Chicago White Sox

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Jan 24, 2017 -> 10:18 AM) I really think if it came to it I'd be content telling Pirates they need to go depth if they're not including Meadows or Bell. Something like Glasnow/Newman/Hayes/Diaz with the possibility of Keller would be a phenomenal deal. Which tells me I'm looking at a deal that wouldn't be offered. I'd do Glasnow/Keller/Newman/Hayes in a heartbeat, but it seems like a ridiculous ask IMO.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jan 24, 2017 -> 04:10 AM) http://www.royalsreview.com/2017/1/24/1436...nfirmed-reports Horrible if true. f***ing disgusting.

QUOTE (fathom @ Jan 23, 2017 -> 08:54 PM) One guy has a reputation as being a great teammate and one has a pretty awful one Exactly, I actually view this as a plus. Sometimes you need players to police their own clubhouse and I would applaud Frazier for telling the guy who called Drake LaRoche a leader to STFU.

QUOTE (Con te Giolito @ Jan 23, 2017 -> 08:41 PM) This will definitely help move Frazier ? I'm a huge Eaton fan, but he obviously has a questionable clubhouse reputation. I'll go out on a limb here and say that if there was any beef between Todd & Adam, Frazier wasn't the one at fault. And regardless, this will have no impact on Frazier's value.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 23, 2017 -> 08:01 PM) Forsythe had put up some pretty impressive war numbers when healthy...has that Maddon/TB positionally flexibility Friedman still apparently covets, and Kiki Hernandez was brutal last year in that role. Also seems like the Twins overplayed their hand. What do they do with Dozier now? They still can't compete with him, and won't pay him to forego free agency. They'll deal Dozier at the deadline, just got to hope there are more suitors at that time.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jan 23, 2017 -> 09:33 AM) Also what's funny is whining about the ranking when it's largely a very positive write-up. Who is whining about the ranking?

Will be there on Saturday with my three year old son. This will be his third SoxFest and hope to keep this as an annual tradition, although his mom being a diehard Cubs fan complicates matters.

Would be interested to know where Law had Schwarber ranked the year after he was drafted. I think most experts agree Collins has a better chance of sticking at catcher than Scwarber. #95 feels a bit low to me.

QUOTE (Con te Giolito @ Jan 22, 2017 -> 10:30 PM) No way you can say Q is a top 10 pitcher in MLB unless you are just an all out slave to WAR. Nothing against him, but he's not that guy. Top 20 is a bit of a different story, I think I could come up with 20 pitchers I'd rather have in 2017 tbh. Dude, you're nuts if you think there are 20 better starters than Quintana.

QUOTE (SCCWS @ Jan 22, 2017 -> 01:58 PM) I think it is getting to the point where a full tear down will not happen or was not the plan. I can see holding out on Q but I think the fact that none of the 2nd tier players have been traded is a sign that the goal was to unload Eaton and Sale. Maybe that was a compromise between Hahn wanting a full tear and KW wanting a half-tear. Which second tier guys should have been traded? No reason to sell low on Abreu, Frazier, or Robertson. No one was trading for Melky when comparable players are available via free agency for less. The only guy that would give me any cause for concern is Jones and I think an argument could made that his value increases significantly with some closing experience. A big chunk of these guys will be moved during the season. If this was another re-tool, they'd be filling some holes with legit players and reclamation projects.

QUOTE (SleepyWhiteSox @ Jan 22, 2017 -> 01:02 PM) Baseball should do it because it's the right thing to do. But they'll ultimately do it because it's the right PR move and, ultimately, they're protecting their assets. And how many workplace's employees are worth hundreds upon hundreds of millions in revenue? Certainly not you or me, so it's silly to compare MLB with the average workplace. As to your "question," the minute MLB pays me, I'll come up with a comprehensive alcohol and drug education/prevention program. Do what exactly? Hire babysitters to watch these guys? Force them to take cabs everywhere? Seriously, what is MLB "ultimately going to do" that makes any difference. Don't hide behind this "the minute MLB pays me" nonsense, use some common sense and try to come up with some ideas that could help. You'll quickly find that there isn't much of anything MLB could do that would result in material change. Again, this isn't a baseball issue, it's something much broader that's impacting numerous people in countries like the Dominican Repulbic & Venezuela.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 22, 2017 -> 12:52 PM) They should tell them not to drive fast, and don't drink and drive. It will stop immediately. I am with you, what can be said? They have examples and it continues. I am sure they get some sort of counseling anyway, but nothing competes with the naitivity and indestructible feeling of youth. When I was 15 one of my best friends hopped in a car to go home after school with a guy who just got his license . The driver drove like an idiot, hit a light pole,and my buddy is severely brain damaged for life. Even after that, when I got my license, I drove like an idiot, drove drunk several times, and got lucky nothing happened. Now I won't drive if I have 1 beer. But most of us are in the same boat. when you are that age, bad s*** isn't going to happen to you. Even if it is happening all around you. 100% agree. Young people do stupid s*** and nothing MLB can do will stop that. And it does sound like MLB educates these guys already about various offseason dangers based on an article posted in this thread. There isn't really much else they can do.

