Knackattack

I'll go for it... Sox trade: Erik Johnson, Micah Johnson, Frankie Montas and Avi Garcia to Oak Sox receive: Brett Lawrie, Josh Reddick & C Jacob Nottingham Sox trade: David Robertson to ChiCubs Sox receive: Starlin Castro & P Pierce Johnson Sox sign Mat Latos to 1yr/9mil contract with 12m option for 2017 Sox sign Joakim Soria to 2 yr/18M contract w/ 10M option for 2017

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Dec 3, 2015 -> 09:41 AM) So why show me Pitch F/X ? I don't see anything in what you showed me saying its used in pitch framing stats and even if it is why does the catcher get credit for it? Next year Flowers could be 20th in pitch framing for all we know. It's just another useless defensive stat based on judgment calls that you are saying "no I can tell you that catcher made the difference on that pitch being called a strike when he is only 1/3 of the people involved in that pitch with 100% accuracy. " This. Framing is an absolutely retarded stat and does absolutely nothing to justify Tyler Flowers playing baseball above AAA.

The past 3 seasons in 25 AB's with the bases loaded Tyler Flowers has 2 hits, 4 walks and 15K's for a .80/.258/.80 batting line... thats a .338 OPS. Just something fun to throw out there

I wouldn't really say Tyler Flowers has defensive value.. pitch framing metrics liked him but how much of this can be attributed to the fact that he had Sale and Quintana who have pretty spot on control throwing to him 2/5 days a week? Other than that I remember him as being clunky and bad behind the plate with a horrible arm..

I always liked Beckham and I think we definitely f***ed him up by rushing him to the majors. Will be a good glove man bouncing around the league for maybe the next 3-5 years I bet. Good luck Becks!

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Nov 30, 2015 -> 12:16 PM) Sanchez is only 23 and great with the glove which is why I'd like to see him continue to play 2B and get at bats to see if his bat improves during the '16 season. Plus, if necessary he can play SS. Saladino is the IF defensive Jack of all trades that every team looks for in a utility/platoon type player but if the Sox decide to roll with Saladino at SS i wont complain. Micah is expendable because he only plays 2B and his lousy there so unless the Sox give him time at DH, I see no point in keeping him if another team is interested in trading for him. What evidence do we have of Sanchez being able to play SS in a pinch? And Sanchez was abysmal with the bat last year, still grading out as a negative WAR player even with a 4.4 UZR rating... Micah should be given every opportunity to show that he can field 2b at an acceptable level because his bat's upside (not to mention his baserunning) makes his potential much higher than Sanchez'

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Nov 30, 2015 -> 11:30 AM) Yes I know what he is saying and what you are both implying is a hypothetical. How about the reverse hypothetical were you can't find a better 3rd baseman and the Sox traded away Micah and they have Sanchez hitting like crap and need to upgrade him offensively but can't do it within cause they traded the little depth that had now they have to go outside the organization to fI'll it. That's what I'm getting at to not trade the little depth the Sox have for middle infielders Oh right I see. Yeah I don't agree with trading Micah and I still think he should be starting at 2b next year if his defensive improves. Carlos is a solid infield backup but his bat will never warrant more than 50 starts a year.

This is a great deal. If platooned correctly we should have a really nice duo from behind the plate. Tyler is actually really useful if used as the RH part of a platoon with his occasional power and ability to handle Sale... it's just hard when a defensive minded backup C is expected to start.

I'm thinking LaRoche will bounce back next year to hit something like .250/.330/.430 w/ 20 homers. Konerko had a horrible year in the same fashion around that age and then bounced back to be himself again. Alex Rios had an abysmal year and then bounced back the next year. Adam Dunn had the worst season ever and then actually became a good DH. Players have bad years and LaRoche (as much as I hated this guy during the season) seems like just as good a candidate as any to be useful again.

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Nov 30, 2015 -> 09:04 AM) Yes I know he plays 2nd as well but the need of a 3rd baseman is now would have him playing there for now. I think he is saying that Lawrie would be acquired to be a 3rd baseman as of right now, but if we are suddenly in the hunt come July and a 3rd baseman that can hit falls into our laps.. you get him and move Lawrie to 2nd base

You know I'm thinking a route I haven't seen on the thread yet: Brett Lawrie for Avisail Garcia. Both teams swap young, cheap, underperforming players.

Reading that he is available. He shouldn't cost much and he swatted 16 homers last year, and prior to last year he has been a defensive wizard at 3rd. Just drunken spitballing on turkey day

Sorry for the ignorance but I can't find this anywhere on the internet

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Nov 13, 2015 -> 11:06 AM) Weiters accepts his QO. I'm not surprised, 16m, a chance to go into FA on a stronger year and he will only be 30. Baltimore had to have believed this was a strong option for him...

Avi just sucks. Even if he did figure out what pitches to hit his defense is so f***ing awful that he would probably grade out as a league average player. His best chance is to be traded and stuck in LF/DH by a club that is good at developing hitting.

