caulfield12

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Sep 5, 2016 -> 02:00 PM) The Sox can compete next year if Abreu & Frazier both bounce back (~3 WAR players) and they fill their holes in CF, DH/1B, & C with good to great players. I'm talking about signing Encarnacion & Ramos and trading for a guy like Charlie Blackmon. Do all three and you suddenly have a team with enough talent to withstand the grind of a 162 game season. Do much less, and you're relying on above-average luck and health to be competive. The two questions though are if adding all three of those pieces is even possible and whether or not it's the right long term answer. Signing those free agents will cost one and possibly two picks and our 1st rounder is not protected. Plus you'll have to beat numerous other suitors in a weak market and lock up significant payroll flexibility into guys on the wrong side of 30 (Ramos turns 30 next August) without superstar appeal and likely put yourself out of commission for the epic 2018/19 free agent class. And god only knows if we have the chips to get a guy like Blackmon without dipping into your 2016 draft class. Fulmer would probably have to be included in any package and then you're hurting your starting pitching depth and quite possibly dealing your #5 starter, which creates another hole. So long story short, adding the pieces necessary to compete is going to be costly and basically would require you going "all in" for Sale's remaining three years. And that's only possible if Reindsdorf is willing to open the checkbook and the front office can execute their plan, both which didn't happen last offseason in a buyer's market. I just don't see it happening, and fully expect more dumpster diving if they in fact go for it. Not to mention $125-150 million in additional payroll...and I honestly believe Fulmer is much more likely to be turned into CarGo and his high salary, not Blackmon and his youth, relative value and better WAR/defense. And then the issue of losing a first and second round draft pick. Don't see how you can justify that after refusing to part with the #26 pick this year unless we signed either Gordon or Fowler (who's tailing off now quite a bit).

Moreland is going to be taken out of one of the top 2-3 offenses in baseball...and also yet another player who will be on the wrong side of 30 (turns 31 this week). I would guess the production will be similar to Morneau or Morales but he will also cost in the $5-10 million range. It's another of those MEH moves where everything has to go right but you're just as likely to end up with a guy in the mid 750's at DH. Better than Avi again, clearly, but it's not going to be nearly enough without major improvements at catcher, CF, etc., which will be even more costly. With Wieters, you're dealing with Boras...which is fine if Boras views Matt the same way as Austin Jackson, but catchers are much more in demand than 1B/DH types. There are twenty plus teams that would like to upgrade at that position somehow.

http://nypost.com/2016/09/03/how-joe-maddo...nging-baseball/ Maddon's Cubs Experiment Changing Baseball

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Sep 4, 2016 -> 12:02 PM) My attitude is what new ? The Sox have been the sorriest franchise in baseball history. The only team to have ever been caught throwing a World Series . All the lifetime bans from that . Disco demolition, fans attacking umpires. Cheap terrible or no money owners odd uniforms and I'm sure I'm not remembering some stuff. Oh yea a midget batting . One World Series win in forever . But I'm stuck with them and that won't ever change. Don't forget... Debacle with original reaction to new stadium...upper deck, seat colors, etc. Collared jerseys/shorts/83 jerseys, which are actually kinda okay now. SportsVision Getting rid of Harry Caray Reputation of SouthSide for crime in 70's 80's early 90s White Flag trade Ligue Jr. attack on Royals' 1b coach Tom Gamboa 1994 strike largely caused by owner when Sox had one of the best teams in baseball Dunn/LaRoche/Shields historically bad seasons Veeck desperation promotions Ozzie Guillen feuding with KW and often drunk at the end, bolting for Marlins Sale knife cutting The Will to Win promotions right when the Sox start to fall apart Firing LaRussa, which also led to Leyland departing Harrelson as GM, Don Kessinger as player manager Dave Dombrowski also departing, would become HoF GM Carlos Quentin breaking his hamate bone, self inflicted Say It Aint So Joe Getting stuck behind the Yankees for so many years when there was only one pennant winner in the 50's and 60's Beckham, Viciedo, Brian Anderson, Josh Fields, Joe Borchard...and pretty much every position player drafted for the past 10-15 years not developing Tito Landrum, Jerry Dybs, etc. The crazy thing is that if you go from 1990-2006/08/10/12, we had the third best record in base in baseball behind the Braves, Yankees...depending on which years, Cards and Red Sox catch up eventually..but really only 2005 to show for it in the postseason

Butt ball saves the game from being walked off by Sox killer Escobar...

