Chicago White Sox

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 25, 2016 -> 02:36 PM) Why wouldn't he fit at 3B? Long term, that is his best value. If 3B is his better position, then I'm totally cool with that. All I was trying to get at is that guys like Saladino & Sanchez are not big enough prospects to have an any impact on the decision.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 25, 2016 -> 02:28 PM) I do. But I would rather be stable at 3B than 2B. If it happens, I would rather have a guy like Bregman stable at one position, than to have him moving to another to accommodate. If Saladino were to get hurt, we have a guy like Carlos Sanchez who could step in at 2B much easier than 3B. But why does it matter? Next year will be a lost season, might as well keep Bregman where he best fits long-term. If Sanchez or Davidson has to play some 3B, who really cares, neither of these guys is going to be a starter on our next competitive team.

QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Nov 25, 2016 -> 08:45 AM) Yeah nothing wrong with "just" being a reliever nowadays. He can be very valuable to the team as either the closer or a multi inning reliever. Obviously the pitching coaches and scouts would know best, but just seems like a square peg in round hole trying to make him a starter to me. It's fine if he ultimately ends up as a reliever, but we're going to need starters from somewhere and he's still our best hope of becoming one at the moment. Let's give him every opportunity to become one in 2017. Next year should be a lost season, so having a compentant bullpen should be the least of our problems.

It will be interesting to see what the Sox do with both Fulmer & Burdi. I strongly believe the Sox will be trading Sale, Gonzalez, & Robertson this offseason, leaving them with only Quintana, Rodon, & Shields in the rotation and only Jones as a true back-end reliever. And while I expect the Sox to a major league ready pitcher to step in for Sale, there should still be an opening in the rotation and the need for a high leverage reliever. Based on how this front office has operated in the past, it's got to be extremely tempting for the Sox use Fulmer & Burdi to plug these holes. However, I think both should start 2017 in AAA and be used as starters. Fulmer clearly wasn't ready for the majors last year and I don't want to see up until he proves himself in AAA in addition to his service resetting to the point where 2017 doesn't count as full year of control. As for Burdi, the Sox should try to do everything in their power to make him a starter before settling for a reliever. Even if the experiment ultimately fails, it will be good for the development of his secondary offerings and gets him some more seasoning.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Nov 25, 2016 -> 07:02 AM) Why do some people who want Bregman want to play him at third? He'd be far more valuable at a middle infield position. He just played more 3B than second the last year and a half because of Correa and Altuve. You're right, he probably makes the most sense at 2B for us. In all honesty, we shouldn't play him at 3B to give lesser guys like Saladino or Sanchez the job at 2B. Play him where his best long-term fit and worry about the other position later. And while this is both a bit far-fetched and premature, Machado & Donaldson will be free agents after the 2018 season. We don't have to fill every spot with a long-term solutions immediately. If a rebuild is done right, we should have plenty of financial & prospect resources to plug holes in a few years.

Sale - Goes Quintana - Stays Robertson - Goes Fraizer - Goes Jones - Stays Abreu - Stays Melky - Goes Eaton - Stays Jennings - Goes

QUOTE (greg775 @ Nov 24, 2016 -> 03:12 PM) I would think with a 2 million vote lead and the corruption that exists, Hillary may win. I'd give her odds of 50/50 minimum maybe 60/40 she is our next President. How can anyone read this nonsense and actually believe Greg isn't a troll?

QUOTE (SouthSideSale @ Nov 24, 2016 -> 02:55 PM) Who would ya'll rather have Benintendi package from Boston or Bregman package from Houston? I actually would really love to see an Anderson and Bregman infield for the next 6 years at least. As much as I love Benintendi, I'd probably go with a Bregman led package. Houston has a much deeper system IMO and could provide several high-end prospects in addition to Bregman. They also have much more interesting secondary pieces that can fill the back-end of a deal.

