witesoxfan

QUOTE (LDF @ Nov 10, 2014 -> 12:32 PM) what is your problem today.... or with me. you mean I can't ask any question with your ok. ....... DAVERS, It's not worth being worried about right now. It's a concern and he'll need to show improvement, but suggesting a positional change at this point in his career is just silly. It'd be like suggesting Montas or Danish move to the bullpen because they don't have the requisite secondary pitch at this point in their careers. There's no need to get snippy. You've continually harped on Anderson's defense and the response has always been "he needs more time." You can't make a conclusion that a guy is unfit for a position after a year and a half of professional experience. IF a positional change does come about, it's going to be to the outfield. He's struggled with fielding and making throws across the infield, but never lateral range or quickness in the field. Knowing that, moving him to 3B, where the throw is longer and the balls come in faster, would be an unmitigated disaster.

QUOTE (peavy44 @ Nov 10, 2014 -> 12:06 PM) mariners going get vmart anyways. I'd like to hear your rationale on this besides "they have interest." I think there are a ton of teams who will have interest in Victor Martinez.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Nov 10, 2014 -> 12:20 PM) The first three to triple digits: Sandoval, Miller, Gregerson. So SoxTalk DOES want Hahn to spend on the bullpen. Gregerson is a guy I really don't like whatsoever, and I think the Sox in-house options plus cheap alternatives on the market for right handed relievers is plentiful enough that they shouldn't spend significantly. I've already let it be known that I don't mind spending a lot on Miller, but I think he's going to get even more than I am comfortable with. I am assuming he's going to be worth 7 WAR over the next 4 years, but I also want to spend less than the AAV/WAR in a free agent scenario as I do not believe the wins he will add will justify it in the short-term and you'll see diminishing returns over the course of the contract, though he should still be a valuable and capable reliever. My absolute max contract for Andrew Miller would be 4/$40, and I would be extremely hesitant to give that to a non-closer. I'd prefer to get him around 4/$32. And, in reality, I have absolutely no idea whatsoever to expect for him with regards to a contract.

The more and more I have thought about this, the more I believe Ethier is the least likely player to be traded. Among the three-headed albatross that is Kemp, Crawford, and Ethier, consider the following: 1) He's the cheapest least-expensive. 2) He also has the least amount of value. 3) He has the greatest positional versatility while being competent defensively. I just think the Dodgers are going to look into moving Crawford and/or Kemp prior to moving Ethier, and I think they're preference would be moving Kemp. I do not think the Sox should attempt to acquire Matt Kemp as I do not believe he would be happy as a DH nor should they want to pay him $20 mill a year to be a DH. Crawford is a bit different, as I could see some appeal to him, but again, you're likely going to have to include Danks and then another couple pieces as well, perhaps Semien (as he's a guy I think Friedman would value quite a bit). That's a price I would be hesitant to pay because I really, really like Semien, and I don't think Crawford is going to be worth it long-term. Frankly, even as I was hoping the Sox would be in on this early on, I now hope they stay away because I do not believe anything good will come of it long-term, and I'm not sure the Sox are close enough short-term to make it worthwhile. What stinks is that it seems to be the best opportunity to move Danks, but the only one that makes sense is dealing Danks for Ethier and I don't think that'd be a move Friedman would make at this point.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Nov 10, 2014 -> 10:58 AM) They're nice for making frames of reference, but it's why I always make it a point that the only thing that ultimately matters is what happens with the Chicago White Sox major league team. Yes, you want a good minor league system. Yes, you want it to be ranked high. But people would have assumed the White Sox were going to own the 2000s based on that 2000 team and the best minor league system in the game. The best player from that minor league system was an 88 MPH lefty who has thrown 200 innings in every season for the past 48 years. Funny that I say this...from the Sunday Notes Article posted yesterday at FanGraphs (last paragraph): http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/sunday-note...-astros-dbacks/

QUOTE (LDF @ Nov 10, 2014 -> 06:18 AM) a good reference and analogy, I pick 3b b/c I wasn't sure if it was his range or the range of the position that was causing him the problems. 3b like 1b doesn't need the range of a ss or 2b. I wasn't sure if he was capable of handling the outfield positions. as many have stated he was / is a raw product and is now coming into his own. I take that with his offensive numbers as well. it like the ole cliché, he is a blank paper with lots of talent. As I said in the other thread, don't worry about his defense.