QUOTE (SleepyWhiteSox @ Jan 22, 2017 -> 12:15 PM) What are the numbers of DUI deaths in other sports? And it's not their responsibility based on what other than your opinion? What employers are responsible for their employees' reckless behavior outside of the workplace? Why do you think baseball players deserve special treatment? Maybe the countries with the highest auto-based mortality rates should take some accountability here. This issue goes well beyond the world of baseball. And you still didn't answer what kind of support MLB should provide to help curb this issue.

QUOTE (flavum @ Jan 22, 2017 -> 11:19 AM) It's true, but it's another opportunity to educate and have the discussion. After the discussion, it's up to the individual. I think your idea to educate guys on the risks is fine, but after that I don't see how MLB should have any involvement.

QUOTE (SleepyWhiteSox @ Jan 22, 2017 -> 11:08 AM) MLB needs to do what's right and actually intervene and set up a comprehensive program to educate and support the players. It's not enough to just bring em over and fill their pockets. What do you mean support the players? Young people do reckless s***, whether they're baseball players or not. MLB will never be able to change that and quite frankly it's not their responsibly to do so.

QUOTE (KyYlE23 @ Jan 22, 2017 -> 10:02 AM) Holy s***, him and Andy Marte in one night? Sounds like it was the same crash.

QUOTE (WBWSF @ Jan 22, 2017 -> 08:54 AM) Rumor has it that the White Sox are trying to sign Matt Wieters. I would think that if this is going to happen it would happen this week right before Soxfest. Why before SoxFest? We're rebuilding, I'm not sure how adding Wieters would generate much excitement.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Jan 21, 2017 -> 06:29 PM) Was Addison Reed? Betances? Giles? Usually those guys end up 75-100 but not much higher...although, with the new elevated focus on multiple inning elite relievers, you'd think some theoretically could be at least in the 60-75 range. Reed was ranked #66 in 2011. Betances was ranked three different times, but he was also a starter I believe. No go on Giles.

I just don't get how Burdi isn't a top 100 prospect. The guy has the chance to be an elite closer and his floor is probably an elite setup man. Not suggesting he should be a top 50 or even 75 guy, but to not crack the list is crazy to me.

