Cease To Padres per Passan

[Sports Guy]

Just now, fathom said:

Getz’s focus on players has been significantly different than his predecessor.

I’m sure, which I said in that post..but that doesn’t change what I said.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

3 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I want to be clear..Getz is doing what he should be doing. This is how these things work. Trading team asking for too much…teams trading for player are offering too little.  Eventually some team is able to come to an agreement.

Getz is doing his job and as of now, he’s doing it properly and well.

Elias and other GMs are doing the same.

But an unreasonable trade, such as Mayo and Cowser (which is where this started) has zippy chance of happening and if it did, it would be done by now. I don’t see how anyone can possibly disagree with that.

I still don’t understand what makes Mayo untouchable. Right handed power bat that hits for a decent average but strikes out a lot and likely ends up at 1b/LF. He better hit bombs like Pete Alonso to be untouchable with that profile.

[Baron]

Just now, Sports Guy said:

I didn’t but it also doesn’t change my point. Getz was likely involved in those talks and while he may have different ideas than what Hahn wanted, the conversations still happened and the negotiations were still there and no question Getz was either involved or knew what was being said.

Yes you absolutely did. That's why you have all that word salad in this post. 

How the hell do you know what Getz's role was in those conversations. Despite your conviction the answer could be he knew almost nothing because that's not what his role was. Also if you knew what Kenny and Ricks tenure/roles were during the past few decades you would see how silly that statement was. 

[SkokieSox]

1 minute ago, Sports Guy said:

In this case, they are.

So, to be clear, if a team was offering him multiple top 35 prospects, your stance is that Getz would be saying no?

He’d say yes, as any reasonable person would. 

[caulfield12]

1 minute ago, Sports Guy said:

I didn’t but it also doesn’t change my point. Getz was likely involved in those talks and while he may have different ideas than what Hahn wanted, the conversations still happened and the negotiations were still there and no question Getz was either involved or knew what was being said.

Surprising we didn't have a more productive deadline with KW and Hahn actively working so well together...Getz was likely the icing on the cake.

So Chris must have agreed on trading Burger over Anderson.

[fathom]

1 minute ago, Sports Guy said:

In this case, they are.

So, to be clear, if a team was offering him multiple top 35 prospects, your stance is that Getz would be saying no?

If he truly thinks they need to get pitching as the headliner, then it’s possible. Sox have learned in the past that not every top 50 or so prospect is the same (ie…Rutherford)

[Baron]

2 minutes ago, fathom said:

Getz’s focus on players has been significantly different than his predecessor.

and in his opening remarks when was he was hired he said as much. But like I said in my reply to him how does he know what Getz's role was in those conversations? It sounds to me like he didn't like the direction of anything going on with this club for years. 

[fathom]

2 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

I still don’t understand what makes Mayo untouchable. Right handed power bat that hits for a decent average but strikes out a lot and likely ends up at 1b/LF. He better hit bombs like Pete Alonso to be untouchable with that profile.

Good luck being a righty power hitter in that park

[Baron]

In another conversation anyone want to try and figure out with me which was worse today the Sale trade or Montas's contract? I'm leaning towards Montas. 

[fathom]

1 minute ago, Baron said:

and in his opening remarks when was he was hired he said as much. But like I said in my reply to him how does he know what Getz's role was in those conversations? It sounds to me like he didn't like the direction of anything going on with this club for years. 

Yep, so Hahn might have asked for outfielders as the headliner, but everything we’ve heard last month or so is it has to be pitching.

[WhiteSox2023]

5 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

I still don’t understand what makes Mayo untouchable. Right handed power bat that hits for a decent average but strikes out a lot and likely ends up at 1b/LF. He better hit bombs like Pete Alonso to be untouchable with that profile.

This is a good point.  If Mayo can’t stick at 3B and is just a righty power hitting 1B, is he still worth a ton?  It does look like his power is legit, unlike Andrew Vaughn.

Edited December 31, 2023 by WhiteSox2023

[fathom]

Just now, Baron said:

In another conversation anyone want to try and figure out with me which was worse today the Sale trade or Montas's contract? I'm leaning towards Montas. 

Sale trade, as Braves are a World Series contender and did nothing to add more reliability to their rotation.  The only thing I like for them is they held on to AJSS and Waldrep, as I don’t trust Morton, Fried and Sale to stay healthy.

[Baron]

1 minute ago, fathom said:

Sale trade, as Braves are a World Series contender and did nothing to add more reliability to their rotation.  The only thing I like for them is they held on to AJSS and Waldrep, as I don’t trust Morton, Fried and Sale to stay healthy.

So far they've had a dismal offseason. 

[Sports Guy]

2 minutes ago, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

I still don’t understand what makes Mayo untouchable. Right handed power bat that hits for a decent average but strikes out a lot and likely ends up at 1b/LF. He better hit bombs like Pete Alonso to be untouchable with that profile.

First of all, the whole right handed thing is irrelevant. Good hitters are good hitters.

He really doesn’t strike out a lot, especially for the type of hitter he is.  In fact, the K rate has improved as he has also walked more and starting to hit for a better average.

He is a very good athlete with a high end bat that has huge power and EVs and he is doing it at ages that are far younger than the league averages.

If he went to college, he would have been draft eligible last draft and probably would have been a top 5 pick. If he does that, you aren’t thinking right now that he is a guy that is available in trade.

And again, he can handle third base at the ML level. In fact, if Holliday doesn’t show more improvement at SS (I think he will), Mayo likely will end up at third.