QUOTE (striker @ Nov 24, 2016 -> 11:30 AM) It will be interesting to see what window of contention the Sox aim for based on their trades. The Ranger's prospects appear to be farther from the majors than what the Astros or Dodgers can offer. But that also aligns more with the talent in their pipeline It does? Fulmer, Burdi, Collins, Adams, Stephens, & Michalczewski will all be in AA and above. If you throw in Peter, that's seven of our top 10 prospects (let me point I don't consider him a top 10 guy). The other three guys are Hansen, Fisher, & Call and they could all start 2017 in A+ and be fast movers. The next tier of prospects are predominantly in AA and above as well (Engel, May, Tilson, Danish, Guerrero). Honestly, the vast majority of our minor league talent is about a year or two out.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Nov 24, 2016 -> 09:22 AM) Don't count out the Rangers also making a serious bid for Sale. Darvish will be a free agent soon and they'd like to max his last year by adding Sale and making a very serious run this year. The 2 horse race will have at least 4 teams running neck and neck down the stretch. This race has only just reached the 1/4 pole . Just don't see what the Rangers could offer that bests the Astros, Dodgers, or Red Sox. I'd basically need Odor, Mazara, Gallo, & a couple of their best pitching prospects and simply don't see them moving two guys off their major league roster. Texas really blew it because they traded away a lot of talent to get Lucroy & Beltran. They could have probably built a package if they still had all those prospects.

Coats is definitely a guy you consider giving an everyday role to in a rebuilding year. Obviously you got to see who is traded and who we get back in return, but Coats has enough of a prospect pedigree to get an extended look. I don't really see him ending up as a regular, but stranger things have happened.

QUOTE (hi8is @ Nov 24, 2016 -> 01:18 AM) Why no Martes? Because I think Bregman, Reed, & Tucker is already a huge ask. Let them keep Martes in exchange for Paulino if that's what it takes to get a deal done. That's not to say Hahn shouldn't be pushing for him at the start of negotiations.

My dream trade with the Astros is Sale for Bregman, Reed, Tucker, Paulino, & Stubbs. That would be an absolute haul IMO, alllowing us to fill three holes (2B, 1B, & SP) immediately and potentially have CF & C solutions down the road.

QUOTE (ChiliIrishHammock24 @ Nov 24, 2016 -> 12:41 AM) How the hell do you know? So if Luhnow comes calling with the deal, Hahn's reaction should be.... "Well, we obviously love Bregman, he's legit. Martes and Tucker are two great prospects we'd love to have.....BUT DEVENSKI? f*** YOU BRO. YUCKY POO POO, NEVER CALL ME AGAIN!" So fine, swap out Devenski for their 15th best prospect, it's nothing worth being so hung up over. Well Devenski just put up a 2.8 fWAR season, so I'm pretty confident they'd sell him as an important piece. Having said that, I don't see why a contending team would want to give up a key reliever in the first place. And I'm not sure what the point of your mock conversation is. Like I said, give me a different piece than Devenski. If I were Hahn I'd demand someone like A.J Reed instead. This is called negotiations, you don't have to take the first offer like your little mock conversation suggests.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Nov 24, 2016 -> 12:31 AM) Devenski makes no sense because: 1) We already have Fulmer, Burdi, Stephens, Hansen and Adams for those innings (now and in the future). (Or Shields). 2) Taking him back would make the White Sox look a bit like they made a mistake in the first place. 3) You gamble on position players with higher ceilings/bust rates at the lower levels of the minors before trading for players on the major league roster that you're more than likely just going to try to flip anyway. While #2 is nonsense, I agree with you on #1 & #3. We have much bigger needs to worry about than middle relief.

QUOTE (ChiliIrishHammock24 @ Nov 24, 2016 -> 12:22 AM) How is he a key piece? Because his name was listed second? I think that was done by the poster simply because he is the 2nd best major leaguer in that deal, the other 2 are prospects. In 2015 he started 22 games and threw 139 innings. In 2016 with the Astros, he spot started 5 games and threw 108 innings. He's no more of a reliever than Hector Santiago was with us, and he's thrown 180+ IP each of the last 3 years. At worst, Devenski could be a 2-3 IP at a time guy, and that's only if the Sox don't give him a rotation spot once they move Sale and Quintana. Because there are four total players in that proposed trade and he's an established major leaguer to some extent. We'd be forgoing a pretty decent prospect by including him in the trade. And quite frankly, I'm not buying him putting up anywhere close to those numbers again. He still may be a solid reliever, but I'm skeptical he'll ever be an elite one again. Like I said, I just don't see the point of having be a key piece in a Chris Sale trade.

