ChiSox59

Subtract impending FA in Nova, Castillo, Santiago, Detwiler and likely nontenders in Osich and Yolmer and you’re at 29. Add back Kopech, Rodon and Burr and you’re at 32. Jay on 60 day so not on current 40 man but0 will be a FA as well.

A little surprised to see them cut bait on Cordell. Definitely not the others.

Right - which is quite literally why we're having this discussion...

The part you're kind of ignoring in your calculus is how the Mets are going to get all these guys to play. Conforto and McNeil both take corner spots. McNeil may occasionally spell Cano at 2B, in which case I assume Smith is taking reps in the OF. Then you have Cespedes. Unless they plan to put McNeil at 3B regularly, and put Lowrie (who they just gave a 2/$20M deal to last winter) on the bench - but McNeil is not an everyday IF. Something has to give. Maybe that something is trading McNeil or Conforto instead of Nimmo, but really they have to do something. With respect to the Sox system - ya the 2019 season was pretty shitty for Sox prospects not named Robert/Madrigal/Stiever. I do think we still have some names that have some real trade value outside of the top 4 - specifically Dunning, Walker, Stiever - and to a lesser extent Rutherford and Adolfo. I think there are pieces there to make a move, but I understand your reluctance. I also think there is some merit to giving the Rutherford/Adolo/Basabe trio one more year to try to claim RF for the future without blocking them with a long term RF via trade isn't the worst idea. Which is where 1 year stop gaps via trade or FA, or even a guy like Mazara start to make more sense. I still have decently high hopes for Adolfo - the other two not so much. If someone like Nimmo, or Gregory Polonco, or David Dahl cost too much - I prefer they just go the stop gap route.

Another in a long list of reasons why Grandal is better fit than JDM.

Yah, I have a hard time seeing anyone give up a top 50 prospect for a guy who has been hurt for large portion of 2/3 seasons he's been a big leaguer, and only has 3 years of arbitration control left. He's a fantastic fit for the White Sox, but he'd obviously still be a roll of the dice with his injury history. Perhaps the Mets would prefer to just hold onto him - totally reasonable to think that. Hard to really handicap what BVW will do, but based on what I just described a few minutes ago, I think its also reasonable that he will be available this offseason for the right price. If the "right price" to the Mets starts with Madrigal and they won't get off it, I'd rather just trade for someone else. I think Madrigal is considerably more valuable than Nimmo, and I've been one of the loudest proponents for acquiring him, and believe I was was the first to start mentioning Nimmo here months and months ago before 80% of the board jumped on the wagon.

Start with....ya, I can agree with that. Mets have a crowded OF situation. Conforto, McNeil both need to play the corners. Sure, McNeil can play the IF, but he's not very good at it and they already have plenty of guys to play 2B and 3B. Then you have Dom Smith who will get some time in LF and RF as he is completely blocked at 1B now. Then you have Cespedes under contract for $29.5 million in 2020, so they may want to try to work him in as well (though I doubt they are counting on him). Point being - they're pretty jammed up in the OF, and they're very lefty heavy. I am not saying they're going to get out there looking to get rid of Nimmo, but he definitely makes sense as someone they could move. I do think Stiever/Dunning + Walker/Rutherford + back end top 30 guy gets you pretty close to a deal. Obviously they would prefer Steiver and Walker to Dunning/Rutherford, but just throwing some names out there that could make sense.

I don't think Brandon Nimmo is going to require a top 40 prospect in the game that is basically MLB ready. We'll have to give up a couple pieces we'd rather keep to get Nimmo or a guy like Nimmo, but its not going to be from Robert-Madrigal-Vaugh-Cease-Kopech, etc., group.

Still on the Mookie Betts bit, I see.

Sure, but he's a much more attractive target as a signing rather than giving up assets to acquire. Probably wouldn't cost a ton, but Boston isn't going to just give him away. He also has another opt out after next season in his current deal, so another reason why that route is less than ideal.

I will take Moncada and Kopech over Gio, Lopez and Robles, especially when we used those negotiations to acquire 2 of 3 pieces discussed in a different trade not a significantly less valuable piece anyway. Hahn takes a lot of crap around here, but he hit an absolute home runs on Sale, Eaton and Quintana trades. A++. Not directed at you DA, but people say its easy to trade elite players - well, go look at what the Marlins got for Yelich, and get back to me.

Woah, took that one to the extreme. No sane person would take 1/$3M over 2/$30M. No one

Huh? Most players who receive QOs didn’t even have the ability to opt out.