QUOTE (LDF @ Nov 8, 2014 -> 09:10 PM) too bad no one asked him about how far away he is and what was his opinion on his defense. His opinion on the defense is going to be the same as anybody else's - he needs time. He has the tools to do so, but he needs more reps. Looking into his defense when he just barely cracked the AA lineup is silly. It's something he needs to improve, but you really don't need to worry about at this point in time.

QUOTE (flavum @ Nov 10, 2014 -> 10:11 AM) I completely agree, and it's one of the reasons I think Top 10 prospect lists are kinda dumb. We know who is drafted high, paid a lot, and performing well (or not well). That's good enough for me. They're nice for making frames of reference, but it's why I always make it a point that the only thing that ultimately matters is what happens with the Chicago White Sox major league team. Yes, you want a good minor league system. Yes, you want it to be ranked high. But people would have assumed the White Sox were going to own the 2000s based on that 2000 team and the best minor league system in the game. The best player from that minor league system was an 88 MPH lefty who has thrown 200 innings in every season for the past 48 years.

I like LaRoche, but he's not my favorite option. I think his addition really limits what the Sox can do from a versatility standpoint. It's not quite Paul Konerko last year, where he's a part time DH/1B who adds nothing else, but it would be nice if there was a little more that could be done. That's why I'm as big of a proponent as I am for Sandoval - his addition relegates Gillaspie to the DH position, which is not a bad thing whatsoever because Gillaspie is a guy who can play multiple positions which allows the Sox to matchup with teams a bit better.

I had Foles at QB. He got hurt, so I picked up the Sanchize and then for good measure picked up Jordan Matthews. I started Matthews in place of Michael Floyd (damn you Michael Floyd), so I'm hoping Sanchez throws for about 400 yards and 4 TDs and that Matthews catches 10 passes and 2 TDs. I'm down 50, so that would be amazing.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Nov 10, 2014 -> 10:05 AM) Yeah, I had to make some cuts because the poll limited me to 30. Morse was the last guy I took off, and it's worth noting that there area smattering or relievers that didn't get put in but we should be expected to court. You should have done one for hitters and one for pitchers! I am extremely disappointed in your creative thinking.

I selected Sandoval, Martin, McCarthy, and Miller. I am not trying to corner the market on players whose last names start with the letter "m." This is just what comes to mind initially and my bare bones gut instincts. As the wind changes, my mind may change tomorrow too. Here's my thoughts: -Sandoval represents an upgrade defensively at 3B and, aside from struggling against lefties this year, a better all around hitter than Gillaspie. I still like the idea of Gillaspie getting significant playing time both as a DH, a 1B, and some 3B too. You can try him in LF or RF, but I wouldn't count on him being a significant contributor out there. That allows the Sox to better pick their matchups with Gillaspie instead of needing him to play against LHP where he's always been a blackhole. -Martin represents the biggest upgrade you can have. This is the one that I think I probably had the toughest time making, but I think it's an area where the Sox could reap the most benefit. I don't mind what Tyler Flowers does at catcher as a significant contributor whatsoever, but it's an area of the team where a significant upgrade can absolutely be made. Bringing in Martin allows the Sox to shop Flowers or use him in a more traditional backup role. It also provides them some depth at the catcher position, which really makes you say "WTF? They never have depth at catcher" but they finally would. -McCarthy is a fairly solid #3 starter with previous injury concerns which I think allows you to get him for 3 years instead of 4-5 (which is what a pitcher would normally get at that age and stage). This limits your overall risk and provides you with a very possibly high upside pitcher, which decreases the need for guys like Carroll to give significant innings. -Miller is the best LH reliever on the market and likely to get way too much money for a reliever, but he is also a guy who's shown good command, good control, high velocity, and good breaking pitches. Guys who can do those kinds of things on the mound I think can provide some more long-term sustainable success as relievers. You always worry about injury, but I think even that over 4 years is not a bad investment. Of course, this is also only the top 30 or so free agents on the market, and I think there are going to be a lot of other moves made and a lot more interesting guys. I don't think Martin is a guy they will get as I think the Cubs will pay him 5/$75 or something absurd just to assure he signs. Sandoval may get 6 years guaranteed and that's not a step I'm willing to take with him (I have him at 5/$90 - 5 years at $17 mill per with a vesting option for, say, $20 million for year 6 with a $5 mill buyout). McCarthy seems like a guy who will re-sign with the Yankees and he could ultimately get $12-13 mill per year, where I'm really only willing to go to $11 and would prefer him at $10 mill, and Miller could easily get 4 years at $10+ mill per (that is a contract I'm really, really interested in seeing). (Also, I added Mike Morse because it doesn't hurt to have a guy who can hit LHP plus a few other positions around the field. His last name coincidentally (or not) starts with "M" and I had to take someone from the latter list, so those are the reasons)

QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Nov 10, 2014 -> 08:57 AM) I like Dayn, talked baseball with him earlier this year at a Baseball Propectus event. But Jacob May is not, IMO, a T10 prospect in this system. More in the teens somewhere. While I agree, I wouldn't be surprised in the least if more than a few lists have him in the top 10. He's got well-regarded talent and held his own in his first full season of professional ball at A+, which is not an easy stop for minor leaguers. I expect him to start in AA next year which lends itself to the idea that he could be not far off from an MLB promotion.

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Nov 7, 2014 -> 05:52 PM) Scherzer is probably out of question but i have no idea what everyones interest in McCarthy, Hammel, and Masterson is. People again think danks suck and want to get ride of his contract but if you replace him with one of these three pitchers you are basically getting the same exact thing. They all have around the same career eras. McCarthy cant stay healthy long enough. Masterson has 2 season of eras in the 3s that made at least 100 innings. They all have the same pitching time frame of 7-9 years and magically danks has more innings then any of these guys. If the sox want to compete then they better throw some money at free agency for a better pitcher or trade for one. Right now the rotation is sale, quintana, danks and probably noesi. If they do add a pitcher and rodon does go into the rotation right off the bat then getting rid of danks is fine cause noesi most likely takes his spot. Danks is a far different pitcher now than he was 3 or 4 years ago. You can't look at career ERAs and say "they are all the same pitcher." McCarthy and Hammel are far superior pitchers to Danks at this point in their careers. Masterson is debatable, but he's almost certainly only going to require a 1 year contract and if he flops, you can just cut your losses or try him out of the bullpen. There's no $28 million committment to him over the next 2 years like there is to Danks. Danks is a #4-5 starter at his absolute best right now, unless his velocity and command are magically restored between now and 4/1/15. McCarthy and Hammel both have #2-3 potential who are almost assured of pitching like a #4 even at their worst.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 7, 2014 -> 05:42 PM) Saunders doesn't strike me as anyone the Sox are interested in as a Plan A, B or maybe even C. I think he'd be perfectly fine as a 4th outfielder. They may have other guys planned, but I don't think you necessarily have to pencil a specific name into those roles, just someone who is capable of doing them. He strikes out a bit more than average, but it's nothing crippling, and he brings a fairly well rounded game to the table. If the Sox could get Saunders for Viciedo (or even Viciedo plus a small piece), I'd be all over it.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Nov 7, 2014 -> 05:37 PM) Good. Lol this is so true. But I still don't want any part of Saunders. Like said before, I'd rather trade Viciedo for a comp pick. I see no reason why a team would trade a competitive balance pick for Viciedo. It just doesn't make sense.

I think the Braves have to make him available for trade first. I'm not sure sure they'll be willing to do that. Plus, if you are signing him for 6 years, I'm not sure $90 mill would be enough. It might be, but I think he'd want a way out after 4 years.

QUOTE (shipps @ Nov 7, 2014 -> 05:22 PM) Does anyone know where the old "Its about my penis thread" is? I needed a laugh and I cant find it in the archives. http://www.soxtalk.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=69352

Last year, it made sense for both organizations to give both players the old college try for one more season. I think both organizations are tired of their respective player. Viciedo, Phegley, and Wilkins for Saunders and Maurer. Do it, it's the perfect collection of garbage that every fan will orgasm with excitement.

