I just get the feeling the next guy they want out is Eaton. He put up monster defensive peripherals last year. He probably peaked on his value. I wonder if they want his attitude around for the rebuild.

 

It would not surprise if they hang onto Quintana until the deadline or next year.

 

Frazier and Robertson trade market wont develop until some of the other free agents are gone.

 

I think Abreu has a real chance to be more valuable at the deadline than at this point in time.

Edited December 7, 20169 yr by kwill

...Cubs signed him to be a CFer before Fowler came back.

I'm almost positive that was never the plan.

I'm sure pep talks from the bench and locker room is what Theo had in mind when he handed over $184,000,000 to Jason Heyward. GMs from across the league are lining up to take on that contract so that they, too, can have Heyward give pep talks during rain delays.

Wow. Sports psychologists have become somewhat expensive.

Compared to Jason Heyward? Is this even up for debate?

 

Heyward signed as a 25 year old with good established offensive production and the plus tools to project increased production. He wasn't signed because of his defensively inflated WAR. Eaton will be traded as an established 28 year old without near the upside to project. He's a hell of a player, but his some of his numbers are smoke and mirrors. GM's aren't dumb.

Eaton is 8 months older than Heyward. You must really love Heywards raw power, I'll take results. Eaton has hit more homers than him each of the last 2 seasons. And if Eaton's WAR is all from defense, how do you conclude Heyward's is not? Look at their offensive numbers.

I just get the feeling the next guy they want out is Eaton. He put up monster defensive peripherals last year. He probably peaked on his value. I wonder if they want his attitude around for the rebuild.

 

It would not surprise if they hang onto Quintana until the deadline or next year.

 

Frazier and Robertson trade market wont develop until some of the other free agents are gone.

 

I think Abreu has a real chance to be more valuable at the deadline than at this point in time.

I'm a little inclined to agree on Abreu. It would be good to move him when teams are more desperate, especially if Abreu has a strong first half next year.

You're absolutely nuts if you think RF defense has become that valued.

You're absolutely nuts if you think the Cubs gave Heyward $184 million because of his tools. Because his offense was nowhere good enough to justify it.

Eaton is 8 months older than Heyward. You must really love Heywards raw power, I'll take results. Eaton has hit more homers than him each of the last 2 seasons. And if Eaton's WAR is all from defense, how do you conclude Heyward's is not? Look at their offensive numbers.

Let's go over this again... "Heyward was signed as a 25 year old." "Eaton will be traded as a 28 year old." Established 25 year olds with plus tools have more value than established 28 year olds with limited tools. Poll 30 MLB GM's and ask them which player has more potential. I think you're going to get a pretty clear cut idea.

 

 

Let's go over this again... "Heyward was signed as a 25 year old." "Eaton will be traded as a 28 year old." Established 25 year olds with plus tools have more value than established 28 year olds with limited tools. Poll 30 MLB GM's and ask them which player has more potential. I think you're going to get a pretty clear cut idea.

Actually he wasn't signed as a 25 year old.

 

Do you really think they would think the same today? Also, of the 30, is there 1 that would trade Adam Eaton straight up for Jason Heyward?

Edited December 7, 20169 yr by Dick Allen

Let's go over this again... "Heyward was signed as a 25 year old." "Eaton will be traded as a 28 year old." Established 25 year olds with plus tools have more value than established 28 year olds with limited tools. Poll 30 MLB GM's and ask them which player has more potential. I think you're going to get a pretty clear cut idea.

 

There's nothing to indicate that Heyward is still developing or has "potential" after 7 full seasons in the big leagues. What you see for both is basically the best of what you'll get.

Let's go over this again... "Heyward was signed as a 25 year old." "Eaton will be traded as a 28 year old." Established 25 year olds with plus tools have more value than established 28 year olds with limited tools. Poll 30 MLB GM's and ask them which player has more potential. I think you're going to get a pretty clear cut idea.

 

If we are worried about nitpicking, then Heyward was actually signed as a 26 year old, and Eaton turned 28 yesterday.

Edited December 7, 20169 yr by ChiliIrishHammock24

You're absolutely nuts if you think the Cubs gave Heyward $184 million because of his tools. Because his offense was nowhere good enough to justify it.

As an established player, yes, I think the Cubs were willing to risk it. We just picked up a guy the Red Sox invested $62M in as a 20 year old (?) with no track record.

I'm a little inclined to agree on Abreu. It would be good to move him when teams are more desperate, especially if Abreu has a strong first half next year.

 

A strong half by Abreu could make him one of the most valuable bats at the deadline

 

He can play crappy defense at 1B or DH for an American league team

 

Am I nuts, or do the Rangers appear to be in serious need of a 1B/DH?

 

Why wouldn't they be interested in Abreu? (Side note...wow that Shin Soo Choo signing has backfired on the Rangers)

Edited December 7, 20169 yr by steveno89

Actually he wasn't signed as a 25 year old.

 

Do you really think they would think the same today? Also, of the 30, is there 1 that would trade Adam Eaton straight up for Jason Heyward?

Okay, replace the 5 with a 6 and address the post.

We now have multiple threads so I'll post this here, too. If I see one more post demanding Turner ++ for Quintana +.