But since Holliday is likely a SS long term and Gunnar Henderson is a GG level third baseman, Mayo will likely be moved..but that’s for the Os and because of the talent they have.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

2 minutes ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

This is a good point.  If Mayo can’t stick at 3B and is just a righty power hitting 1B, is he still worth a ton?

If he hits 40+ bombs with a high OBP that certainly has a lot of value but the likelihood of him doing that at the big league level Is very low.

[Sports Guy]

7 minutes ago, SkokieSox said:

He’d say yes, as any reasonable person would. 

Right, so the whole idea that he’s waiting for one of those pitchers isn’t correct.

And the whole idea that he hasn’t gotten a deal i say is unreasonable is also correct because, as you said, any reasonable person would make that trade.

[Sports Guy]

9 minutes ago, Baron said:

Yes you absolutely did. That's why you have all that word salad in this post. 

How the hell do you know what Getz's role was in those conversations. Despite your conviction the answer could be he knew almost nothing because that's not what his role was. Also if you knew what Kenny and Ricks tenure/roles were during the past few decades you would see how silly that statement was. 

There is zero question he was involved in the talks..whether directly or indirectly. No doubt he knows what teams were saying, what the WS wanted, etc…and even if he didnt(which isn’t true), he has been talking a Cease trade for 6+ weeks now.

 

[Baron]

Just now, Sports Guy said:

There is zero question he was involved in the talks..whether directly or indirectly. No doubt he knows what teams were saying, what the WS wanted, etc…and even if he didnt(which isn’t true), he has been talking a Cease trade for 6+ weeks now.

 

How do you know this? I want to hear your thought process behind this. 

[fathom]

2 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

There is zero question he was involved in the talks..whether directly or indirectly. No doubt he knows what teams were saying, what the WS wanted, etc…and even if he didnt(which isn’t true), he has been talking a Cease trade for 6+ weeks now.

 

You have no idea how dysfunctional the front office was last year, especially around the deadline.

[Sports Guy]

15 minutes ago, fathom said:

I don’t get why anyone would take it so personally when another fan base, on their team board, wants their GM to get a huge return.  Trading Cease is the Sox Super Bowl for the upcoming season.

No one is taking it personally.  In fact, your fans are the ones calling Elias names, wishing the Os ill will, etc..because he won’t take it up the ass in a deal for Cease.  They seem to be the ones taking it personally 

As a fan, you should want everything you can get. I’m not blaming you for that but that doesn’t mean you (not you you but general you) are being realistic in what Cease should get back.

[JUSTgottaBELIEVE]

1 minute ago, Sports Guy said:

First of all, the whole right handed thing is irrelevant. Good hitters are good hitters.

He really doesn’t strike out a lot, especially for the type of hitter he is.  In fact, the K rate has improved as he has also walked more and starting to hit for a better average.

He is a very good athlete with a high end bat that has huge power and EVs and he is doing it at ages that are far younger than the league averages.

If he went to college, he would have been draft eligible last draft and probably would have been a top 5 pick. If he does that, you aren’t thinking right now that he is a guy that is available in trade.

And again, he can handle third base at the ML level. In fact, if Holliday doesn’t show more improvement at SS (I think he will), Mayo likely will end up at third.

But since Holliday is likely a SS long term and Gunnar Henderson is a GG level third baseman, Mayo will likely be moved..but that’s for the Os and because of the talent they have.

From everything I’ve read, scouts think he ends up at 1b/LF. And a strikeout rate in the mid 20s percent in the minor leagues is high. This is in line with what Robert did in the minors (Robert also did and still does have a ton of power). The difference being Robert plays a premium position very well. If Robert was putting up the numbers he has but while playing 1b, his value would be a small fraction of what it is.

[Sports Guy]

Just now, fathom said:

You have no idea how dysfunctional the front office was last year, especially around the deadline.

I’m an Os fan..I know dysfunction all too well unfortunately.

[SkokieSox]

6 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Right, so the whole idea that he’s waiting for one of those pitchers isn’t correct.

And the whole idea that he hasn’t gotten a deal i say is unreasonable is also correct because, as you said, any reasonable person would make that trade.

I haven’t discussed pitching as a priority return. 

It’s reasonable to accept and offer whatever.

There’s little doubt you’ve convinced yourself as being correct.

Edited December 31, 2023 by SkokieSox

[Nardiwashere]

3 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

There is zero question he was involved in the talks..whether directly or indirectly. No doubt he knows what teams were saying, what the WS wanted, etc…and even if he didnt(which isn’t true), he has been talking a Cease trade for 6+ weeks now.

 

Lol just say “yeah, I misspoke. I was wrong” 

how is someone “indirectly involved” in trade talks?

[Sports Guy]

Just now, JUSTgottaBELIEVE said:

From everything I’ve read, scouts think he ends up at 1b/LF. And a strikeout rate in the mid 20s percent in the minor leagues is high. This is in line with what Robert did in the minors (Robert also did and still does have a ton of power). The difference being Robert plays a premium position very well. If Robert was putting up the numbers he has but while playing 1b, his value would be a small fraction of what it is.

The worry about Mayo at third has been does he have enough range and will he outgrow the position. Those issues are unfounded now.

But if you told me today he is a first baseman and a first baseman only, I still have zero desire to make him..if it were up to me, Mayo would be the starting first baseman as soon as his extra year of service time kicked in.