witesoxfan

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Dec 8, 2006 -> 02:41 AM) Mike Schmidt accumulated 548 career HR, 10 gold gloves, 3 MVPs, 6 silver sluggers, 12 All-Star appearances, a hall of fame bust a ring and a career postseason line of .236/.304/.386/.690. He must have been a dick in the clubhouse...what a cancer.

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Dec 8, 2006 -> 02:17 AM) 2006 White Sox Payroll: $102,875,667 good for 4th in all of baseball behind NYY, BOS and $750,000 behind LAA. thx, wasnt sure what it was...knew it was up there I just wish he'd spend more

QUOTE(Soxy @ Dec 7, 2006 -> 09:42 AM) One of my teaching reviews was that I "speak English very well." Um, thanks? I have finally mastered my native tongue! HURRAY! That's good, then we can have a long conversation about anything and I won't get pissed in my head when you use less and fewer and good and well incorrectly, while also being able to say especially without putting an 'x' in there. I don't have many pet peeves, and I really don't let those that do bother me that much...but mainly incorrect pronunciation and adverb/adjective use bugs the hell out of me. I'll quietly smile and listen, but really, I'm pissed and want to correct your grammar SO.FRIGGIN'.BADly

QUOTE(Heads22 @ Dec 8, 2006 -> 12:16 AM) NAMBLA Gage never left. Oh boy, I just remembered some great memories of me, Boz, Gage and Greasy. Let's just say Jason isn't always on top of things.... what ever happened to Jason's favorite pants that had a hole in them?

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Dec 8, 2006 -> 01:55 AM) Wite, you wasted WAYY too much time for a guy like "Sinking Ship" WAYYYY Too much time. ya i did it was fun though

QUOTE(SinkingShip06 @ Dec 8, 2006 -> 12:49 AM) lol. silly you comparing a baseball team to the stock market. I'm not comparing a baseball team to the stock market, I'm comparing baseball player's values to stock values, and the market for players to the market for stocks. What's so "silly" about that? What are Floyd and Aardsma to you, batboys? I see Jenks, MacDougal, Thornton, Floyd, Aardsma, and then Logan/Haeger/Tracey at the end of the bullpen currently, and I highly doubt Kenny's done dealing yet. Pitching starved? Really? Barry Zito, Jason Schmidt, Adam Eaton, Vicente Padilla, Gil Meche, Ted Lilly, Randy Wolf, Greg Maddux, Miguel Batista, Mark Mulder, Jeff Suppan, Jeff Weaver - I'm likely forgetting a few - and that's just the free agent market. Look at next year's likely crop of starters and tell me with a straight face that this year's market is pitching starved. Teams have money to spend and are willing to throw it around at free agents rather than send talent over to another club and then have to worry about resigning the player. It's quite simple really. Learn what? I don't even understand that that comment is regarding. The outstanding values KW resigned Garland and Contreras at? Based on what, your interpretation of quotes? Yeah, KW's not trying to win at all next year, in fact, he is just randomly giving players away at any cost. And they lost in 2006 with the same pitchers. Oh yeah, that's right, then they added a major league pitcher one so that they didnt HAVE to put in a minor leaguer. What's up with that? The Sox big 4 all had ERAs under 4 in 2005; those same 4 all had ERAs over 4.50, save Contreras (who was at an impressive 4.26). The same flash in the pan GM who constructed the first World Series winner since 1917 and the first back to back 90 win seasons since '64-'65? K, just checkin'. Roughly a $100 million payroll in 2006, in the upper third in the league. He really needs to spend $200 million though if he wants to continue competing. Yep, you're right, this deal is going to turn out horribly because KW's been burned on so many deals in the past and has never won anything. Why is he even still the GM? Kenny doesn't look to get steals in trades. He sees what the market has to offer, and he sees what he wants from the offering teams. He and others obviously felt that the Phillies offer was the best one on the table when considering both value and needs. Some apparently refuse to believe that KW would have such a thought process. I too felt Kenny should have brought in atleast one other player, but with everything considered, I don't see how this is that bad of a trade by the Sox.

QUOTE(SinkingShip06 @ Dec 7, 2006 -> 11:58 PM) i am just totally disappointed by what i'm hearing from our organization. also i hear alot of JR in KW's comments. i think JR feels its time for a fire sale. we'll still have decent attendance and ratings for a year or two. why not dump salary so he can finally stuff some of that loot into his pockets. Of course you would feel that way. You pretty much s*** on the White Sox organization every chance you get, including your avatar and board name. What notion do you get that JR wants to rebuild? Because he's criticizing how f***ing ridiculous this market really is? Kenny and Jerry are smart business men, and just as you don't invest in stocks at peak value, you don't invest in starting pitching when mediocrity is getting $10+ million a year. They don't want to rebuild. They simply want to stay ahead of the curve. That would be buying low and selling at higher than you bought. At the current moment, every starting pitcher on the White Sox major league club has higher value than they did last offseason, so why not sell that which is replaceable? The Sox starting rotation next year only has to be better than the rotation last year. If that results in trading Garcia and Buehrle, it means Contreras, Garland, and Vazquez need to improve, and McCarthy and another starter, be it Floyd, Phillips, Haeger, or whoever, need to put up ERAs better than, or really even equal to 4.53 and 4.99 respectively. I don't view that as impossible or even improbable, but rather quite likely, especially if the right talent is brought in. And with the depth Kenny has added to the bullpen in the past month, I can easily see the bullpen improving. It'd be quite hard for the bullpen to get worse than it was last year. The bench has to improve...what is the likelyhood of that? The offense has to be more consistent...how likely is that? I'm really not sure this team will be worse than it was last year, but maybe that is just the realist in me coming out.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Dec 7, 2006 -> 06:51 PM) I agree, like that team Jeter moved over from short to 3rd to make room for a better defensive shortstop. and we have a winnar