And just to support the idea Hahn has likely received some strong offers for Quintana, below is a tweet from rumbunter that I pulled from a conversation with our own Y2Jimmy & ChiSoxMike: Now for some back-story, rumbunter believes Meadows & Bell are off the table, but has hinted at offers built around Glasnow & Newman. My best guess at the offer he's implying in his tweet would be something Glasnow, Keller, & Newman. That's three top 50 prospects, including one who is considered a top 10 prospect by many publications. I'd probably need Bell instead of Keller to make a deal, but the point is that's a pretty strong offer. By all means, it's not a perfect offer as we'd ideally like an elite positional prospect like Meadows as the headliner. So here's my question for the people who say Hahn should wait it out until his demands are met. Would you pass up on an offer of Glasnow, Bell, & Newman right now? Would that be considered settling if Hahn has his sights on prospects like Meadows, Torres, Frazier, etc? I'm just interested in hearing everyone's thoughts here, because that's an offer I would accept in a heartbeat.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 21, 2017 -> 04:37 PM) You think he will all of a sudden get lucky with Eaton out of RF and Avi in? They most likely will trade him pretty soon IMO, but this is a bad team. Probably as bad as they were in 2013 when they were 12-20 in Q's starts. .375 winning pct x 162= 60 wins. Every White Sox pitcher who has pitched well the last 4 years has been considered unlucky. They will be again in 2017 with an offense that was horrible with Eaton, and now doesn't have him, and hasn't added anyone of significance to the 2017 line up. I know you are all for taking less now, but that is silly. The Sox got Frank Thomas with the 7th pick. If they were selecting earlier, they would have drafted Jeff Jackson. Having the higher pick is more desireable, however, it doesn't guarantee the better player. I would rather they hold out for better players that have already developed. You are all over the place though. Need to dump him because he might get hurt or start sucking. Need to dump him for whatever you can get now because he is so good your draft position is going to change significantly if he is kept. Well, if that is the case, you will more than make up for it with the increased package he would command at that time. Lol...not once have I ever suggested we dump Quintana for whatever we can get now. I've repeatedly said DO NOT ACCEPT A CRAP OFFER. My point has been consistent throughout this thread: Hahn should not pass on a strong offer today, in hopes of a perfect offer later. If he's not getting a strong offer now, then by all means wait until the deadline. I just find it hard to believe in what is considered the worst free agent market for starting pitchers in baseball history that not one single team would be willing pony up and make a strong offer. Obviously this is 100% speculation on my part, but it serves as the basis of my underlying argument. You suggesting that I think we should dump him for whatever we can get is straight up disingenuous and a pretty cowardly way to deflect attention from an absolutely terrible post. As for this "all over the place" nonsense, complex decisions require the consideration of all relevant factors. The three factors I've said over and over again are as follows. 1) No guarantee that waiting results in a better return (assuming a strong offer exists today) 2) Waiting results in additional risk whether injury, under-performance, or changes in market dynamics (the amount of risk is up for debate) 3) Waiting potentially results in opportunity costs in terms of draft position and the length of our competitive window. If you disagree with any of the points above, by all means dispute them. There are plenty of posters on the other side of this argument that have made fair counter-points against them. But suggesting I'm all over the place because I'm using multiple factors to support my argument is beyond ridiculous.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 21, 2017 -> 03:49 PM) The Sox are 58-74 in games Q starts the last 4 years. Taking Eaton out of the offense, I don't think if they keep him during the season(which I doubt) will make much difference in where they ultimately draft. So basically you're two arguments are as follows: 1) Since Quintana has been one of the unluckiest pitchers in baseball history, it's safe to assume he'll continue to be one in 2017 2) Despite the difference of the 8th & 2nd picks being three wins last year, no one player can have any impact on draft position whatsoever Please confirm that I'm not misinterpreting your post, because the above is exactly what it sounds like.

QUOTE (Con te Giolito @ Jan 21, 2017 -> 03:24 PM) They simply aren't as motivated to deal Quintana as they were Eaton and Sale. Hell, they are more reluctant to give up Robertson and Melky than they were those two. I really hope they snap out of it and do what's right, there is still time, but right now it's clear some non baseball issues are governing baseball moves. Reluctant to give up Robertson & Melky? Those guys have no markets right now. I think you're really reaching here. This idea they faked a rebuild in order to trade the pro-LaRoche crowd is tinfoil hat crazy.

QUOTE (Soha @ Jan 21, 2017 -> 02:28 PM) The bummer for me is they haven't ripped this down anywhere near close enough to be in the Seth Beer sweepstakes. Frazier, Cabrera, Abreu...they're all still here and will help win many games this coming season. So it's more looking like a partial rebuild than a full rebuild, which is a little disappointing. The team is going to suck regardless, but right now as the roster stands, I don't see a chance at the 1st or 2nd pick. And something conveniently ignored by the "wait" crowd is how much more valuable those first few picks are from a historical perspective than other 1st rounders. Who here thinks the Cubs win the World Series last year without Kris Bryant? A guy like Seth Beer could have a similar kind of impact for us and trading Quintana would greatly improve our odds of drafting such a player. Again, I'm not suggesting taking a crap offer, but the decision to trade Q now or wait and hope for a better offer later better consider that opportunity cost. The decision should also consider what waiting does to our competitive window and the value of other assets. Rodon & Anderson are already up. Moncada, Giolito, Lopez, Fulmer, & Burdi should be up by June or July. That's a huge part of our core and the clock starts ticking this year. Pushing back a Quintana trade until the deadline will likely result in prospects further away from helping, which means it could be several years until they are productive major leaguers supplementing our existing core. That pushes back our competitive window and forces us to waste valuable seasons out of key assets while we're waiting for reinforcements to arrive. Just another opportunity cost that must be factored in when deciding whether to sell now or hold off in hopes for more down the road.

QUOTE (WBWSF @ Jan 21, 2017 -> 08:32 AM) The 2017 White Sox team is going to be a train wreck. The team has 4 major holes at catcher, CF, Rf and DH. Plus they just traded one of the best pitchers in MLB (Sale). They have done NOTHING to improve this team this off season. After Frazier + Cabrera leave after the 2017 season the 2018 White Sox team will even be worse than the 2017 team. My only hope for the team is that after the 2018 season (hopefully before that) JR sells the team. It's called a rebuild bro, they're supposed to suck.