Nationals acquire Doolittle/Madson from As

[SouthSide2004]

I think Kieboom may be that piece that matches up. But in three trades now we know we're discusse with Nats he never came up so who knows how we feel about him or Nats. But the Robles, Soto + for Drob/Jones/kieboom is crazy.

 

But also when you get to that 45-50 range of prospects I'm going to guess there are wider variations among team scouts than we give credit for.

I guess I assume we'll have to eat some money and therefore should get a pretty decent headliner given how well Robertson has pitched this year and the general value of high leverage relievers at the deadline. I think Robles is off limits for pretty much anything, but to me one of Soto or Kieboom plus a secondary piece seems just about right.

[GGajewski18]

Kieboom and Luzardo makes a ton of sense for Robertson

[2nd_city_saint787]

What am I missing about Kieboom? He's a 26 year old that is hitting .170 in AA and last year he had an OPS under .700 as a 25 year old in AA.

 

Is he some elite defensive catcher? Or do people just like his name?

 

Looks like a non prospect to me.

[yesterday333]

What am I missing about Kieboom? He's a 26 year old that is hitting .170 in AA and last year he had an OPS under .700 as a 25 year old in AA.

 

Is he some elite defensive catcher? Or do people just like his name?

 

Looks like a non prospect to me.

wrong Kieboom.....

[2nd_city_saint787]

Whoops apparently there are more than one Kiebooms in their system.

[caulfield12]

The next question is going to be about cash flow, with the Robert deal.

 

Obviously we're hoping to clear a lot of salary from July-September, but how much, for example, is JR willing to eat to get a Kieboom or Soto (assuming that Robles is completely unrealistic).

 

If the suggestion is Soto and a secondary starting pitching prospect for Herrera (control through 2018) and Cain (FA), we're going to have to eat at least 1/3rd or 1/2 to make it feasible for the Nationals.

 

Otherwise, they'll just go to cheaper options like Herrera, Hand, Tony Watson, etc.

[SouthSide2004]

wrong Kieboom.....

BOOM

[bmags]

The next question is going to be about cash flow, with the Robert deal.

 

Obviously we're hoping to clear a lot of salary from July-September, but how much, for example, is JR willing to eat to get a Kieboom or Soto (assuming that Robles is completely unrealistic).

 

If the suggestion is Soto and a secondary starting pitching prospect for Herrera (control through 2018) and Cain (FA), we're going to have to eat at least 1/3rd or 1/2 to make it feasible for the Nationals.

 

Otherwise, they'll just go to cheaper options like Herrera, Hand, Tony Watson, etc.

 

Cash flow would not be a problem. Robertson is already a part of our budget. If they signed Robert needing to then shed salary that would be nuts.

 

We don't need to actually send out the rest of his contract we are eating at once.

[SouthSide2004]

The next question is going to be about cash flow, with the Robert deal.

 

Obviously we're hoping to clear a lot of salary from July-September, but how much, for example, is JR willing to eat to get a Kieboom or Soto (assuming that Robles is completely unrealistic).

 

If the suggestion is Soto and a secondary starting pitching prospect for Herrera (control through 2018) and Cain (FA), we're going to have to eat at least 1/3rd or 1/2 to make it feasible for the Nationals.

 

Otherwise, they'll just go to cheaper options like Herrera, Hand, Tony Watson, etc.

You're assuming there is only one buyer and they'll have their pickings of the reliever market. The price for Herrera may end up being a lot higher if multiple teams are interested.

[Jerksticks]

The only reason I think Soto and Robles are available is because their bullpen is comically bad. It's not like teams are calling them looking for prospects and the Nats are saying "Sure we could use a good reliever". More like the Nats are calling 911 because the house is on fire.

 

Their window is this year and next year and they need more than one quality reliever to make a deep run. Robertson and Jones (if he comea back fine) would help them soooo much.

[Eminor3rd]

Kieboom and Soto have both had a ton of helium since prospect list season. I'd be thrilled if we got either of them for any of our relievers -- no way we'd ever get both.

[Eminor3rd]

The next question is going to be about cash flow, with the Robert deal.

 

Obviously we're hoping to clear a lot of salary from July-September, but how much, for example, is JR willing to eat to get a Kieboom or Soto (assuming that Robles is completely unrealistic).

 

If the suggestion is Soto and a secondary starting pitching prospect for Herrera (control through 2018) and Cain (FA), we're going to have to eat at least 1/3rd or 1/2 to make it feasible for the Nationals.

 

Otherwise, they'll just go to cheaper options like Herrera, Hand, Tony Watson, etc.

 

I wouldn't be shocked if we saw some salary-dumping, especially for guys who are underperforming by the deadline.

 

I also imagine we'll see fewer rebound free agents next year. Robert was a big expense for an owner who has explicitly lobbied against paying amateurs tons of money for years.

 

Good to know Hahn can talk JR into it, though.

[caulfield12]

You're assuming there is only one buyer and they'll have their pickings of the reliever market. The price for Herrera may end up being a lot higher if multiple teams are interested.

 

The reverse argument:

 

1) They don't have to worry about winning the NL East at this point.

2) Glover's doing okay, SO FAR

3) They have Harper for the next two years, so the desperation in the playoffs might not set in until 2018

4) Already gutted part of their system with the Eaton trade

5) They need a CF to replace Taylor as well...so we're not a good match for providing two players in one deal.

