27 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

The Red Sox also allowed Sale to push harder than the White Sox did. When he  pitched against the White Sox in either ‘17 or ‘18 (I don’t remember which game it was) he actually threw his hardest recorded big league pitch since 2011 when he was being used as a reliever. He was also throwing his slider about twice as often in Boston as in Chicago.

Cooper tried to reign in Sale in 2016 cause he was worried his arm wouldn't last. He wasn't throwing as hard and tried to pitch to contact. Boston didn't care and they burned him out in 2 years. 

52 minutes ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:

This is a horrible post.. Prime Sale was a top 3-5 SP in the league lol

I think Kopech is the best pitcher in baseball right now. He's just as good as Sale was. Does he maintain that over several seasons? I don't know. But his stuff is absolutely filthy. Not many guys can throw as hard as he does, with that much movement. 

Sale was amazing, but everyone knew his arm was going to fall off at some point. Kopech seems to be able to throw what he throws, effortlessly. 

2 minutes ago, Paulie4Pres said:

I think Kopech is the best pitcher in baseball right now. He's just as good as Sale was. Does he maintain that over several seasons? I don't know. But his stuff is absolutely filthy. Not many guys can throw as hard as he does, with that much movement. 

Sale was amazing, but everyone knew his arm was going to fall off at some point. Kopech seems to be able to throw what he throws, effortlessly. 

Kopech at his best is totally one of the best pitchers in baseball. He just needs to work on his consistency from start to start. I guess it's part of the growing pains of ramping up his innings. 

Sale was also a big part of a Boston team that won a World Series.  If Kopech stays around there’s no reason he won’t be one of the best pitchers in baseball for a while just as Chris was.  Trade made sense for both teams at the time and might turn out to be a win for both teams.

Edited June 8, 20223 yr by Rowand44

Kopech is going to be one of the best pitchers in the game for a while.  Been saying that for some time.  

2 hours ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:

This is a horrible post.. Prime Sale was a top 3-5 SP in the league lol

Plus he was 23 when he started dominating as a starting pitcher. Kopech, 26, in his 1st year of starting and there's still doubt if he will be fresh enough to pitch well in the playoffs. Sale gave the Sox 5 great years doing that.

Kopech is still in flavor of the moment mode. His future seems bright , no doubt , but time will tell.

Edited June 8, 20223 yr by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

17 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

Plus he was 23 when he started dominating as a starting pitcher. Kopech, 26, in his 1st year of starting and there's still doubt if he will be fresh enough to pitch well in the playoffs. Sale gave the Sox 5 great years doing that.

Kopech is still in flavor of the moment mode. His future seems bright , no doubt , but time will tell.

Well in fairness to Kopech, between having Tommy John surgery and COVID he basically had 2 years ctrl+alt+deleted and it really was nobody's fault, otherwise he would've probably had that impact at age 23 also

54 minutes ago, ChiSox59 said:

Kopech is going to be one of the best pitchers in the game for a while.  Been saying that for some time.  

yep, I feel like you and I championed SO HARD last year for him to make the rotation last year to be in the playoffs. I have probably 25+ posts yelling at FO for the horrible plan they had last year. 

Edited June 8, 20223 yr by EloyJenkins

15 minutes ago, lostfan said:

Well in fairness to Kopech, between having Tommy John surgery and COVID he basically had 2 years ctrl+alt+deleted and it really was nobody's fault, otherwise he would've probably had that impact at age 23 also

But what was cannot be changed so it's irrelevant. It's even more irrelevant when Paulie for Pres is saying he wouldn't trade prime Kopech for prime Sale straight up when prime Sale lasted for quite a while and prime Kopech is just getting started and also saying everyone knew Sales arm would fall off eventually and Kopech throws effortlessly when Kopech's arm actually fell off way before Sales did. Those are the things I was responding to.

Edited June 8, 20223 yr by CaliSoxFanViaSWside

2 minutes ago, EloyJenkins said:

yep, I feel like you and I championed SO HARD last year for him to make the rotation last year to be in the playoffs. 

Yeah.  The way the Sox have handled Kopech is literally awful, starting with the unnecessary call up in 2018 that lead to disaster.  But we are where we are and he's really fucking good.  That said, he's going to need some rest at some point this summer.  I don't see him going much beyond 120 IP in the regular season, and he's on pace for more like 150 IP, so something is going to have to give at some point.  

7 minutes ago, CaliSoxFanViaSWside said:

But what was cannot be changed so it's irrelevant when Paulie for Pres is saying everyone knew Sales arm would fall off eventually and Kopech throws effortlessly when Kopech's arm actually fell off way before Sales did.

Kopech looks like this after surgery, so it's a bit different than Sale, isn't it? Sale has 9 starts over the last 3 seasons, and is hurt again this season.

9 hours ago, Paulie4Pres said:

But, the Sox lost the Chris Sale trade, right???? 

I wouldn't trade prime Kopech for prime Sale, straight up. Even if their salaries were identical... And somehow, people think the Sox LOST that trade.

Never mind this guy called Yoan Moncada.

Lol @ Sox fans. Unreal idiots.

 

Nobody said that

9 minutes ago, Paulie4Pres said:

Kopech looks like this after surgery, so it's a bit different than Sale, isn't it? Sale has 9 starts over the last 3 seasons, and is hurt again this season.

And that's the whole point. Sale starts over the last 3 years mean nothing since you said you wouldn't trade prime Kopech for prime Sale. Only their prime years count. If I was to gamble on whose prime will be longer I'd take Sale's every time because he started younger and it lasted 7 -8 yrs and amassed around 43 fWAR if I don't count his reliever years.

You ,on the other hand, have to wait another 6-7 years to even try to back up that statement you made about not trading prime Kopech for prime Sale. That's why you're getting comments  questioning your overly enthusiastic claims. Kopech is in year 1 and approx. 42 fWAR behind Sale.

If the world ended today, Boston won the trade. When its all said and done, Chicago likely will have won the trade. Prime Sale vs prime Kopech is irrelevant. That's a single moment in time and isn't indicative of the past or predictive of the future - and those are what determine a good or bad trade.

Edited June 8, 20223 yr by SpringfieldFan

I predict Kopech wins the CY Young the first year he reaches 200 IP.

Controversial take:

The Sale trade seems to be working out for both teams.

11 hours ago, Paulie4Pres said:

I think Kopech is the best pitcher in baseball right now. He's just as good as Sale was. Does he maintain that over several seasons? I don't know. But his stuff is absolutely filthy. Not many guys can throw as hard as he does, with that much movement. 

Sale was amazing, but everyone knew his arm was going to fall off at some point. Kopech seems to be able to throw what he throws, effortlessly. 

I would say it like this. Kopech makes it look easy. But I don’t believe scouts would say he has an effortless delivery.