I'm pretty sure the Sox will pull something similar to what they did with Orlando Cabrera and tell Jeff he is going to the 'pen if he accepts the offer lmao

They should just DFA flowers and make LaRoche catch next year. That way his bat would play to league average!

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Oct 28, 2015 -> 07:52 AM) I'm not looking to trade any of them. SP is a strength, but the "depth" is overstated, IMO. Sale is elite, Quintana is a great #2, Rodon is a 3 with big upside, Danks is an overpaid #5 man in our #4 hole, and Johnson is a 4/5 with the upside of a 3. Behind that, we have Fulmer and some prospects that certainly have upside but that look like they are most likely going to be relievers. 1. You cannot assume Fulmer is ready as quickly as Rodon was, and even if you DO, you have to remember that Rodon pitched like a back-end guy most of the season. 2. If you remove Quintana from that #2 slot due to a trade, the whole thing suddenly looks very shaky. I think Rodon will become a strong #2 at some point, but it's very much a question mark if that happens this year -- he still struggle with command frequently and control almost as often, and he needs to learn to trust his fastball. And until he does learn to trust his fastball, we're not going to know if it has enough movement to be a big pitch. If it doesn't his control suddenly has to get really good. He's got work to do. 3. Remove ANY of them for a significant injury -- even Danks -- and you're in trouble quickly. You could argue we need to ADD a starter or two, at least of the "one-year pillow contract" type. I like what you're saying here but I think the assessment of Rodon is way off and saying Fulmer is most likely a reliever is pretty ignorant as well.

He is bad but we don't have anything better unless Micah learns how to field and stay healthy.

Excuse my ignorance but what the hell made Harry and Jimmy such bad guys in Reinsdorf's book?

QUOTE (Vance Law @ Oct 9, 2015 -> 11:01 AM) I assume they will give LaRoche 6 or 8 weeks of playing against righties to see if he can hit like his old self. They'd get virtually nothing at all in cash relief or players by dumping him. Best upside is in seeing if he can hit righties and help the team or recoup some trade value. I have no problem with sending Avi to AAA to figure out how to defend and slug. This. If Micah Johnson looked like he had a clue at the plate and was sent down to work on defense, I don't see why Avi who didn't look like he had a clue wasn't sent down for the same reason.

Great to have him for the future. One of the bright spots in a dark time for us and a ray of hope with our continual luck with pitching.

The Sox should see what it takes to get Danny Valencia from Oakland to plug up 3B. I'd send Micah & Beck over there for him and that plugs a huge hole in the line-up with a decent defender. He is arb eligible this year and a free agent after next season, but he is a good candidate to take a team friendly 3 year deal IMO. My new off season plan... Trade Micah Johnson and Chris Beck to Oakland for Danny Valencia & LHP Fernando Abad Trade Adam LaRoche + 4m to Pirates for nothing. Trade Frankie Montas, Erik Johnson, Tyler Saladino and Avisail Garcia to Rockies for Carlos Gonzalez Sign Matt Wieters 1 yr/12m + 5 mil in health/performance incentives and a club option for 18m Sign Ian Kennedey to 2 yr/20M deal Accept 10M option on Alexei Ramirez Sign Ben Zobrist to 2yr/25M deal Resign Albers 1 yr/2m Line-up LF - Adam Eaton 2B - Ben Zobrist 1B - Jose Abreu RF - CarGo DH - Melky Cabrera C - Matt Wieters 3B - Danny Valencia SS - Alexei Ramirez CF - Trayce Thompson SP - Sale Q Rodon Kennedy Danks (Traded or sent to bullpen after ASB, rotation spot taken by Fulmer) Pen Robertson Jones Duke Abad Putnam Albers Jennings Bench - Brantly - C Sanchez - IF Shuck - OF Garcia - IF/OF

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Oct 7, 2015 -> 05:34 PM) Wrong. I ripped him for not sitting him in September and letting Trayce play - although I didn't really rip on that. I ripped far more on playing the "elite" Melky Cabrera day after day. Never said Eaton couldn't produce. He hit c. .857 OPS after his first month. That will bring value. Which should be the idea. Although some prefer idols. But don't worry. Eaton will be back. Far greater chance of Trayce being packaged for a declining veteran than for EAton being traded for young talent. Did Adam Eaton bang your girlfriend or something? He is young talent and the 2nd best hitter on this team signed to a team friendly contract. These are the types of players we need to target, not trade. You trade Eaton for 2 young players and if you're lucky one of them ends up being as good as him. Not worth. Trayce should be in CF with Adam in left and a new acquisition in right but you have to understand TT isn't gonna do much better than .230/.305/.405 with 15 dingers in a full season.

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Oct 4, 2015 -> 09:12 PM) ...or throwing guys out since I assume you mean he is on the worst list. More than a couple of his assists came on balls he misplayed so bad that people tried to turn them into doubles. That isn't exactly a good thing. And he definitely is on the worst list. Awful player.