Dean, whoever that is, would pitch for MN next inning...

QUOTE (flavum @ Sep 4, 2016 -> 03:45 PM) I'd be interested to see where the Sox rank in division road games over the last five years. I'm guessing last. Interestingly, they have played better in KC than in Chicago recently. For whatever reason, the suckage doesn't seem to discriminate...in general. In Detroit, the Tigers have owned the Sox. Eaton wearing an 0 for 6. Nate Jones is next. Wimmer for the Twins. Seven blown saves for Robertson, plus the six or seven run lead that was blown that doesn't actually count as a blown save because you can't pitch yourself into a save situation, so essentially 8.

Suzuki should be signed by the Sox just to prevent 2-3 losses per season. Raburned again. Now who will the Sox bullpen turn to?

QUOTE (Soxfest @ Sep 4, 2016 -> 03:41 PM) Trading Robertson has to happen this winter. Great, so we can do our own version of the Shields trade now. How much money would we have to eat on that one?

An extra innings game with these teams is fitting punishment. Will walk Dozier to face Polanco.

Blown saves don't matter. Two years in a row, we could have traded Robertson. But, no. Fire everyone.

We can't rebuild...because it means we will be forced to watch Omar Narvaez and Carlos Sanchez bat 300 times each. Waiting for that one. Then mix with the usual Avi/Beckham/Viciedo/Flowers frustrations.

Great, now Avi Garcia gets the starting DH job again for 2017, haha. In the end, Tigers' money wins yet again. We'll see it for another series starting tmrw. Upton with 7 homers in his last 14 games and 18 for his last 52 at-bats. But we have a chance. Miguel Gonzalez is coming back.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 4, 2016 -> 03:11 PM) Note that the guys who were "white flag" traded were Navarro and Duke, neither of whom is obviously going to replace Ranaudo or Shields. Well maybe Shields. Navarro probably could have outpitched him. Well, Carson Fulmer and Beck starting in significant games against AL Central opponents would be entertaining. Maybe we could rush up Burdi as well. Heck, forget about Collins developing as a catcher, he's got a big league ready bat right now so we can live with him behind the plate. Instant playoff appearance.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Sep 4, 2016 -> 03:02 PM) Then we need to be happy with 3rd and 4th place finishes. Because sticking your fingers in your ears and pretending that injuries don't happen does not actually prevent injuries. Every single year there's a team like this. The Cardinals were banged up to hell and back last year and won 100 games. The Dodgers have basically lost their entire starting rotation this year. And of course you ignored the note about the Indians losing Brantley, some of their starters for short stints, and Byrd. But please, tell me again how the White Sox lost 20% fewer games to the DL this year than the Royals but the Royals and Indians are these payroll juggernauts and the White Sox can't compete with them financially. You left out the Almonte PEDs suspension. Carrasco was also hurt in the first half, but of course they had the depth in their rotation to replace him with Bauer. KC lost four All-Stars...our guys missing time were the likes of Davidson, Kevan Smith, Tilson, Jason Coats, Avila and Austin Jackson. If the loss of Avila, Jackson and two middling relievers kills you...good luck.

Injuries are not what cost the White Sox this year...it was the complete lack of depth and quality in their minor league system that has absolutely killed them. None of the players we lost were any better than replacement level...the big problem is the ones who came next were even worse. Shields just compounded the problem.

All three AL Central teams have lost more significant pieces for a longer amount of time than the Sox... The Tigers are going to get the wild card after losing JD Martinez for half the season. Castellanos has been out now as well. They lost their CFers. Zimmermann. Etc. The Royals were making a charge until they lost Lorenzo Cain this week for the second time this season. They've missed Davis, Cain, Gordon, Moustakas, etc., for long stretches of this season.