 

Washington is not going to trade Turner for guys their fans have never even heard of - there would be a mutiny.

 

Trea Turner, in 73 games last year across 307 at bats, had a .937 OPS with 13 homers, 14 doubles, 8 triples, and 33 stolen bases. WHAT THE F*CK THEY ARE NOT GOING TO F*CKING TRADE THIS GUY.

 

Their fans would riot.

As an established player, yes, I think the Cubs were willing to risk it. We just picked up a guy the Red Sox invested $62M in as a 20 year old (?) with no track record.

So they didn't factor in defense at all? And how are the Heyward/Moncada situations comparable in the slightest?

It doesn't take much to understand that Eaton is a fraud and a locker room problem.

 

I've missed Soxtalk

There's nothing to indicate that Heyward is still developing or has "potential" after 7 full seasons in the big leagues. What you see for both is basically the best of what you'll get.

Except ability.

 

 

Again, we'll find out what kind of value Eaton has real soon. I bet you guys are going to be pretty disappointed.

Let's go over this again... "Heyward was signed as a 25 year old." "Eaton will be traded as a 28 year old." Established 25 year olds with plus tools have more value than established 28 year olds with limited tools. Poll 30 MLB GM's and ask them which player has more potential. I think you're going to get a pretty clear cut idea.

I'm not sure Eaton has "limited tools". However, I see your argument, and I could agree...to a point. If you factor in the cost and recent performance, Eaton has more value. Heyward is owed $28 million next year. Easton is owed $28 million over the next FOUR years. Who has more potential? Heyward, probably. Who is more valuable? Eaton, especially to a team who might be looking to upgrade their outfield without spending a fortune.

Okay, replace the 5 with a 6 and address the post.

They are 8 months apart in age. Apparently Heyward's tools took a huge hit and now that he is almost 28, using your criteria, there really isn't any hope these tools develop.

 

I actually think Eaton is improving, and think he will hit with more power. I also though Heyward would hit with more power when he became a Cub, but he is messed up, and hasn't hit for much power in several years.

We now have multiple threads so I'll post this here, too. If I see one more post demanding Turner ++ for Quintana +.

 

Washington is not going to trade Turner for guys their fans have never even heard of - there would be a mutiny.

 

Trea Turner, in 73 games last year across 307 at bats, had a .937 OPS with 13 homers, 14 doubles, 8 triples, and 33 stolen bases. WHAT THE F*CK THEY ARE NOT GOING TO F*CKING TRADE THIS GUY.

 

Their fans would riot.

 

From what I've seen, the only people still demanding Turner is in the context of a Quintana + Eaton trade, in which case that's entirely valid for a pair of 4-5 WAR players.

So they didn't factor in defense at all? And how are the Heyward/Moncada situations comparable in the slightest?

Jesus christ, what's with the strawmen? Did I ever say they didn't value defense? I said a team isn't going to give up the farm for a guy whose WAR has been drastically inflated due to RF defense. Maybe if he was a plus defender at CF, C, or SS.

It's light because I am trying to come up with a reasonable proposal (not fan driven monster packages)

 

No team will back up the truck and dump the entire farm for one or two players not named Trout, Betts, Bryant or Seager

A reasonable proposal or a proposal that is purposefully light because it's coming from just one org?

 

Quintana - #2 Robles/#4 Fedde/#8 Stevenson/#14 Severino

Eaton - #3 Lopez/#7 Neuse/#11 Banks/#30 Reetz

 

This leaves then with their #1, 5, 6, 9 & 10 guys still intact.

 

Does it hurt them? Yes. Are they much better now? Yes.

 

And guess what? If they lose Harper in two years, they can move Q and Eaton then to restock much of that system.

 

I'm not sure Eaton has "limited tools". However, I see your argument, and I could agree...to a point. If you factor in the cost and recent performance, Eaton has more value. Heyward is owed $28 million next year. Easton is owed $28 million over the next FOUR years. Who has more potential? Heyward, probably. Who is more valuable? Eaton, especially to a team who might be looking to upgrade their outfield without spending a fortune.

 

Given the contract, Eaton will almost undoubtedly be the better value.

 

 

Jesus christ, what's with the strawmen? Did I ever say they didn't value defense? I said a team isn't going to give up the farm for a guy whose WAR has been drastically inflated due to RF defense. Maybe if he was a plus defender at CF, C, or SS.

He was a 4.0 WAR player with below average defense in CF in 2015, and he's owed $38 million the next 5 years. He is a lot better than you think. If teams don't want to pony up, the White Sox aren't going to trade him.

A reasonable proposal or a proposal that is purposefully light because it's coming from just one org?

 

Quintana - #2 Robles/#4 Fedde/#8 Stevenson/#14 Severino

Eaton - #3 Lopez/#7 Neuse/#11 Banks/#30 Reetz

 

This leaves then with their #1, 5, 6, 9 & 10 guys still intact.

 

Does it hurt them? Yes. Are they much better now? Yes.

 

And guess what? If they lose Harper in two years, they can move Q and Eaton then to restock much of that system.

 

That deal for Eaton is garbage. Don't like the deal for Q either.