QUOTE(WHarris1 @ Dec 7, 2006 -> 05:19 PM) w000000000t, my AAP returns you cant be happy about this trade, its impossible you can be happy about no aspect of it at all.

KW seems to pretty much hate Lofton, and Griffey is one of the worst defensive CFers in the game. The only real free agent signing that should be made is Toby Hall 5 minutes after he is non-tendered by the Dodgers. Or trading for Damian Miller, if cost is right.

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Dec 7, 2006 -> 03:14 AM) Honestly I think it's worth giving him a Jose Guillen type of contract. Give him about 2-3M for 2007, incentives that would bring that to 4-5M, and then have say 2 team options for 9M and 10M for the next 2 seasons. If he was signed, and came back and pitched well in say June, it would give the Sox the flexibility to trade a SP at the trade deadline, and a team could really overpay then. I'd say he's more likely to take the Randy Wolf route - take a 1 year, $6 mill deal with incentives to boost it to $10, with him then bolting to free agency. (and yes, I realize Wolf is making $8 mill...he should also be ready by opening day as I recall)

QUOTE(R.J. @ Dec 7, 2006 -> 03:34 AM) Its probably already been said in the thread somewhere, but the Braves get RAFAEL SORIANO for HORACIO RAMIREZ, and this is the best we can do for Garcia? We look pretty bad right now. (So does Bill Bavasi, but still). Garcia has 1 year left on his deal, and is then likely to test free agency, where he could easily get a 4/$52 contract, and perhaps better, if the current market holds true. The Mariners will have Ramirez beyond 2007...I'd imagine he becomes a free agent sometime around 2009, and he's a bit cheaper than Garcia will be even if he is a free agent sooner. Soriano's also a huge health risk, talent be damned, and is only a reliever, where as both Floyd and Gio are looked at as starters. As if KW didn't explore those possibilities as far as he could. Everything considered, this is what Kenny felt was the best offer he could get, and I don't blame him, seeing as how Floyd will be with the White Sox until around 2011 and Gio will be under White Sox until like 2015. Freddy was gone next year, and to even suggest that other teams didn't consider that is ridiculous. That doesn't even make sense. How is John Danks promised to be good? And how are you sure that Floyd won't be a good pitcher for the Sox by the time June rolls around? You can't make assertions like that, it's just ridiculous. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. The Sox are a better team with McCarthy in the rotation and out of the bullpen, so that makes this trade a winner from that standpoint alone. Then you look at the potential upside of Floyd and Gio, and the possibility of those three starters in the Sox rotation until like 2011, and that makes it even better too. Then, considering the amount of money saved, and realizing that money will be put back into the team in some form, and I'm just not sure how this deal is really that bad. The free agent market and the trade market are apples and oranges. And no, teams are not willing to give up talent AND money for a pitcher with an 88 MPH fastball who had a 4.53 ERA last year. (and Meche will get Ted Lilly money; the Cubs are idiots) And in pretty much every one of those articles written by the media, it was pretty much assumed the Sox were getting great value in the deal, probably too much for the trade to formulate. For a comparison...please tell me how this deal rates against the Doug Davis deal. ARI: Doug Davis, Dana Eveland, and Dave Krynzel MIL: Johnny Estrada, Claudio Vargas, and Greg Aquino The Brewers got a light hitting catcher who put up a .772 OPS in one of the better hitting ballparks in the league last year, a 4th or 5th starter, and a AAAA reliever for Doug Davis WHILE ALSO GIVING UP a decent pitching prospect AND a former top prospect who has fallen considerably. Then Davis's likely salary...probably around $4-5 million...needs to be taken into consideration as well. I'd say compared to that deal, the Sox came out pretty well, and I don't see why it would be unfair to compare the value received in the deals. I'd have loved for the Sox to have acquired another fringe prospect along, but I imagine it is quite obvious that this was about as far as the Phillies were going to go. I'll take it.

