KMule2545

QUOTE (lasttriptotulsa @ Dec 2, 2016 -> 11:36 AM) Eaton, Abreu, Sale, Quintana, Rodon, Jones, Anderson, many others waiting in the wings that should be ready by 2018/2019 (Collins, Burdi, Hansen, Fulmer, Danish, Call). Like it or not there are a ton of quality players in this organization. If they were to trade away one of Sale/Quintana, and the soon to be gone guys like Frazier, Melky and Robertson they could still get a pile of MLB ready or near ready players and multiple prospects. I'd say we could realistically compete in 2019 if not 2018. You're not going to get a pile of prospects for the likes of Frazier, Melky, or Robertson. You'll be lucky to get 1 or 2 top 100 guys - and that would be for Frazier only. None of our prospects are elite. None of them. We still have a bottom 10 farm in terms of both talent and depth. Personally, I'm tired of looking forward to "maybe" being able to compete every year. Disgusted by it, to be honest. It hasn't worked out once in our favor. We need to be sure-fire competitors anually. Not maybe guys. Obviously a full rebuild (especially by Reinsdorf/KW/Hahn) has its own risks. But we have to take these risks at this point - and its the Sox own fault because if we had a legitimate Latin program the past 10 years or actually developed and drafted correctly, we would have been able to supplement our current core. It's time to focus on those areas, particularly with an organization that doesn't spend legitimate money on legitimate free agents.

QUOTE (lasttriptotulsa @ Dec 2, 2016 -> 11:13 AM) I think anybody that thinks they are going to do a total rebuild is delusional. It's not necessary. Their core is very, very good. They just need to move one or two guys and they will be ready to compete in 2-3 years. Moving 2 or 3 players doesn't give us the depth dude. Unless those 2 or 3 players were Sale, Q, and Eaton. In which case you're in a full rebuild anyway. We need to trade players for roster depth AND farm depth. We currently have half a roster. Why do it half-ass? Why? You can't wait a few years and do it right? We've been terrible for 10 years anyway. I'm sure we could all survive a rebuild and enjoy watching a roster of young studs mature until they're truly ready to consistently compete anually.

QUOTE (Eminor3rd @ Dec 2, 2016 -> 10:19 AM) While I wouldn't have any problem pouncing on the right return to sell him at what is most likely his peak value, I don't think it's wise to shop him. As mentioned before, five years of control make him every bit as useful to our next competitor as any of the 5+ year controllable brekaout prospects we're talking about targeting with Sale. Further, OF bats are one of the only things that actually ARE available in this year's free agent class (although many have been signed already), making it at least appear to not be an ideal trading market. But guys who can play CF and leadoff aren't among those big OF free agent bats, outside of Fowler. That's where the appeal comes into play from another team's perspective.

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Dec 2, 2016 -> 10:06 AM) They honestly probably need reyes in the rotation pretty bad. Just traded Garcia away so they probably need as much depth as possibly. Not sure they can even use reyes in a sale trade. C-Mart Wainwright Wacha Leake Lynn is their rotation as of now with a healthy Lynn. But even then that's only 5 - and they all have questions besides Martinez. So you're probably right...but Reyes would be their 6th guy as of right now.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Dec 2, 2016 -> 09:56 AM) Lets say Dexter Fowler signs in Toronto. St. Louis was said to have some interest in that type of player. How many of the following guys would you need from St. Louis to trade Adam Eaton: RHP Luke Weaver, RHP Jack Flaherty, RHP Sandy Alcantara, OF Harrison Bader, C Carson Kelly, SS Delvin Perez. I think STL can acquire Adam Eaton if they ponied up honestly. I like a lot of those pieces. You guys think no chance we could extract Alex Reyes in an Eaton deal?

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 2, 2016 -> 09:42 AM) Looking from the outside in, the fact that they are talking about moving Adam Eaton to me is a clue that there might be some smoke to all of the clubhouse stuff. Seemingly trying to move the two most vocals players in the LaRoche fiasco.