QUOTE (DrunkBomber @ Sep 4, 2016 -> 09:39 AM) Every single post youve made is completely irrelevant to what Im talking about. I know you want to move the conversation to something you can argue about but Im not interested. Comparing Harry S. Truman's financial situation in 1952 to the extremely complicated, globalized financial world of today is equally irrelevant imo. Obviously you have an axe to grind on this issue like Greg with Hillary. Good luck finding a receptive audience. There's 40-45% of the US who hate the Clintons and another 50-60% who hate Trump. Nobody's going tonchange their mind on that family with 35+ years of public information to sift through.

QUOTE (JUSTgottaBELIEVE @ Sep 4, 2016 -> 09:26 AM) And yet none of those guys are free agents until after NEXT season. Why the big rush to dump them this season? I see nothing wrong with holding these guys and making a few acquisitions in the offseason to go for it again. If they are out of the race again next trade deadline then dump them at that time. If they are in the same position again next season and hold guys like Melky until season end with nothing in return, then I will criticize their "all in" approach. Until then I see nothing wrong with signing guys like Moreland, Volquez, Wieters, etc since they won't cost a draft pick nor will they cost big money. Maybe just maybe they catch some breaks and it all comes together like 2005. If not, wave the white flag next July and unload anything of value set to expire at the end of the season. This kind of seems like the definition of insanity since it has only worked twice in the past 15 years...and the talent depth/payrolls of the rest of the AL Central has never been more stacked against the Sox in the Reinsdorf Era as it is right now. When you have three better teams...and a fanbase who wont get excited by even a wildcard run, and limited financial resources going into the toughest free agent market in history. And you keep assumung Volquez is available when KC has spent a lot more on Medlen and Young. They'll think long and hard before declining that option...based on where Vargas is in his rehab/recovery. You can never have too much pitching.

Why don't we qualify like the Cardinals and Tigers do for those mid and small market compensation picks if our operating revenue is in the 20's? Just curious.

QUOTE (DrunkBomber @ Sep 4, 2016 -> 09:24 AM) This is what Im talking about, as I posted this in my first post about this topic. But how many former presidents have ever run a worldwide charity after leaving office? Carter never ran Habitat for Humanity. Harry Truman was a farmer who never cared about the trappings of office, so the pension was a lifesaver. Certainly the Founding Fathers never conceived of the dollar figures of today...or even projecting from the standard of living in the 1950's compared to today. Same for Nixon as well, although that's another debate.

Well, Harrelson did make national news by equating Frazier and Bryant despite 200+ OPS differential.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 4, 2016 -> 09:09 AM) The also wouldn't be anywhere without a guy named Miguel Cabrera who they backed up the farm system for, and signed two huge deals with. The White Sox had an equal opportunity to trade for him...but failed to have the right pieces in their system. You could argue just as easily making great moves for Kinsler, Iglesias, JD Martinez and Victor Martinez...not to mention Price, who was turned into Fulmer. It's not the owner's fault he wants to win...it's almost like you're blaming Ilich for overspending. The difference is JR is always businessman first, hence the departure of Buehrle. He's loyal, yes, but only when 100% comfortable with the cost. Ilich is fan first, profitability second.

QUOTE (DrunkBomber @ Sep 4, 2016 -> 08:30 AM) You need to read what I said for the third time. Im not trying to argue semantics. Its about using tax payer money to help pay employees. Why is that so hard for you to understand? Who are you talking about? Huma Abedin? Before, the argument was about Bill Clinton subsidizing salaries...why is that a problem as well? As Strangesox notes, every 501 c 3 in the US takes advantage of a government loophole, whether it's the United Way, Red Cross or Big Brothers/Big Sisters of America. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americans_f...ax_Reform"]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americans_for_Tax_Reform They get a tax exemption to fight against the very idea of ever raising any tax, anywhere, ever again...isn't that a bit ironic? The government is "protecting" the very same entity that's attacking it.

One of the main reasons they're contending is Fulmer. That's without a significant contribution from Daniel Norris, and then Boyd's been okay as well. Without that talent infusion in the pitching department via the trade market (and the decision to fold in July 2015 despite having Price and Cespedes), they'd be a .500ish team right now. Their record certainly isn't where it is because of Upton. Of course, the problem is that Frazier, Melky and Robertson don't bring you back as much as two superstars near their primes.