QUOTE(kramer99 @ Dec 7, 2006 -> 03:15 AM) anybody think KW may turn around and trade Floyd and someone else for some like Crawford/baldelli?? Or do u think this it? I personally don't think he's trading Floyd elsewhere. Floyd's value is probably as low as it ever will be (unless he completely bombs next year), but I have to figure KW and/or Cooper sees something in him. I could see him dealing Gio again, but then again, I could see a lot of scenarios regarding Gio. There's no chance this is the last move the Sox make though, especially if you are to believe what KW is saying.

wow I might actually have to do that come this weekend, seeing as how I have like 2 and a half papers to finish. Only two finals though, which is tight as hell. I will, however, only do so if I am allowed 5 posts per trade, if the Sox are to make them from Saturday to Saturday.

Whatever happened to Cherry and Bub? and where did good late Saturday night sketch comedy go?

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ Dec 7, 2006 -> 02:28 AM) I was just going to say the same thing. Definitely glad to have Gio back. Counting last year, the trade ends up being Thome + $$$ + Gio + Floyd for Rowand + Garcia + Castro/Haigwood. It looks a lot better that way, so I think I'm going to just post it like that from now on. I prefer Olivo, Reed, and Morse for Floyd, Gio, and a World Series title, but I'm kinda goofy like that.

QUOTE(Soxbadger @ Dec 6, 2006 -> 08:46 PM) Bonds isnt going to get $18mil. Im saying the Sox should be interested if they can get him for under 10. I dont get your argument about being a cancer etc, because the same has been said about Manram. I just think Bonds is going to come back and play good baseball. He started to do better at the end of last season once he was healthy again, and I believe that he still has 1-2 years left of producing. As to the rest, these guys are professionals. I dont know any Sox player who has had an incident with Bonds. I think that he will have a huge chip on his shoulder and playing with a playoff team may be willing to try and show the world. I just dont see why its such a huge risk in a market that Mathews JR got 10mil agreed completely and Bonds has been the ONLY reason the Giants have had any sustained success, and he was easily the biggest reason the nearly won the World Series in 2002. I'd love Bonds in LF, regardless of his past.

QUOTE(Kalapse @ Dec 7, 2006 -> 12:44 AM) As would most anyone who's ever seen the 2 guys pitch, the problem is that scenerio is no where near reality. ^^^

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ Dec 7, 2006 -> 02:08 AM) Kenny Williams has found out the value of good young pitching. If he can get a Mike Pelfrey or Eric Hurley / John Danks in some sort of deal for one of our SP's, I would be inclined to do that. You can always sign a SP like Miggy Batista on a short term deal on an inflated salary, to help fill the void until the spects are ready. You can plug Haeger, Phillips, and Floyd in there too, suffer through half a run more of ERA, and save $8 million.

QUOTE(Rowand44 @ Dec 7, 2006 -> 02:06 AM) I'd recommend watching the press conference if you guys haven't yet. The beginning and end especially are rather entertaining. I will vouch for this, as I would have been laughing out loud had it not been a quarter after 2 in the morning.

QUOTE(3 BeWareTheNewSox 5 @ Dec 7, 2006 -> 12:43 AM) Not about his numbers, more about him being their version of Borchard. In that case, maybe he can play CF...? Perhaps he is their version of Matt Thornton too. You know, it's possible.

QUOTE(SoxFan101 @ Dec 6, 2006 -> 08:40 PM) Ok in my post I said Mcnair is a huge upgrade over Miller so dont know where thats coming from. And as for Billick Im sure he has helped a little with the defense but he is an offensive coach so im betting the D-Coordinator has much more to do with it than he does. Just like with Lovie I credit our offense more to Turner than I do him. k, wasn't sure what you meant by the McNair comment. Good to have that cleared up. I didn't think anybody was dumb enough to think that Miller was an upgrade over McNair, but I like stating the obvious anyways. Also, I would trust the braintrust of Billick and Newsome over almost any others in the NFL. Those two can construct a great football team. I'd almost say it has more to do with Newsome than anything else, because the rest just trickles down from him.

QUOTE(TheBigHurt @ Dec 7, 2006 -> 12:13 AM) I'm not going to say anything personally, but what happened to all the trash talking about Javier around here? Perhaps it's not an option, but on paper, I'd much rather have Mulder than Vasquez in our rotation. Are you serious? You'd rather have a pitcher who has deteorated as quickly as Mulder has over Vazquez? One who's coming off a surgery as severe as Mulder has over the durability of Vazquez? One who won't pitch till midseason over one who will pitch all season? One with worse stuff before his injury the one with some of the best stuff in the game? wow. nothing more can be said.

QUOTE(iamshack @ Dec 6, 2006 -> 07:37 PM) Knowing that Zito would walk in a year? 'cuz the devil is gonna get him mad money Buehrle's agent isn't Boras, so there's a shot that he could be resigned. Regarding the actual deal itself, ya I'd make that deal. I don't see a reason not to. Worst case scenario, you're looking at like two sandwich picks.

QUOTE(daa84 @ Dec 6, 2006 -> 06:23 PM) a guy with the upside of harden.....which we dont have Javy Vazquez anybody? Bit of a headcase, but atleast he'd actually be healthy.