QUOTE (bmags @ Dec 2, 2016 -> 09:33 AM) A single trade is unlikely to completely reverse 15 years of bad drafting and farm management. The braves have traded 6 players in last week and none were in their top 15. The point of unloading some of our players at high value is to get a deeper group so we don't end up with 3-4 stars and chaff. Because trying to only acquire your talent through free agency and trades is risky too, as you have watched for years. This. We need the depth so, so badly. A Sale trade that brings back 5 players is not enough to replenish our farm and roster.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Dec 2, 2016 -> 09:31 AM) If all what people have in their imagination is true, bad clubhouse, won't age well, at his peak...why wouldn't other teams know this, and if they did, why would they offer the motherload of packages for him? I'll hang up and listen for my answer. Because they want the player he is right now. That's the difference in competing and rebuilding. And he was what, a 5 or 6 win player in 2016? Whoever loses out on Fowler is going to turn towards Eaton, IMO.

QUOTE (lasttriptotulsa @ Dec 2, 2016 -> 09:04 AM) Eaton has 5 years of control and costs nothing. Those are the exact guys you want to keep. Speed/contact guys (who don't even swipe bags) that are 28 years old are not the type of players you should be keeping going into a rebuild. He'll be over 30 when we're good again. More likely than not, his skill set isn't going to age well.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Dec 2, 2016 -> 06:58 AM) Eaton was more serious and more productive last year; perhaps a result of further declowning of the 25 man (Alexei, e.g.). Trad him, yes, if someone wants to pay for a 5 WAR player( which I Doubt). Sale and the vets should bring sufficient fresh talent to revitalize this org. It's a lot more to trade than the Cubs or Astros had (although premiums are often better achieved In July, esp for short term vets). Q and Eaton would be solid building blocks. Note that the Astros held back Altuve in their dispersal and rebuilding. The Sox were bad last year because Hahn has not built the Sox up the middle (affirmatively downgraded catcher and filled CF late last year). The staff and pen were each 3 deep. The org had no depth. He then refused to do much in July for 2 years running. He seems to be frozen until he can move Sale...hope he doesn't forego opportunities to move others in the meantime. Altuve is 26 years old currently after their rebuild. So he was maybe 22 when their rebuild started. Q is 27, Eaton 28 at the start of the White Sox rebuild. Each will be over 30 by the time the Sox are ready to compete again. That's not good business if they're serious about rebuilding - which I'm still not convinced the Sox will fully commit to.

Speaking of the Pirates, Jung Ho Kang was charged with "leaving the scene of a DUI accident" in South Korea. That guy is having an awful year. http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2016/12/jung...p;post-id=78752

QUOTE (Jake @ Dec 1, 2016 -> 09:09 PM) Rodon has 5 more years left A legitimate rebuild will take at least 3 years before you're truly competitive - if not 4 or 5.

QUOTE (CWSpalehoseCWS @ Dec 1, 2016 -> 08:34 PM) Trading Rodon is just plain stupid and a lateral move for a rebuilding team IMO. Why trade a 23 year old player making the league minimum who's yet to hit his prime? The Sox should absolutely be building around Anderson and Rodon for the future. Until we're ready to compete again and Rodon has only a year or 2 of control left. He has Scott Boras as his agent. Assuming he pans out, he'll command north of 200 mil as a 27-28 year old stud LHP with a nasty arsenal. There is almost no chance of him being re-signed under current ownership. Unless he REALLY wants to stay with the White Sox...but he has Scott Boras as his agent for a reason - to get the most money possible. Trade him now? No. But if he breaks out and can command a Sale-like package in a year or 2? You have to do it IMO, especially with the new CBA. That being said it would be a very White Sox-Reinsdorf move to keep him to "compete for a World Series" and end up with very little compensation for his services. This is all assuming a full rebuild. If we keep "going for it", it would be goofy to deal him.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Dec 1, 2016 -> 08:29 PM) But you were talking about attendance. I merely said fans will show up again when they're legit again - compared to 2016 when they were absolute dogs***. I didn't say "the Braves have some of the best attendance, making them one of the biggest fanbases". I just stated they have one of the bigger fanbases after the obvious clubs. Having a large fanbase has nothing to do with attendance when the product is subpar, or if your stadium is in the middle of nowhere, like their new stadium will be. Obviously metropolitan areas will draw better. That doesn't mean they don't have the fanbase. http://www.slate.com/blogs/moneybox/2014/0...ball_teams.html Peep the map. They own the entire Southeast, like I said.

