ChiSox59

He's a FA, Greg. Chances are he is not with Tampa again next season. I hear ya. I guess if the Sox go balls to the walls and sign Cole/Strasburg, Wheeler, Grandal, Moustakas, and re-sign Abreu, sure I'd be fine with Avi out in RF. But even in that scenario I'd probably just prefer to roll with Leury in RF. I just don't really see many realistic scenarios that involve Avisail Garcia coming back to the White Sox this offseason.

Feel free to keep pushing for Avi if you'd like. Its a waste of time. The Sox aren't going to bring Avi back, and would be happy to wager just about anything on that.

Yes, I am aware of Avi's splits against RHP in 2019. He had a good season. He was often platooned against high end righties (ie: not overexposed). Beyond the fact that we've had Avi on this team for 5 season and then non-tendered him because he isn't very good, Avi literally checks none of the boxes for RF in 2020. He bats right handed and is a below average defender = not an option. Its really that simple. Whoever the Sox acquire to play RF, they're going to be switch hitter or bat lefty. The only way I see something else occurring is if Abreu somehow signs elsewhere, and/or someone like Ozuna completely overplays their market and ends up in our lap on 3/$45M type deal. Based on the projected roster construction, if the Sox sign a 1 year stop gap RF, they're going to be lefty. If we trade for RF, they're going to bat left handed. The Sox are not going to go into next year Moncada as the only left handed hitter in the everyday lineup.

While I am not doubting that the Dodgers weren't enamored with Grandal's defense (they did sit him in the playoffs last year), he basically had the yips at point. Its also quite important to note the presence of Will Smith, who is going to be a well above average MLB catcher, and Keibert Ruiz. There is no reason for the Dodgers, a team bumping up against luxury tax issues, to invest $50M+ into Grandal with those two in their system, and both MLB ready or close to MLB ready.

Q will be a FA following 2020, so we can acquire him for nothing buy money in 13 months.

Because they paid him a pittance, let him spend about 20% of his time at DH, and didn't overexpose him to RHP. Avi had a nice season. He's a major league baseball player. But we've seen that movie many times, and he isn't even remotely close to a good fit for what this club needs. The Sox could afford to role the dice on some kids in 2019 (Palka, Cordell, etc.) - they did and it didn't work. Letting Avi go was the correct thing to do.

If it were up to me, 2/$25M would be my take it leave it offer. I would be OK with 2/$30M and a team option for a third year, and realistically I think that he is the best we can hope for. Anything over $15M AAV or 2 years is crazy. But the Sox are a loyal org, and I worry they'll pay him more than he'd get on the open market. To be clear, I have no issues whatsoever with keeping Abreu around. He's still a good stick and good mentor. But he does complicate both short-term and long-term roster management a bit, and he needs to spend more time at DH. With Vaughn in the wings, I just don't want to see the Sox tied to him for more than 2 more seasons.

CJ, curious what your plan would be since you seem the hate the Grandal idea? Seems as though you have no interest in Collins getting at bats, so I assume he's in AAA or traded in whatever plan you have. How do you solve DH? You just run McCann out there 6 days a week again, and sign a cheap vet catcher to backup McCann? You say the Abreu/Grandal/McCann/Collins rotation covering 1B, C and DH is an "utter joke", because 2 of the hitters are bad, but without Grandal, you're running McCann and shitty backup catcher out there everyday, so you're basically in the same spot anyway, sans having a well above average player in Grandal. In an Abreu, Grandal, McCann, Collins platoon, rarely would the 2 bad hitters in your mind (Collins and McCann) be playing on the same day as they are opposite platoon mates. Abreu and Grandal play most days. McCann plays mostly against LHP who he has a .812 career OPS against. Collins plays against RHP who had had a .751 OPS against in limited sample (77 PA) in the majors, and a .905 OPS against in 18-19 in the upper minors. Seems like a pretty good platoon situation to me.

You can’t just ignore the fact that he had a QO attached to him, and that he turned down a 4/$60M deal from the Mets early in the offseason.

Don’t look at Collins as a catcher then. He probably won’t be doing it much. He’s 1B/DH type that you can occasionally play at catcher and allows you to DH your other 2 catchers on a regular basis without any concern. For the plan to work, you need Grandal. Without him, may as well just send Collins to AAA to play everyday.

I just don’t understand. It’s a match made in heaven with their roster situation, especially if married to Abreu. Thankfully I think the Sox are very interested in Grandal, but it takes two to tango. Have to imagine 4/$75M at the most gets it done. Better offer than he turned down from the Mets last season before taking the 1 year deal. There should be a good deal of interest across the league.

No. McCann is the backup catcher (takes Gios starts and some starts against LHP). Collins is a part time platoon player that gets occasional starts at catcher, 1b and DH against RHP. Not that complicated.

