Texsox

Who was #1 and #2 in your opinion? What were their entire contracts worth? How often were they #1 in salary and #1 in stats?

The poll assumes that the payroll will stay the same for the length of his contract.

You've said Maggs is wrong for negotiating his best contract, yet you've also said a player is right if he whines, b****es, and holds out in the middle of the contract if he is underpaid. You are certainly interesting. I didn't think the White Sox were a charity that players needed to make a donation to. I assume if you make a pledge to a charity, you don't honor that is it is no longer a good deal for you. Do you care more about your employer than money? Would you turn down millions of dollars more because you care? Of course not, you would use "leverage" to get out of your contract.

Sorry, you've been soeaking for Maggs, I must have gotten carried away.

Of course you can look backwards, find a couple players, and make a case. Do you really think anyone here is that stupid? Do you think the Sox are that stupid that they would have paid Maggs more money instead of someone else? Stars offer some reasonable expectation of consistent performance? It's like comparing Uribe to every other middle infielder and telling teams they were idots to sign Jeter, Nomar, etc. to their contracts when they could have had Uribe as a FA. You could make a case like that against any player in baseball. Keep trying sparky. But according to you, the Sox could sign Maggs for anything and just ask to be let out of the contract later if another player, like Uribe starts playing well. Are you getting enough oxygen? Why pay Buerhle when a Dontrell makes less? Why pay Frank? Kong?

This may be an early nominee for thread of the year. It has everything, debate, humor, bulls***, graphics, a star player and a worthless bum, both named Maggs. This may be the passionless, mf thread of 2004.

What's the level of performance difference between 1st and 2nd place? What was the difference between say the Yankees and Marlins last season? 400% By the way, whose the guy you are referencing? I see it is some blog. I'll bet he's using you as his reference.

Ribbie is killing me. In the thread that never ends, an article that could clear up everything is missing. Ribbie has an idea!

In a thread filled with many funny quotes, ribbie tosses in this gem.

Juggs, I take pride that when I agree to do something, I do it. People can count on me, they can trust me. You've used leverage to get out of a contract. I've used my integrity to live up to my agreements. Maybe personal integrity is medieval. Call me old fashion, but I believe a man's word is his bond. Even more old faashioned is I even live up to vebal agreements, and wouldn't think of anything less. I know there are some low life snakes out there that will look me in the eye and lie. I know that there are some people whose signature isn't worth a hill of beans. I chose not to be that kind of person. I believe that there is honor in my word. This may have digressed into the funniest thread ever. From just a couple pages I missed Ribbie has me laughing my ass off.

It that isn't already in the June Quotes of the month, it will be.

See Juggs is so confused he just quoted himself And why even comment on sworn testimony, if yur signature on a contract isn't worth the paper it's printed on why should anyone beieve your words or your posts?

Hey juggs, do you at least cross your fingers behind your back when you sign the contract?

Well Juggs that is all I need to know about your character. For you, it probably only is a piece of paper and your signature on the document doesn't mean s***.

Poor Juggs is getting hit from all sides and trying to deflect each one as it comes. It kind of reminds me of an old western gun fight. Look behind you, he's shooting from behind the piano.

You are disqualified Queeny, didn't you read the rules?

Juggs, I guess you have never signed an employment contract. The reason players and owners enter into contracts is to protect their interests. If people were not obligated to live up to their promise on the contract, we would have chaos. You do understand the difference between accepting a job without a contract and entering into a contract? The salaried worker does not have a contract, it is understood that either party can terminate the relationship. With a contract, it is understood that both parties will live up to the contract that they agreed to. That is what makes the economy work. Yes, that means that on some contracts the players win and on some the owners win. That is why you have to be careful in negotiating the contract up front. You have to be willing to live up to the contract, or do not sign. Asking to renegotiate is one thing, holding out and refusing to live up to your word is another. Why do you think there are multi-year contracts? Are you saying that a player negotiates a four year deal and would expect if his stats improved he should demand more money in year three? Why not just sign a one year contract? He would be a FA and could earn market rates every year?

LMAO, Damn you Steff, I was setting that up for myself and you beat me to it. Steff 238 Tex 2

How is this out of both sides of my mouth? As a free agent you are free to negotiate the best possible deal and pick one you are happy with. You aggresivly sell your services and agree to a multi-year deal. Then you go play and do your best. Both you and the owner know that other players will be negotiating contracts during your contract period. Those subsequent contracts may make yours seem high or low. Your performance may go down, it may go up. All parties are taking some risk in the contract. Now you think it is right for the player to whine and hold out on the contract he signed?? What did the player agree to? I'll live up to this contract as long as I think it is fair? As soon as my stats go up, I want a new contract giving me more money? And that isn't greed? Tell me Juggs, does your word mean anything? Have you ever signed a contract?

I am still running this through my mind. What do you call a guy who doesn't want to play for the amount HE agreed to?

Why bring Steve Miller into this?

Sadly, not negotiating is probably the best course for us all. Not for this one man. :headshake

When the guy waved his arms up and encouraged the boos and laughed, he became a jerk.

Interesting. A player agrees to a 5 year contract, taking the security in exchange for up to the minute comparisons. Why have a contract in the first place if either party should demand a renegotiation when ever they feel it isn't fair? Should owners lock out any player who is "over paid" until they accept less? Isn't it fair for the club to expect a player to play well after signing a contract? I'm surprised. I believe once both parties agree to a contract, your word is your bond, live up to it. I guess your word isn't. You agree as long as it is advantagous to you. I hope you never enter into a contract expecting someone to renegotiate if it is no longer to your liking. You believe when someone is under contract they are correct in asking for more money, but if they are FA, they are greedy to negotiate their best contract? I guess I'm old fashion in believing someone's signature on a contract means something. Contracts are signed for a period of time. In many contracts, players are over paid in the beginning and underpaid at the end. That is the risk and reward of long term contracts for the owners and players. To renegotiate in the middle, totally ignores that premise.