QUOTE (Rowand44 @ Dec 1, 2016 -> 07:28 PM) They do? Uhhhh yeah. They basically own the entire Southeast. After the obvious teams (Dodgers, Mets, Yankees, Red Sox, Cardinals, Giants, Cubs), they're right there in terms of fans. No, I'm not talking about precious attendance either. I'm talking about viewership. Go anywhere from Tennessee, Georgia, Kentucky, Virginia, Florida, the Carolinas - you'll see a lot of Braves gear.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Dec 1, 2016 -> 08:17 PM) I bet Collins + Fulmer + Adams + Burdi puts you in the ballpark. If they're talking about Robles he's a top 10 guy and the White Sox have nothing close to that, but if you piled up 2 top 100 guys plus another first round pick from last year you at least aren't laughably far away. Nats could probably still beat that. Why is this even being discussed.......

QUOTE (Baron @ Dec 1, 2016 -> 06:29 PM) They are collecting the 1 year deal pitchers that's for sure To flip for prospects midseason or try to merely be a .500 team? I know they're opening a new stadium in 2017 but I don't quite understand at this point. They have one of the bigger fanbases in the game so it's not like they'll need to worry about fans showing up once they're legit again.

QUOTE (soxforlife05 @ Dec 1, 2016 -> 06:27 PM) No idea how Jamie Garcia is worth anything anytime I've seen him pitch he's looked like Danks. He has one bad year in 8 career seasons dude - 2016. He's got a career 3.57 ERA/3.56 FIP/1.28 WHIP/2.6 BB/9 / and one of the better change ups from the left side in the NL. Obviously health has been an issue but this is the market you're looking at for a guy like him.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Dec 1, 2016 -> 04:46 PM) St louis needs Reyes more than they need Eaton in my opinion. Their farm system does not have much in terms of pitching after him They showed their depth chart on MLB Network earlier. They're about 7 solid options deep. Prospect-wise they have Reyes, Luke Weaver, and Jack Flaherty off the top of my head.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Dec 1, 2016 -> 04:42 PM) Eaton is a proven all star at the mlb level. Regardless of Robles' ceiling, he is still 19 and there is a ton of time for him to end up as a bust. I like him as a prospect, but Eaton is not going anywhere as he is under long term control The Sox should heavily consider moving Eaton while his value is sky high. A speed/contact guy is not going to age well into his 30s - and he's already 28.

QUOTE (PolishPrince34 @ Dec 1, 2016 -> 02:30 PM) I would be on the phone with the Nationals regarding Eaton. If Robles was the headliner plus more I would jump all over it. Robles is one the highest ceiling players in all of minors. He's 2 years away, but love all 5 tools. If Pirates can get Robles plus more for a declining McCutchen . Eaton's value is never going to be higher. I would be on the phone with Rizzo. Cardinals too are said to be looking for a CF and leadoff hitter. Eaton is the perfect fit for them. Go get Alex Reyes ++

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Dec 1, 2016 -> 12:11 PM) Odor is a below average fielder at 2B...I do not have confidence in him playing 3B defensively. I do not regard Odor as highly as most because he rarely walks which leads to poor on base percentages Without quality defense, I don't see Odor consistently getting on base enough to justify trading for I'm with you. Besides the D and lack of OBP, the kid is clearly a maniac judging by his Minor League and Major League brawls, as well as his brother (also named Roughned Odor) being part of that sexual abuse/assult scandal. There's a screw loose somewhere in there, maybe genetically.

QUOTE (Y2JImmy0 @ Dec 1, 2016 -> 01:55 PM) The Pirates aren't trading for Chris Sale. Yeah, if the Pirates trade McCutchen, they're clearly willing to take a step back for a year or 2.

QUOTE (South Sider @ Dec 1, 2016 -> 10:53 AM) If we're rebuilding, I'd rather see Avi on the team next year. He can be terrible and help us to a lower record and higher draft pick. And you never know, maybe he actually figures hitting out for real this time. Not holding my breath, but in that event he could become a trade chip, albeit not very great of one because he can't play defense. These are my thoughts exact. I've said this previously - his exit velocities last year, coupled with his launch angles, his first year using a completely new swing, and his age (he's 25!). IIRC, his exit velos (I know, it's not everything) were better than Bryant and Rizzo in 2016. I'm not ready to write him off completely until I see what he does on a rebuilding team with a new manager in 2017.

QUOTE (Scoots @ Nov 30, 2016 -> 10:05 PM) If Avi goes byebye, I believe that Tilson has a starting outfield position next season. If Avi sticks around he'll most likely get most ABs at DH anyway - depending if we get a guy like AJ Reed/keep Abreu or not.