I can basically guarantee you that if Collins is on the major league roster, there will be 3 catchers on it. They are not going to relegate Collins to pure backup catcher duties at this point. If Collins is on the team, he is going to play, and that is going to be a time-share at C, 1B and DH. I am not ready to completely write-off Collins as a "bad hitter" at this stage, but definitely understand your concern there. However, the scenario I describe is an ENORMOUS upgrade over what we ran out at DH/C/1B in 2018, so not sure why that suddenly doesn't work in your mind. I too would prefer the Sox sign JDM to DH, Grandal to catch, resign Abreu to play 1B, find a suitable RF and some SP. But I also live in reality and realize the Sox are unlikely to exceed $125M payroll. The Grandal/Abreu/McCann/Collins tandem sharing C, DH and 1B duties makes a ton of sense. You may not like it, but Grandal has a career OBP of .348 and OPS + of 115. Obviously that profiles better at catcher than DH, but he isn't going to be able to catch 150 games, so you work his bat in elsewhere. It makes sense to me, and to a lot other people who pay a lot of attention - including non-White Sox associated people like Mike Petriello who says Grandal is an amazing fit for the White Sox. The Sox need to find a way to get more lineup balance, while also improving team defense. The available free agents are very right handed, and the better bats are poor defenders. You don't sign a guy just because he is lefty and switch hitter, but that is something that needs to be considered and oftentimes ignored here. Moncada can't be the only legitimate bat in the lineup that hits lefthanded. I know. You and I are on the same page.

He'd be getting the "majority" of his starts at catcher. He'd start ~90-100 games at catcher.

This really isn't that complicated. Not exact numbers here, but something like this could definitely work. Abreu: 1B (100 games), DH (50 games) Grandal: C (90 games), 1B (30 games), DH (30 games) McCann: C (50 games), DH (30 games) Collins: C (20 games), DH (40 games), 1B (20 games) Basically Abreu is your 1B and occasional DH. Grandal catches against RHP, DHs or 1B against LHP. McCann catches Gio and gets a few DH starts against LHP. Sprike Collins in at catcher, CH and 1B against righties. Obviously other guys can DH occasionally too.

Yah, I could see three years. I've said it before, but if Ozuna's market dips into the 3 years $45-$50M range, the Sox should definitely kick the tires. He's not a good fit, but you can DH him some, DH Eloy some, etc., but you're still going to need to find a LH corner OF that is at worst an average defender. There is value there. 7 years and $150+M or whatever is laughable though, and he'd be lucky to get half that. I think he goes for 4/$75-80M type deal in the end.

Assuming Abreu is resigned, he most certainly does.

McCann was the 9th best catcher in all of baseball last year per fWAR. Not exactly sure who people think we're going to upgrade with besides Grandal, and even if you sign Grandal, you still need another catcher. The whole discussion is silly. McCann is going nowhere for 2020.

Because he isn't very good at catching, and they'll want to play him at 1B and DH as well. Tough to regularly use your only backup catcher elsewhere in the field. Even if the Sox miss out on Grandal, I am pretty much certain they'll be carrying 2 catchers in addition to Collins.

In the sense that all FAs are a luxury. Grandal is far and away the best free agent position player fit for the White Sox. People need to stop looking at Grandal as if he's replacing McCann. Grandal will DH and play 1B in addition to catching, allowing Collins to be more than strictly a b/u catcher, and also allowing McCann to not get overexposed. Grandal is the perfect fit, and likely won't even require $20M AAV.

He is not a viable everyday catcher, and the Sox aren't going to use him as a backup either. Hence, we need three catchers.

Not sure how you define that post as "love". He's a passable stopgap. Setting aside trade options for a second because those are difficult to handicap, please list to me a few better free agent options in RF. Please consider factors such as defense, lineup balance and contract. I'll wait.

Ok, you're welcome to your opinion, and I would agree wholeheartedly that 2nd half 2019 McCann is likely the McCann we see in 2020. But he's still worth $4.9M projected arb price, and there is no chance he is non-tendered. I also am strongly for signing Grandal, which would relegate McCann to Gio's personal catcher, and get some starts other against LHP. He still definitely has a role on this club.

I am not a big champion of Gardner, but he's one of the better stop gap options. How can you say Gardner makes no sense, and then in the next sentence suggest a trade for Reddick who by all measures is an inferior player to Gardner. Only positive to Reddick is he is a couple years younger, but for 1 season that doesn't matter much. I don't think anyone here is interested in giving Gardner a 3 year $30M deal, but if you can get him for 1 year $8-10M and all trade options in RF are too expensive or don't work out for whatever reason, there are definitely worse options in RF for a year. Reddick 2019 stats: .275/.319/.409; OPS .728; 89 OPS+ Gardner: .251/.325/.503; OPS .829; 117 OPS+

Grandal basically solves C/DH/1B assuming Abreu is retained. Between Abreu, Grandal, McCann and Collins, those three positions are covered. FA is really solvable via FA unless its a 1 year stop gap. So not a ton of capital needs to be deployed there. Pretty obvious they'll try to find a trade partner there. I would agree that SP should be 1A, but Grandal should be 1B.