And the thing is, Scherzer is a terrible investment at that price too, but it is better than Samardzija. Frankly, the Sox don't need to be looking to overpay for a starting pitcher right now. 56 pitchers put up an fWAR of 2 and 61 pitchers put up a bWAR of 2 last year, meaning there are plenty of good pitchers around the league. The Sox should attempt to acquire one of those guys rather than splurging and spending all this money they've freed up on a great starting pitcher when they already have 2 of those, another top 10 pitching prospect in the game at AAA plus several others with a mixed bag of ceilings between the A+ and AAA levels. If they are going to spend a signficant amount of money on one player, it should be for an offensive player. The three names that make the most sense to me to fill a slot in the rotation are (in my preferred order) Brandon McCarthy, Jason Hammel, and Justin Masterson. There are a few others who would not be bad options, but those are the ones I think I'd prefer.

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Nov 7, 2014 -> 04:48 PM) Bailey was 27 when he signed his 6 year deal. Samardzija will be 31 before his new contract starts. I don't see him getting 6 yrs/$105. I see him getting 4 years, maybe a 5th year option. James Shields turns 33 in a month and a half and they're seeking (and could very well get) a 5 year contract. Samardzija and his agent would be failing miserably taking 4 years. Assuming health, his first contract offer from an inquiring team would be for 5 years.

QUOTE (shakes @ Nov 7, 2014 -> 04:41 PM) Sure, many large pitching contracts have been painful, but I think Samardzija is a bit unique. And 4 years just won't get it done. If you want to compete in the front line pitching space, you have to take on risk. I think there is a very real chance he is healthy and good for the next 4-5 years. If that's the case you are looking at a rotation that could potentially be what Detroit has had the last 5 years, with Abreu's prime anchoring the lineup. I just don't see the need for the Sox to enter a 6 year contract with anybody, and I think there are plenty of better pitchers to acquire than Jeff Samardzija. As I've said, I like Samardzija the pitcher, but there are way too many red flags overall on this for it to make sense for the White Sox. And those are not just red flags for Samardzija himself. The biggest red flag for Jeff Samardzija is frankly one we can ignore and that's that he's a pitcher, and we ignore it because of the fact that teams will always need pitchers. But he's going to be expensive to acquire and he's going to be expensive to retain. Consider that Max Scherzer is ultimately a better pitcher than Jeff Samardzija, costs only a 2nd round pick for the Sox to sign, and he's only going to be $5 mill (or so) more per year on the free agent market. Meanwhile, Samardzija is going to have to be acquired via trade and then re-signed. How much are you really willing to give up for that? Personally, I'd give something like Rondon, Beck, and Trayce Thompson and tell them to take it or leave it (they'd leave it) because you can just as easily lose Samardzija and then all you'll have to show for him is a late 1st or early 2nd round pick. Even knowing that those prospects are, frankly, nothing special, I'd still prefer to sign Scherzer. The stars would really have to align perfectly for the Sox to acquire Samardzija. Frankly, I think Beane will just end up keeping him and either dealing him at the deadline or taking the draft pick for him unless a team who is closer to contention wants to take a risk on him.

QUOTE (shakes @ Nov 7, 2014 -> 04:24 PM) You are not going to find many pitchers with less mileage about to hit free agency, with his health track record. With the contracts Sale and Q have, you can afford to take a risk on a pitcher for a larger contract, and I like his value better than the free agent options. Even so, when has a team ever said "I'm really glad I gave that guy a long term contract valued at $17-20 mill per year"? At 4 years, I'd love Samardzija. At 6 years, it's not a good gamble.

QUOTE (shakes @ Nov 7, 2014 -> 04:04 PM) I would be good with even going to $20 mil with him, but I'm not sure it would even take that. People are concerned that he is turning 30, but he does not have the typical usage pitchers have his age. He only has 100 more MLB innings than Sale, less than half of Jon Lester's innings total, and wasn't abused in college like many SP due to being a two sport athlete. He has a very young arm and has shown no hint of injury. If an extension is in play I would absolutely consider dealing Anderson for him. 777.2 MLB innings plus 485.1 MiLB innings equals 1263 career professional innings. Chris Sale has 685 innings in his professional career. Samardzija's arm is not as young as people think either.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Nov 7, 2014 -> 03:50 PM) Also, he put Josh Johnson to SDP one a 1yr/$3m deal. Didn't they JUST decline his option at 1yr/$4m? Yes. I know both sides were interested in a reunion next season to try and get him healthy and pitching, but why decline it if you're only saving $1 mill? Seems like it was a piece he put together when he was hungover and just said "f*** it, here it is" and put it out.