Chicago White Sox

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Nov 19, 2015 -> 12:23 PM) Then we have a bad hitter who plays good defense instead of a bad hitter who plays bad defense. The REAL plan should be to move Avi and then try to upgrade over Thompson the rest of the offseason, falling back on Thompson if necessary. 100% agree with this.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Nov 19, 2015 -> 08:39 AM) Walker is WAY better than both Sanchez and Johnson. It's fine to say you don't want to give up the assets to get him, but let's not pretend it wouldn't be a substantial upgrade. Has anyone said he wasn't?

QUOTE (Dunt @ Nov 19, 2015 -> 07:51 AM) I dont think you'd have to give up a lot of valuable trade chips for Walker If that's the case, then he becomes more attractive, but I'm still hesitant spending $10M on a 2B when have several passable options at that position and much bigger holes to fill.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Nov 19, 2015 -> 07:22 AM) Agree with this. Schwarber, Torres, and Contreras for Quintana is a deal I'd make. Cubs and Sox aren't trading with each other though. I'd do that deal as well. I agree though, don't see a trade between us and the Cubs.

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Nov 19, 2015 -> 12:59 AM) I don't understand the obsession with Schwarber. Right, I get it, he has a thunderous bat. But he is also a DH. And he is going to be figured out by pitchers. Look at his numbers as the season went on, month by month.... June - .364 AVG, .982 OPS July - .302 AVG, .900 OPS August - .221 AVG, .861 OPS Sept/Oct - .208 AVG, .741 OPS He started to get HR happy and his average plummeted. He is a right-handed Mark Trumbo. I think it's a bit crazy to call him a "right-handed Mark Trumbo" because his numbers declined over the course of his rookie season. Like all young players, he'll need to make adjustments, but the power & on-base skills are legit. He has a chance to be one of the best hitters in baseball, something our system doesn't currently have in the pipeline. What I don't get is the love for Jorge Soler. Dude put up Avi-like numbers last year, is a horrible defender (poor instincts), and is made of glass. If he's the centerpiece of a Quintana trade, you're very likely going to be on the losing end of the deal.

No way in hell do I trade Montas or Johnson for Walker.

I don't think Montas is anywhere close to a finished product, but I'd seriously considering moving him now due to health & durability concerns. His weight & knee issues are more worrisome to me than his ability to improve his control, add movement to his fastball, and/or refine his secondary offerings. Not saying he's definitely going to break-down, but he's a high-risk prospect from a health standpoint and a guy that might be at peak value as some teams likely believe he can still be a starter. If you can use him as a major piece in a trade for a bat, then I say do it.

QUOTE (OmarComing25 @ Nov 18, 2015 -> 06:20 PM) I wouldn't mind a Baez gamble either, but not as a centerpiece to a Quintana trade, no thank you. Also for those who want Schwarber, Quintana should not be traded for a DH projected at 2 WAR and with whom we would still royally suck against LHP. Maybe if other pieces came with Schwarber, but I feel like the Cubs would push for a 1-to-1 swap. 100% agree. I still think a Quintana for Schwarber & Baez trades makes sense for both teams. Don't think it will happen though.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Nov 18, 2015 -> 05:57 PM) Prospects are currency. I understand that you disagree...you only want to look retrospectively. There is an opportunity cost as well. He overpaid for Garcia (yes it worked out; top 10 prospect in baseball and a starting catcher can fetch more than a mid rotation starter), Vasquez, Ritchie, Swisher (and then turned around and gave him away for non-prospects), Jackson, et al. Dude, Freddy Garica was 10th in pitching WAR in 2004. Stop with this mid rotation bulls***. He was a key contributer on a World Series winnig team, the trade is more than justified. And that doesn't include the below market extension he signed (which was a major reason we traded for him) and the fact that he eventually brought us back Gio Gonzalez & Gavin Floyd.

QUOTE (elrockinMT @ Nov 18, 2015 -> 05:24 PM) we can win it all in 2016 with the team we have Lol..no we can't. I appreciate the optimism, but saying no changes are necessary is border-lining on insanity.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Nov 18, 2015 -> 05:11 PM) That's twice I've seen him packaged with Sale and Eaton. Lol Even if we were to move them it'd be in seperate deals to maximize value. Pretty sure SoxPride made both proposals.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ Apr 7, 2012 -> 07:53 AM) Carlos Sanchez, especially if he can play a solid 2B. He doesn't turn 20 until June yet he's already displayed a high a walk-rate for a Latin prospect. He may not have a ton of speed, but I like that he's a switch hitter. I think he has the tools to become a very good #2 hitter down the road for us. Looks like I did pretty good

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 18, 2015 -> 06:14 AM) Precisely the reason. They gave up a ton of prospects. They aren't going to empty the cupboard. I don't see them giving up the chips it would take to get Sale, but I definitely see them trading for a starter.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 17, 2015 -> 09:27 PM) Boston will not trade a boatload of prospects for Sale. Why? They just traded a boatload of prospects for a closer.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Nov 15, 2015 -> 11:02 PM) Trading Eaton certainly would create a hole at leadoff. But it would improve CF. Outfield D was a big problem with this team last year. As for Eaton's value, you tell me. Let's compare him to his greatness: Cargo = 2.4 WAR, 2 years of control at a bargain price of $18.5 million per annum Eaton = 3.6 WAR, 6 years of control at around $7 mill per year. Heck, if the CW on this board is correct that the the value of Cargo's 2.4 war (plus someone to root for in home run derby) is a multiplie player package of any decent prospect(s) we have except for Fulmer/Anderson, the Eaton return might plug 4 holes As usual, the problem with your logic is that prospects more often than not flop. Getting four prospects for Eaton (your hypothetical deal) doesn't mean we just plugged four holes. In fact, the odds are probably better you end up with a goose egg than even plugging two holes. I get why you hate "hero worshipping" so much, you seem to think all prospects are sure things.