6) There are at least 3-4 other options available other than Robertson, at much cheaper salaries

7) Robles is the future for when Harper's gone, they have to hold some powder

Edited May 22, 2017 by caulfield12

[NCsoxfan]

I don't care how bad the Nats bullpen is, how good Robertson is looking, it would be unfathomable IMO to deal Robles.

 

That being said I really hope it happens, but it makes zero sense on a value basis

[caulfield12]

I wouldn't be shocked if we saw some salary-dumping, especially for guys who are underperforming by the deadline.

 

I also imagine we'll see fewer rebound free agents next year. Robert was a big expense for an owner who has explicitly lobbied against paying amateurs tons of money for years.

 

Good to know Hahn can talk JR into it, though.

 

Yeah, it won't be for another Holland, Shields or Miguel Gonzalez, it will be cases like Pelfrey where we're paying almost nothing.

 

And, for the moment, it seems like the veteran money might go into either catcher or the bullpen...although it would seem they have plenty of young arms to throw at the wall (right now) and determine which ones are going to stick.

 

The only thing that could change this timeline would be if MOST of their youngsters excelled in the second half and they looked like the 2014 Royals at the end of the season, or 2015 Astros/Cubs...ahead of their competitiveness windowl. With the struggles of Giolito and Fulmer (last start), it's hard to imagine the young starting pitchers ALL doing well. We might be lucky if 1/3 (AAA prospects) has an ERA under 4. Then again, Kopech seems like the one who could really come up and dominate from the get go, if they do bring him up this August/September. From everything you read though, it seems they want him to spend the entire year in AA/AAA.

Edited May 22, 2017 by caulfield12

[southsider2k5]

If the Nats owner blocked that, he messed up.

 

Big time. That isn't much at all.

[steveno89]

Yeah, it won't be for another Holland, Shields or Miguel Gonzalez, it will be cases like Pelfrey where we're paying almost nothing.

 

And, for the moment, it seems like the veteran money might go into either catcher or the bullpen...although it would seem they have plenty of young arms to throw at the wall (right now) and determine which ones are going to stick.

 

The only thing that could change this timeline would be if MOST of their youngsters excelled in the second half and they looked like the 2014 Royals at the end of the season, or 2015 Astros/Cubs...ahead of their competitiveness windowl. With the struggles of Giolito and Fulmer (last start), it's hard to imagine the young starting pitchers ALL doing well. We might be lucky if 1/3 (AAA prospects) has an ERA under 4. Then again, Kopech seems like the one who could really come up and dominate from the get go, if they do bring him up this August/September. From everything you read though, it seems they want him to spend the entire year in AA/AAA.

 

Kopech needs alot more time in the minors before the Sox should even think about calling him up. He has only thrown 177 professional innings in his career so far, and has to work on cutting down on the walks.

 

Nationals really are in a tough spot because they do not want to deal any more significant prospects after the Eaton deal.

[NCsoxfan]

Kopech needs alot more time in the minors before the Sox should even think about calling him up. He has only thrown 177 professional innings in his career so far, and has to work on cutting down on the walks.

 

Nationals really are in a tough spot because they do not want to deal any more significant prospects after the Eaton deal.

 

They might not want to, but it would be way worse to have a great team and not be willing to budge for a crucial bullpen piece. That team is not winning in October without a few more arms. No chance.

[Harry Chappas]

Would Burdi and Robertson get you Robles?

[chitownsportsfan]

If Kopech is blowing through AA and gets promoted into AAA in say August, makes a few starts down there and still has 20 odd inning until he reaches his limit, I'd love to see him used like Sale's first year and get his feet wet in MLB in September.

[BlackSox13]

Would Burdi and Robertson get you Robles?

Sure would, as long as a full psychiatric evaluation of Rick Hahn came with the deal.

[maggsmaggs]

Sure would, as long as a full psychiatric evaluation of Rick Hahn came with the deal.

Robles is a five-tool talent who, if he reaches his ceiling, would have WAY more value than Burdi ever would. It's Washington who would say no to that deal, not the Sox.

[bmags]

Robles is a five-tool talent who, if he reaches his ceiling, would have WAY more value than Burdi ever would. It's Washington who would say no to that deal, not the Sox.

 

I think Burdi/Robertson could net Robles honestly.

[BlackSox13]

Robles is a five-tool talent who, if he reaches his ceiling, would have WAY more value than Burdi ever would. It's Washington who would say no to that deal, not the Sox.

Would love to have Robles but not at the expense of adding Burdi to the deal. Burdi presents two options going forward, 1) he could be the future Sox closer 2) he could net a Giles type haul in another year or two that would easily net more value than Robles currently presents, which admittedly is alot. Trading Burdi now, IMHO, would not exactly be the best way to maximise his trade value.

 

That said, if the Nat's were willing to offer Robles along with one of Kieboom/Soto and a lesser third piece for Robertson/Burdi, I'm all ears.

[bmags]

Robles is better in ranking now than anything Giles returned so it would represent a strategy to utilize a ceiling lockdown reliever for a potential 5 tool CFer. I would make that deal.

 

I like Burdi though, I think he'll be great. But Robles if he was awesome would be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Burdi