focus. You can't say they aren't there for the game, and then say what happens in the game matters. Besides, if it did, the team was 45-36 at home this season. Why was it a morgue? And you said Sox games are expensive. You are wrong again.

QUOTE (TaylorStSox @ Dec 8, 2016 -> 01:46 PM) They haven't drawn more because going to the Cell is expensive and not all that fun. Obviously a good team is going to draw more because "winning is fun." Of course I didn't say it didn't matter, but typical Dick Allen, putting words in poster's mouths and creating gross mischaracterizations. You said they aren't there for the game. Here's the reality, the vast majority of people at a baseball game aren't there for the game. That's your quote. So why would winning be fun? BTW, Sox games can be really cheap. Like cheaper than the Schaumburg Boomers if you go on Sunday.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 8, 2016 -> 01:43 PM) You just put "Sox fans'" and "patience" right next to each other, without it being a joke? Sox fans won't have five years worth of patience. That I know. Yep. It didn't take long for Carson Fulmer to be a reliever at best around here. About a month.