6 minutes ago, Eminor3rd said:

The implication is what was wrong about what you said.

I’m arguing that the Phillies are much more likely to win a free agent bidding war than the White Sox, given that they’ve done so several times in recent history, and consistently have bff run substantially higher payrolls for the past two decades. You’re trying to argue against that, I guess based on them not signing every player they were interested in last year, the same year they won the bidding to give out the richest free agent contract in the history of baseball?

Well the White Sox have been connected to exactly one tip top free agent in a decade and they didn't get him; so they have won a bidding WAR for a top free agent 50% of the time in recent history (Grandal). 

I didn't imply anything; I said the Phillies being "Front runners" means about as much as when the Sox were "Front runners." None of it matters until they sign, and the Phillies aren't some team that you can't outbid - as has been proven multiple times recently - regardless of whether the Phillies say they won't be outbid or not.

It doesn't mean the Sox will sign Wheeler; it simply means the "report" this morning means very little.

Edited December 4, 20196 yr by Look at Ray Ray Run

2 minutes ago, Sockin said:

Another thing to consider with Bumgarner is I don't know if he would gel with this clubhouse, namely Tim. I believe he's a "play the game the right way" guy. 

Yep. He is chief of the fun police.

$18M for 35-year-old Hamels and we have people balking at $22M for a guy that's been a top-20ish pitcher in baseball the last 2 seasons. lol

I still want to believe the Sox were entertaining a free agent today at GRF.

2 minutes ago, Sockin said:

Another thing to consider with Bumgarner is I don't know if he would gel with this clubhouse, namely Tim. I believe he's a "play the game the right way" guy. 

Shouldn't a "game" be fun?  That is what Tim makes it, fun, and that is the right way IMHO

3 minutes ago, soxfan2014 said:

There was some other list I saw yesterday on Twitter that showed pitches that were called balls that were either a ball's length off or over the plate and Wheeler was on the list. I don't know if it was ordered from most to least or not but Reynaldo Lopez had the top spot.

It's been said that Gio and Lopez were hurt near the top of the list by poor pitch framing which is on McCann and Castillo. That's why I see no need for McCann to be Gio's personal catcher unless he strictly prefers it. But I'm sure he knows the numbers on being hurt by pitching framing and will be open to having Grandal catch him.

3 minutes ago, Jack Parkman said:

Hes the Chairman of the Unwritten Rules club. Verlander is his Vice Chairman. 

I think it was him that flipped a lid when a player went back to the dugout and touched the mound. 

That was like Dallas Braden and Arod lol

Just now, wegner said:

Shouldn't a "game" be fun?  That is what Tim makes it, fun, and that is the right way IMHO

Oh no I totally agree with the vibe the clubhouse is going for. I just know Bumgarner has a very old school mentality and could see potential clubhouse issues with that. 

2 minutes ago, bmags said:

pitchers I like but are high variability (aside from ryu)

Decent chance at 3rd starter production:

Miley 

Decent chance at fourth starter production

Porcello (move him back to primarily 2 seam/sinker)

Jordan Lyles

Pineda (gopher ball)

Martin Perez (pair cutter with coop)

 

So yeah, bumgarner starts to look better. 

 

Idk why you even like Ryu. He's made of glass. I have no interest whatsoever in him. Especially when Boras is involved. 

Just now, BackDoorBreach said:

That was like Dallas Braden and Arod lol

Oh it was? never mind. lol. 

OTOH sox could use some good intensity in the club house, and I've never heard people didn't like bumgarner on their team.

1 minute ago, Jack Parkman said:

Idk why you even like Ryu. He's made of glass. I have no interest whatsoever in him. Especially when Boras is involved. 

Guys I'm starting to be concerned you actually think he is made out of glass.

Just now, Sockin said:

Oh no I totally agree with the vibe the clubhouse is going for. I just know Bumgarner has a very old school mentality and could see potential clubhouse issues with that. 

I was not disagreeing with you, sorry if I made it seem that way.  I was questioning the attitude of some players who have a problem with others who make the game fun.

5 minutes ago, Sockin said:

Another thing to consider with Bumgarner is I don't know if he would gel with this clubhouse, namely Tim. I believe he's a "play the game the right way" guy. 

