Nationals acquire Doolittle/Madson from As

[caulfield12]

Giving up about $10+ million and only getting back two "so-so" prospects for Robertson, I'd guess.

[soxforlife05]

No more pitchers in these deals we need to be insisting on positional prospects. Underwhelming return if true hold out for a team that will give you a high ceiling A ball prospect like Kieboom/Soto.

Edited May 23, 2017 by soxforlife05

[credezcrew24]

What about it is funny to you?

 

The suggested return is piss poor, and if that was the best offer it would be well worth the gamble for the Sox to hold on to Robertson for another year. Or half a season. Or more in an effort to do better.

[hi8is]

Well, that's not on Nightengale. He's just reporting what fell apart due to Washingtons $ issues at the ownership level.

[Quin]

No more pitchers in these deals we need to be insisting on positional prospects. Underwhelming return if true hold out for a team that will give you a high ceiling A ball prospect like Kieboom/Soto.

 

Robertson's value was super low in the offseason.

[GreenSox]

That Robertson return was reasonable at the time.

Don't be so sure that we're flush with pitching prospects. It's hard to turn those prospects into major league starting pitchers. Most flame out. This year their are bright signs from the youth on the major league roster, but that's from position players and relievers. And you'll need plenty of depth, else you have another year of Noesi.

Take the best talent we can get.

[steveno89]

That Robertson return was reasonable at the time.

Don't be so sure that we're flush with pitching prospects. It's hard to turn those prospects into major league starting pitchers. Most flame out. This year their are bright signs from the youth on the major league roster, but that's from position players and relievers. And you'll need plenty of depth, else you have another year of Noesi.

Take the best talent we can get.

 

We have to think Robertson's rebound has helped his value, as well as his contract being less of a burden with each passing month.

 

I would not be thrilled with a return of Luzardo and Ward and would certainly be hoping for more at the deadline.

[yesterday333]

I'm not sure what to believe with these rumors of what has fallen through... Weren't there rumors that it fell apart because we insisted on Severino? And there have been rumors that we have talked with the Nats multiple times this season, then Nightingale keeps saying we haven't had contact with them since the offseason.

[steveno89]

I'm not sure what to believe with these rumors of what has fallen through... Weren't there rumors that it fell apart because we insisted on Severino? And there have been rumors that we have talked with the Nats multiple times this season, then Nightingale keeps saying we haven't had contact with them since the offseason.

 

Severino's defense is good, but I have doubts his bat ever becomes enough to be more than a backup catcher. A .502 OPS in 28 games at AAA this season is a small sample size, but it is also concerningly bad.

 

I think it will end up being a good thing that we did not deal Robertson to the Nats for that return. The price will likely be higher if Robertson continues to play well.

[Y2Jimmy0]

Jesus Luzardo would be a nice get. Was a top 30 draft prospect out of HS prior to the TJS. I think they could land a 2nd piece better than Ward at this point but that would have been a nice trade at the time

[steveno89]

Jesus Luzardo would be a nice get. Was a top 30 draft prospect out of HS prior to the TJS. I think they could land a 2nd piece better than Ward at this point but that would have been a nice trade at the time

 

Luzardo could be an interesting guy coming off TJS, agreed. I would want to see a better piece than Ward coming back as well. Ward is by no means bad, but questions remain about his ability to stick defensively at third base and he is a well below average runner. His hitting has been solid at AA ball so far this season, but if he cannot stick at third defensively then his bat and power really need to play up for him to have value.

[Bob Sacamano]

Luzardo could be an interesting guy coming off TJS, agreed. I would want to see a better piece than Ward coming back as well. Ward is by no means bad, but questions remain about his ability to stick defensively at third base and he is a well below average runner. His hitting has been solid at AA ball so far this season, but if he cannot stick at third defensively then his bat and power really need to play up for him to have value.

 

Hell, with Robertson's value rising, it might take 3 maybe 4 pieces to move him meaning Ward can still fit as a third or fourth piece. Granted, there also may be other good relievers available.

[witesoxfan]

I think his value will ultimately be its highest at the trade deadline this year. Any team acquiring him will be paying for, at most, 8 months of service, compared to the 12 months this offseason, thus decreasing the total monetary expenditure by 30-33%. Said acquiring team will also still have control of Robertson for 2 postseason runs, so if that team were not in a position to qualify for the postseason in 2018, they'd still have time to flip him and reacquire some lost assets. If they are, then they have him both postseason runs.

 

This is different than a starting pitcher simply because a starting pitcher will only get, say, 10-12 starts prior to the postseason, which is, at most, a 2 win upgrade (unless said pitcher pitches like Randy Johnson from 1998-2002). A reliever could realistically pitch upwards of 25-30 games down the stretch, all in high leverage spots, which could theoretically "add" 4-5 wins, not necessarily as a result of their own production but simply based on being able to maintain a lead down the stretch where that team previously was not able to save that lead.