He's a FA, Greg. Chances are he is not with Tampa again next season. I hear ya. I guess if the Sox go balls to the walls and sign Cole/Strasburg, Wheeler, Grandal, Moustakas, and re-sign Abreu, sure I'd be fine with Avi out in RF. But even in that scenario I'd probably just prefer to roll with Leury in RF. I just don't really see many realistic scenarios that involve Avisail Garcia coming back to the White Sox this offseason.

Feel free to keep pushing for Avi if you'd like. Its a waste of time. The Sox aren't going to bring Avi back, and would be happy to wager just about anything on that.

Yes, I am aware of Avi's splits against RHP in 2019. He had a good season. He was often platooned against high end righties (ie: not overexposed). Beyond the fact that we've had Avi on this team for 5 season and then non-tendered him because he isn't very good, Avi literally checks none of the boxes for RF in 2020. He bats right handed and is a below average defender = not an option. Its really that simple. Whoever the Sox acquire to play RF, they're going to be switch hitter or bat lefty. The only way I see something else occurring is if Abreu somehow signs elsewhere, and/or someone like Ozuna completely overplays their market and ends up in our lap on 3/$45M type deal. Based on the projected roster construction, if the Sox sign a 1 year stop gap RF, they're going to be lefty. If we trade for RF, they're going to bat left handed. The Sox are not going to go into next year Moncada as the only left handed hitter in the everyday lineup.

While I am not doubting that the Dodgers weren't enamored with Grandal's defense (they did sit him in the playoffs last year), he basically had the yips at point. Its also quite important to note the presence of Will Smith, who is going to be a well above average MLB catcher, and Keibert Ruiz. There is no reason for the Dodgers, a team bumping up against luxury tax issues, to invest $50M+ into Grandal with those two in their system, and both MLB ready or close to MLB ready.

Q will be a FA following 2020, so we can acquire him for nothing buy money in 13 months.

Because they paid him a pittance, let him spend about 20% of his time at DH, and didn't overexpose him to RHP. Avi had a nice season. He's a major league baseball player. But we've seen that movie many times, and he isn't even remotely close to a good fit for what this club needs. The Sox could afford to role the dice on some kids in 2019 (Palka, Cordell, etc.) - they did and it didn't work. Letting Avi go was the correct thing to do.

If it were up to me, 2/$25M would be my take it leave it offer. I would be OK with 2/$30M and a team option for a third year, and realistically I think that he is the best we can hope for. Anything over $15M AAV or 2 years is crazy. But the Sox are a loyal org, and I worry they'll pay him more than he'd get on the open market. To be clear, I have no issues whatsoever with keeping Abreu around. He's still a good stick and good mentor. But he does complicate both short-term and long-term roster management a bit, and he needs to spend more time at DH. With Vaughn in the wings, I just don't want to see the Sox tied to him for more than 2 more seasons.

CJ, curious what your plan would be since you seem the hate the Grandal idea? Seems as though you have no interest in Collins getting at bats, so I assume he's in AAA or traded in whatever plan you have. How do you solve DH? You just run McCann out there 6 days a week again, and sign a cheap vet catcher to backup McCann? You say the Abreu/Grandal/McCann/Collins rotation covering 1B, C and DH is an "utter joke", because 2 of the hitters are bad, but without Grandal, you're running McCann and shitty backup catcher out there everyday, so you're basically in the same spot anyway, sans having a well above average player in Grandal. In an Abreu, Grandal, McCann, Collins platoon, rarely would the 2 bad hitters in your mind (Collins and McCann) be playing on the same day as they are opposite platoon mates. Abreu and Grandal play most days. McCann plays mostly against LHP who he has a .812 career OPS against. Collins plays against RHP who had had a .751 OPS against in limited sample (77 PA) in the majors, and a .905 OPS against in 18-19 in the upper minors. Seems like a pretty good platoon situation to me.

You can’t just ignore the fact that he had a QO attached to him, and that he turned down a 4/$60M deal from the Mets early in the offseason.

Don’t look at Collins as a catcher then. He probably won’t be doing it much. He’s 1B/DH type that you can occasionally play at catcher and allows you to DH your other 2 catchers on a regular basis without any concern. For the plan to work, you need Grandal. Without him, may as well just send Collins to AAA to play everyday.

I just don’t understand. It’s a match made in heaven with their roster situation, especially if married to Abreu. Thankfully I think the Sox are very interested in Grandal, but it takes two to tango. Have to imagine 4/$75M at the most gets it done. Better offer than he turned down from the Mets last season before taking the 1 year deal. There should be a good deal of interest across the league.

No. McCann is the backup catcher (takes Gios starts and some starts against LHP). Collins is a part time platoon player that gets occasional starts at catcher, 1b and DH against RHP. Not that complicated.