This is so overblown as any reason for not having him. You are talking about a guy who destroyed post season pitching records and played on a lot of years in MLB . I'm pretty sure he has had fun team mates before .

Just now, Jack Parkman said:

Idk why you even like Ryu. He's made of glass. I have no interest whatsoever in him. Especially when Boras is involved. 

Maybe the fact that he has a career ERA of 2.98 and career FIP of 3.32.  Ryu is really good.  Yes he is an injury risk.  But even if he only starts 20-25 games for you, he's going to be a very good pitcher for you when he's on the mound.

His injury history will also depress his market, so his price tag shouldn't be outrageous.  I'd prefer Wheeler over Ryu all things being equal.  But if one costs 6/$130M and the other costs 3/$55M-60M, I am taking Ryu. 

1 minute ago, bmags said:

Guys I'm starting to be concerned you actually think he is made out of glass.

He's always fucking injured. Last year was his first healthy season in 3 years. He pitched around 100 innings in the previous two, IIRC. 

3 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Maybe the fact that he has a career ERA of 2.98 and career FIP of 3.32.  Ryu is really good.  Yes he is an injury risk.  But even if he only starts 20-25 games for you, he's going to be a very good pitcher for you when he's on the mound.

His injury history will also depress his market, so his price tag shouldn't be outrageous.  I'd prefer Wheeler over Ryu all things being equal.  But if one costs 6/$130M and the other costs 3/$55M-60M, I am taking Ryu. 

Problem is once Wheeler is gone, Boras will have the Sox cornered and he will drag it out until March and before you know it 3/60 turns into 4/85 which is alot for a 32 year old glass joe. 

Edited December 4, 20196 yr by SoCalChiSox

4 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

This is so overblown as any reason for not having him. You are talking about a guy who destroyed post season pitching records and played on a lot of years in MLB . I'm pretty sure he has had fun team mates before .

Considering the organization's history dealing with clubhouse disputes and how outspoken players have been, this is something I would have to consider IMO. 

Edited December 4, 20196 yr by Sockin

1 minute ago, ChiSox59 said:

Maybe the fact that he has a career ERA of 2.98 and career FIP of 3.32.  Ryu is really good.  Yes he is an injury risk.  But even if he only starts 20-25 games for you, he's going to be a very good pitcher for you when he's on the mound.

His injury history will also depress his market, so his price tag shouldn't be outrageous.  I'd prefer Wheeler over Ryu all things being equal.  But if one costs 6/$130M and the other costs 3/$55M-60M, I am taking Ryu. 

Oh he's good, when he's healthy. Which rarely happens. He's been in MLB for 6 seasons and has pitched 160+ innings only twice. 

 

1 minute ago, Jack Parkman said:

Oh he's good, when he's healthy. Which rarely happens. He's been in MLB for 6 seasons and has pitched 160+ innings only twice. 

Well thank goodness the focus is on a guy who has done it three times in 6 years instead!

1 minute ago, Jack Parkman said:

Oh he's good, when he's healthy. Which rarely happens. He's been in MLB for 6 seasons and has pitched 160+ innings only twice. 

Yes, he is injured a lot.  I do think you have to at least consider the fact that LAD has been LOADED with SP during his tenure, and likely took it alot easier on him than other orgs would have.  I think he would have thrown more innings / made more starts for pretty much every other org.  But yes, he's fragile.  No denying that.  I do think that risk will be priced in though - whereas Wheeler has also been injured alot, and seemingly there will be no discount whatsoever for that risk. 

17 minutes ago, BackDoorBreach said:

Guess who would have given up 45 HRs last year if his home games weren't in an airport?

 

Just curious have you done this with Wheeler ?

If it wasn't for the gopher ball issue/PTGTRW shit, I'd prefer Bumgarner over Wheeler, mostly because of his left-handedness. Bum struck out 200 guys last year, so it looks like he still has it for the most part. If the ball is de-juiced and the HRs become flyouts, then what happens to Bumgarner's performance? 

Edited December 4, 20196 yr by Jack Parkman

5 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Just curious have you done this with Wheeler ?

No, he doesn't pitch in the most pitcher friendly park and probably division in baseball.  

Bum gave up 30 HRs, evenly split at 15/15.  If you put him here he would have been destroyed.