I think you guys are overreacting about a really small sample size. Everyone has a couple bad games and nobody was touching Verlander last night. He'll be fine.

12 minutes ago, TaylorStSox said:

That's really up to the team dynamic. If Madrigal develops, the Sox are a better overall team with Moncada at 3rd despite his WAR suffering. I'd rather have a better team than have Moncada have a better WAR. Defensive WAR is bullshit anyway. 

Best chance for Sox to have a contending team was going to be Yoan at 2nd and landing a power hitting 3rd baseman.  Yoan had a chance to be a top tier 2B instead of a run of the mill 3B.  Too bad the Sox feel Madrigal is a guarantee to be a major leaguer.  

23 minutes ago, fathom said:

Best chance for Sox to have a contending team was going to be Yoan at 2nd and landing a power hitting 3rd baseman.  Yoan had a chance to be a top tier 2B instead of a run of the mill 3B.  Too bad the Sox feel Madrigal is a guarantee to be a major leaguer.  

Or they could have a power hitting catcher and a light hitting 2nd baseman. There's no best way to do it. The whole is what matters. 

The best Sox team I've ever seen had a light hitting LF and made up for it with good hitting from non traditional positions. 

12 minutes ago, TaylorStSox said:

Or they could have a power hitting catcher and a light hitting 2nd baseman. There's no best way to do it. The whole is what matters. 

I think it’s an optimization issue. There aren’t many catchers who will hit 30 homeruns, so you’ve got to get yourself one of the dozens of first basemen who will. You might succeed otherwise; it’s just more difficult. But you’re right, the whole picture is the important thing, and that’s why I liked this.

45 minutes ago, fathom said:

Best chance for Sox to have a contending team was going to be Yoan at 2nd and landing a power hitting 3rd baseman.  Yoan had a chance to be a top tier 2B instead of a run of the mill 3B.  Too bad the Sox feel Madrigal is a guarantee to be a major leaguer.  

This is how I feel about the move to 3B.  You are taking away the potential for a true power hitter at the corner and having a hopefully elite or top 3 hitting 2b.  Nobody can change my mind on this.  Madrigal would have to have an OBP of nearly 400 to be as valuable since he has no pop.

Good timing with me bumping this thread yesterday and Yoan's golden sombrero.

The thing is, even with the 4ks he's still way above where I thought he would be at this point in this season

Can't wait to see what he does as a 24 year old.

 

3 minutes ago, BackDoorBreach said:

This is how I feel about the move to 3B.  You are taking away the potential for a true power hitter at the corner and having a hopefully elite or top 3 hitting 2b.  Nobody can change my mind on this.  Madrigal would have to have an OBP of nearly 400 to be as valuable since he has no pop.

OT but sign Rendon and problem solved. Madrigal becomes the super utility guy, White Sox version of Brock Holt if you will.

9 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

OT but sign Rendon and problem solved. Madrigal becomes the super utility guy, White Sox version of Brock Holt if you will.

That would be ideal.  Finding a slugging 3B is a lot easier than finding a power 2B. 

1 minute ago, BackDoorBreach said:

That would be ideal.  Finding a slugging 3B is a lot easier than finding a power 2B. 

Yep the goal needs to be creating a powerhouse lineup and not just trying to put together an offense with numerous low ceiling players.  

34 minutes ago, The Sir said:

I think it’s an optimization issue. There aren’t many catchers who will hit 30 homeruns, so you’ve got to get yourself one of the dozens of first basemen who will. You might succeed otherwise; it’s just more difficult. But you’re right, the whole picture is the important thing, and that’s why I liked this.

Collins

Sox have faced some tougher pitching lately.  Just wait until he feasts against the dogs of the AL Central all August and September.

30 minutes ago, TaylorStSox said:

Collins

He said catchers

19 minutes ago, bmags said:

He said catchers

This is the same team that played AJ at C for years because of his bat. It's going to be hard for Collins to be worse than that. AJ looked like he wasn't even trying a lot of the time. 

He is having a nice season so far. Through 180 at bats he has 29 RBI and 9 homers, hitting .278. Advanced stats are all good. He could easily make the all-star team.

I have no doubt that Moncada will be a plus defender at 3B by the end of the season. He's a much better 3B than he is a 2B and for as much as everyone (myself included) b**** about poor defense we all should be happy that he's at his better position 

4 hours ago, Jack Parkman said:

I have no doubt that Moncada will be a plus defender at 3B by the end of the season. He's a much better 3B than he is a 2B and for as much as everyone (myself included) b**** about poor defense we all should be happy that he's at his better position 

Is it just me, or does it seem like Moncada throws into the path of the runner quite a bit? Perhaps it is just inexperience, but I feel like I've seen the runner dodging Abreu a bunch this season.

8 hours ago, TaylorStSox said:

That's really up to the team dynamic. If Madrigal develops, the Sox are a better overall team with Moncada at 3rd despite his WAR suffering. I'd rather have a better team than have Moncada have a better WAR. Defensive WAR is bullshit anyway. 

Amen!

7 hours ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

OT but sign Rendon and problem solved. Madrigal becomes the super utility guy, White Sox version of Brock Holt if you will.

I would hope he is much better than Holt. Holt is an average hitter w below average power, average runner and average glove who can play inf and some outfield. A real utility guy.  Holt is Leury.  I hope Madrigal is a major step up. 

5 hours ago, greg775 said:

He is having a nice season so far. Through 180 at bats he has 29 RBI and 9 homers, hitting .278. Advanced stats are all good. He could easily make the all-star team.

Probably not based on current stats.  White Sox won't have a huge vote and there are 4-5 other 3rd basemen w better overall years.  

Nine homers ain't bad and more are coming.

I miss patient Moncada. He's now too aggressive up there, similar to Timmy swinging at everything. He needs to learn how to balance that out.

3 hours ago, SoxAce said:

I miss patient Moncada. He's now too aggressive up there, similar to Timmy swinging at everything. He needs to learn how to balance that out.

^^^^^

He's doing well, but he could be so much better if he had a good mix of approaches. His OBP is being neutered by his current approach. My worst fears are coming true with him. If he can learn to pick and choose which pitches to be aggressive on he'll be a superstar. 

If this is what he needs to do for this season, fine it's working. I hope in 2020 he backs off the free swinging and has a good mix. This could be one step in the evolution of great player. He's only 24. 

Edited May 23, 20196 yr by Jack Parkman

3 hours ago, SoxAce said:

I miss patient Moncada. He's now too aggressive up there, similar to Timmy swinging at everything. He needs to learn how to balance that out.

I’ll take the one with an 840 OPS over the one with the 712 OPS. Walks are great, not if it’s sacrficing everything else. 

4 minutes ago, mqr said:

I’ll take the one with an 840 OPS over the one with the 712 OPS. Walks are great, not if it’s sacrficing everything else. 

Easily. And I don't get why there's so much doubt. He's 23 and improved vastly between seasons, all while having to play at a new position. I have complete faith in him to continue to improve.