 

If the Sox have to kick in money to get a better prospect, they should, but regardless, they should get a better return for Robertson at the deadline than any other time throughout the process.

 

 

[Soha]

That Robertson return was reasonable at the time.

Don't be so sure that we're flush with pitching prospects. It's hard to turn those prospects into major league starting pitchers. Most flame out. This year their are bright signs from the youth on the major league roster, but that's from position players and relievers. And you'll need plenty of depth, else you have another year of Noesi.

Take the best talent we can get.

 

I agree with this for the most part. With the addition of Robert, and hopefully taking the best available hitter in the draft in a few weeks, I'd say they can turn their attention towards the best available package, regardless of position. The only exception to me is if they do move Quintana - a bat needs to be the headliner coming back.

[southsider2k5]

Luzardo could be an interesting guy coming off TJS, agreed. I would want to see a better piece than Ward coming back as well. Ward is by no means bad, but questions remain about his ability to stick defensively at third base and he is a well below average runner. His hitting has been solid at AA ball so far this season, but if he cannot stick at third defensively then his bat and power really need to play up for him to have value.

 

Hard throwing HS pitchers are always a gamble. Adding a TJ surgery to that uncertainty scares me badly. I am really glad the deal fell apart.

[southsider2k5]

I think his value will ultimately be its highest at the trade deadline this year. Any team acquiring him will be paying for, at most, 8 months of service, compared to the 12 months this offseason, thus decreasing the total monetary expenditure by 30-33%. Said acquiring team will also still have control of Robertson for 2 postseason runs, so if that team were not in a position to qualify for the postseason in 2018, they'd still have time to flip him and reacquire some lost assets. If they are, then they have him both postseason runs.

 

This is different than a starting pitcher simply because a starting pitcher will only get, say, 10-12 starts prior to the postseason, which is, at most, a 2 win upgrade (unless said pitcher pitches like Randy Johnson from 1998-2002). A reliever could realistically pitch upwards of 25-30 games down the stretch, all in high leverage spots, which could theoretically "add" 4-5 wins, not necessarily as a result of their own production but simply based on being able to maintain a lead down the stretch where that team previously was not able to save that lead.

 

If the Sox have to kick in money to get a better prospect, they should, but regardless, they should get a better return for Robertson at the deadline than any other time throughout the process.

 

I am going to guess once the Robert deal becomes official, the teams desire to kick in salary is going to decrease for a while.

[Dick Allen]

I am going to guess once the Robert deal becomes official, the teams desire to kick in salary is going to decrease for a while.

Maybe, but even if they kick in money, they still are saving from what they owe.

[ptatc]

Hard throwing HS pitchers are always a gamble. Adding a TJ surgery to that uncertainty scares me badly. I am really glad the deal fell apart.

Would you prefer soft tossing HS pitchers?

[southsider2k5]

Would you prefer soft tossing HS pitchers?

 

I would prefer a hard throwing college pitcher.

[Whisox05]

Nationals with another blown save and bullpen loss in extra innings. Hopefully they come calling for robertson

[iamshack]

Nationals with another blown save and bullpen loss in extra innings. Hopefully they come calling for robertson

And a few other guys, even.

[caulfield12]

Romero looked good, but Glover and Kelley got shellacked...

[GreenSox]

Another value outing for Robertson.

I really don't know what more he needs to showcase.

He can pitch the ninth, he can pitch multiple innings (the need for which is in vogue these days), and he already pitched effectively 3 days in a row.

The demand may increase over the next 6 weeks, but I don't see how he pitches better than he has been.

[pmb0928]

Takes two teams to make a deal.

 

His value cant be much higher, he has let up runs in 4 of 21 games. 2 of those 4 were when he pitched more than 1 inning. He has 1 blown save only. His Ks per 9 are higher than his career average.

We need to move him soon to get maximum value. What other options do teams have for a proven closer? Herrera is garbage right now. There are zero proven closers out there right now on teams that are at the bottom of the standings. Unless the Giants raise the white flag and want to trade melancon and his numbers are not as good as Robertson.

 

To sum up we are going to get a nice return on Robertson. If its not the nationals why not someone like the astros? They have Ken Giles who has a close to 4 ERA. And even if a team has a great closer, Robertson could make a game 7 innings essentially.

 

 

[GreenSox]

Takes two teams to make a deal.

And there are teams that will need him.

The challenge is that it looks like there will be may be 10 buyers and 20 sellers this year.

Edited June 11, 2017 by GreenSox