QUOTE (HickoryHuskers @ Nov 15, 2015 -> 11:20 AM) I'm not worried about something on this scale happening in the US. In a similar concert venue in the US, those terrorists kill at most ten people before concert-goers who are carrying take them out. In Europe, citizens aren't carrying so there's nobody to stop them from shooting the body count up to a hundred. I really hope this a joke.

Pitch recognition is incredibly difficult to learn in the majors. If that was his only flaw, I'd be all for giving him another season to see if he can take that next step. Unfortunately, his defense is so bad there simply isn't enough upside to warrant another 600 plate appearances. Given his tools, there's always a chance he puts it all together and makes you look stupid, but based everything we've seen the odds appear to be very small. Trade his ass while a more traditional front office still see potential.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Nov 12, 2015 -> 11:16 AM) From what Hayes said, the Sox aren't too keen about dealing Q. He is the young cost-controlled they and every team desires. It would take a mint to pry him away. I agree, don't think they want to deal him, but they need to at least see what his market is. We should only trade him if we're blown away, and quite frankly, very few teams are even capable of that. With the amount of pitching available in free agency, I doubt it happens though.

QUOTE (raBBit @ Nov 12, 2015 -> 10:29 AM) Sox have never been afraid of moving an arm they want to get out in front of. McCarthy and Santiago both come to mind. Johnson was incredible in AAA though so maybe they can sell him off that. His stats look very good but they really don't do him he justice. He was the best pitcher on a rate basis as well as on a prolific basis. Knowing how Hahn operates, Johnson was getting scouted when he pitched in September. Given the spontaneity of pitchers (relative to hitters), I would prefer the Sox move pitching for young bats and sign lower tier SP(s) like Y2Jimmy0 suggested. The offensive landscape in FA lacks fits outside of the top guys who's price rules them out. It's interesting, the Sox have never really bought pitching ever. Obviously they excel in making pitching, but they've never even signed even a mid tier SP since who? Jamie Navarro? They've filled out the rotation with scrap heap guys like Paulino, Humber, old Freddy, old Colon and if you want to go back far enough Esteban Loaiza. Sox are probably looking at E. Johnson, Quintana, Montas and maybe Fulmer as the guys to potentially move to fix the offense. It seems like they want to move Johnson, and they've never been that outwardly confident about him, but past him, I think whoever they move is dependent on return more than the individual pitcher but I hear the Sox are considering anything and everything. There's an argument that all four guys could be at the height of their value too. Johnson was just best pitcher in AAA. Quintana is 9th in fWAR since 2012. Montas coming off the last season he'll have a Mid tier options: Fister Latos Rich Hill Brett Anderson Cliff Lee Scrap heap types: Beachy Cahill Bud Norris I think Fulmer is pretty much untouchable, but I agree otherwise. My guess is they'll take offers on Q first, and if they're not blown away, use Johnson & Montas to add some offense. Either way, frees up a spot for one of those mid-tier free agents, who make a ton of sense for the reasons you identified. Also, Anderson got a QO, so you can definitely cut him from the list of potential pickups.

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Nov 11, 2015 -> 11:36 PM) There's only a few I'd give it up for. Heyward, Upton, Cespedes....maybe and a small maybe with Wieters. Cespedes doesn't require a pick.

QUOTE (ChiSox59 @ Nov 11, 2015 -> 09:07 PM) I don't think that gets you to the final table, and that's why the Sox will and should pass. I'll go Alexei Ramirez 1/$7M. I think they'll do more, obviously, but that's what I see as most likely. Not suggesting I would make that move, but I don't think that number is that far off. Fangraphs has him signing for six years and around $21M to $22M AAV.

Cespedes 6/$126M

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 11, 2015 -> 08:30 PM) It is the Debt/Value(%) I see it now by going to full site. Regardless, they still have the largest debt load (which is what I said) and likely the most interest expense as a result (which impacts their spending). Having the 5th highest debt ratio doesn't change that fact.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 11, 2015 -> 07:00 PM) I count five teams who have a higher debt/valuation ratio. http://www.forbes.com/mlb-valuations/list/ Maybe because on I'm on my phone, but all I see are valuations there. Where are the debt numbers?

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 10, 2015 -> 12:59 PM) Personally, I think that article is full of s***. Their ceiling isn't $130 million unless ownership is putting $100 million into their pockets. The profited $70 million in 2014, and the number 2015 will be even bigger. That was before interest expense and they have the biggest debt load in baseball.