QUOTE (ChiliIrishHammock24 @ Nov 23, 2016 -> 11:55 PM) Guy on the Astros fan board that was posted early suggested this deal.... Bregman, Devenski, Martes and Kyle Tucker for Sale. Obviously Bregman is awesome. Was ranked anywhere from #22-#49 going in to 2016 before he had an incredible year. Martes is the 19th ranked prospect in baseball, Tucker is #46. And Devenski, whose best pro season came in 2016 in his rookie year when he had a 2.16 ERA, 8.6 K/9, 1.7 BB/9, and a WHIP of only 0.91, was actually drafted by the White Sox in the 25th round before he was TRADED to the Astros for....Brett Myers! Wheeeeeee. Anyway, I would take this deal for sure. Obviously Bregman is a stud, Martes is a top 20 prospect, Tucker is top 50, and Devenski could have figured it all out in the majors. Done deal. Why do we want Devenski and why would they want to give him up? Just don't see the benefit of a rebuilding team acquiring a reliever as a key piece. Give me Reed instead and I'd make that deal in a heartbeat.

QUOTE (Ro Da Don @ Nov 23, 2016 -> 11:00 PM) The outfield they have set up is absolute trash. Their 1B situation is set up as a damn Richie Schaffer/Dan Vogelbach platoon. Trading controllable youth for an inconsistent player in Segura who, by the way, expires in 2 years? Super Sox move. See: the Frazier trade and the Samardjiza trade. I don't disagree with what you're saying, but Walker has accomplished basically nothing. He obviously has a huge ceiling, but right now it doesn't look he's going to reach it. It's very possible they're selling high on Walker.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Nov 23, 2016 -> 10:36 PM) Walker still has a ton of upside, but it's in the same erratic/inconsistent way that Rodon does... Imagine if we got that return for, let's say, Rodon and Frazier (or Saladino), would anyone be happy? Segura was almost a non-tender guy last offseason and had a huge bounceback year, but can you count on that if you look at his numbers year by year? Rodon has shown signicantly more ability at the major league level. Not sure that's a great comparison.

QUOTE (PolishPrince34 @ Nov 23, 2016 -> 10:00 PM) Arizona won that deal!!! Did they?

QUOTE (PolishPrince34 @ Nov 23, 2016 -> 08:24 PM) Another example of why we need an overhaul with our pro scouting department. Avila, Navarro, Jackson, Latos, Rollins, Lawrie, Shields, and goes on and on over the recent years I'm pretty sure I heard Hahn or someone in the front office imply that they realized the pro scouting was an issue and changes would be made.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 23, 2016 -> 09:14 PM) You certainly cannot fault them if this is the ask though. Personally, and I raised this in another thread, with Bregman, it depends on what the Sox want to do with Anderson. It makes little sense for them to trade for him only to put him at 3b. Can Anderson play 2b? And what does that do to his value? Bregman may provide the most overall value at SS, but his bat profiles anywhere in the infield except 1B and I think he could be a plus defender at 3B or 2B. In other words, he shouls be incredibly valuable no matter where you play him. Honestly, I'd be absolutely ecstatic having a Anderson-Bregman middle infield combo for the next six years.

No offense guys, but the Astros aren't giving Springer & Bregman for Sale. If you honestly think that's possible, you're in for a world of dissapointment.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 23, 2016 -> 12:15 AM) You and I have been on much the same page for the last several months. I agree. But things change quickly. You might trade Sale first and then actually end up getting the same or better for Q. This thread itself is about an article making an argument for just that very thing. Oh I 100% agree with you. Quintana's market could completely change once Sale has been traded. The Sox should not have a firm stance on what they'll be doing with Quintana at this point in time. I'm ok if they think they'll end up keeping Q based on current market value, but they need to be open to trading him if the offers materially change after a Sale deal. No one in this organization should be off limits if the right offer comes along IMO. I just worry that Reinsdorf won't allow the front office to go full rebuild and will force them to hold onto a few of the big name guys despite some big offers.

QUOTE (iamshack @ Nov 22, 2016 -> 11:14 PM) One would think, but they should be letting the market define that. Well they've been having talks about these guys for months now. They should have a pretty good sense of what the markets are for each of them at this point. My guess is Quintana is signicantly undervalued relative to Sale.