So the Orioles were at the forefront of these conversations all offseason and yet “were always a nonfactor”? Yeah I don’t buy that.

1 minute ago, PolishPrince34 said:

Don’t forget Oney Guillen and Kenny Jr.!!!

The one guy they didn't draft in Alek Thomas almost won a WS.

1 hour ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

Exactly.  Great post.  If he was 22, I think Getz would be all over him.

But then he’d be “untouchable.” 

4 minutes ago, YouCanPutItOnTheBoardYES! said:

So the Orioles were at the forefront of these conversations all offseason and yet “were always a nonfactor”? Yeah I don’t buy that.

I think he is insinuating they were never offering a real package 

1 minute ago, Squirmin' for Yermin said:

I think he is insinuating they were never offering a real package 

That’s how I read that.

I’m really starting to warmup to the Mets prospects. There farm system is loaded and have nice mix guys right at the door of MlB team and high ceiling players at the lower levels. 
 

Would love any of these prospects in the deal. Gilbert, Acuna, Williams , Houck, Tidwell, Ramirez, Clifford, and Scott.

2 hours ago, Rolle Tide said:

Again …. It could be posturing 

Your O’s have a young stud legit 3B they’re willing to trade for pitching? No? Still not willing to part with legit prospects? Yeah, their options aren’t dwindling at all…

2 hours ago, Sleepy Harold said:

I see this thread still is a dumpster fire, good to know I didn't miss much today.

Would we have it any other way?

13 minutes ago, YouCanPutItOnTheBoardYES! said:

So the Orioles were at the forefront of these conversations all offseason and yet “were always a nonfactor”? Yeah I don’t buy that.

It kind of goes along with the Orioles prospect-hugging GM.  I believe James Fox has been saying all along that he wouldn’t be surprised if a GM with balls like Cashman pulls the trigger on a Cease trade before the sackless wonder Elias ever does.

Edited January 6, 20242 yr by WhiteSox2023

Gilbert, Williams, and Houck for Cease. 
 

I think Dirty Sox might of mentioned this earlier. I’m on board with this move. 

Mariners don’t have much pitching, but they could put together a very nice 3 hitter package without damaging their system too much- Gabriel Gonzalez, Michael Arroyo, Jonatan Clase, + lotto ticket arm is a pretty nice package 

3 minutes ago, PolishPrince34 said:

Gilbert, Williams, and Houck for Cease. 
 

I think Dirty Sox might of mentioned this earlier. I’m on board with this move. 

I would imagine they’ll want an arm, even if he isn’t the headliner. 

1 minute ago, Pale Sox said:

I would imagine they’ll want an arm, even if he isn’t the headliner. 

Agreed.

1 hour ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

Orioles fans trying hard to trade Ortiz before his current #50 overall ranking on the MLB’s top 100 prospects list gets updated for 2024 and he falls to the bottom cuz he’s aged out.  ?

They seem to fail or refuse to acknowledge that Ortiz’s value to a team like the White Sox is vastly different than to a team closer to contention. Top 50 prospect status is nice and all, but it means jacks s%*# to a rebuilding team when the prospect is already 25 going on 26 and has failed to crack the 26 man roster. 

Edited January 6, 20242 yr by Tnetennba

Bleacher Report prospect rankings. Updated as of 15 hours ago. Pretty drastic differences with respect to some of the names mentioned here. 
 

https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/10103552-updated-top-100-mlb-prospects-at-the-start-of-2024.amp.html

 

1 hour ago, Chicago White Sox said:

I think Ortiz is a fairly nice prospect and for a while I really thought a Kjerstad + Ortiz + 3rd piece (~45 FV guy) was a win-win trade for both sides.  But upon further reflection, the age issue does bother me quite a bit and I don’t see him having a big ceiling.  I think there is a chance, even a good one, that he could become a 2 win SS for like a four year stretch.  But that doesn’t just move the needle for us given where we’re currently at and I’d rather have someone like Beavers who could see his status really elevate with a strong 2024 season.

Bingo. His age vs where this roster is makes him incompatible. 

One question.  How often do teams trade their most recent picks within 6 months such as Langford, Bradfield or Houck?

7 minutes ago, TheFutureIsNear said:

Mariners don’t have much pitching, but they could put together a very nice 3 hitter package without damaging their system too much- Gabriel Gonzalez, Michael Arroyo, Jonatan Clase, + lotto ticket arm is a pretty nice package 

They have six starters now with Desclafini and a pretty deep minor league system as well.

Fathom keeps mentioning Woo and Miller.

28 minutes ago, Sox72 said:

Bleacher Report prospect rankings. Updated as of 15 hours ago. Pretty drastic differences with respect to some of the names mentioned here. 
 

https://syndication.bleacherreport.com/amp/10103552-updated-top-100-mlb-prospects-at-the-start-of-2024.amp.html

 

Thanks for posting.  Ramos not being a top 150 guy is surprising.  

36 minutes ago, PolishPrince34 said:

Gilbert, Williams, and Houck for Cease. 
 

I think Dirty Sox might of mentioned this earlier. I’m on board with this move. 

I want Baty and Jett

24 minutes ago, Snowy Demon said:

One question.  How often do teams trade their most recent picks within 6 months such as Langford, Bradfield or Houck?

It used to be fully against the rules so there’s going to be very little record of it. It’s allowed by the more recent CBAs, but difficult to make work - lots of guys have only short minor league stints after playing full seasons before the draft, leaving them limited track records and often more struggles than you want.

If it’s Mets, I want Clifford. Another guy the Sox were tied to prior to the draft. I don’t love him as much as I love Roman Anthony, but they’re pretty comparable.

6 minutes ago, Balta1701 said:

It used to be fully against the rules so there’s going to be very little record of it. It’s allowed by the more recent CBAs, but difficult to make work - lots of guys have only short minor league stints after playing full seasons before the draft, leaving them limited track records and often more struggles than you want.

It still happened when it was against the rules as a ptbnl. The most notable recent example I can think of (trea turner) was during that time. But it couldn’t become official until a calendar year I believe, if that’s what you meant. 

46 minutes ago, caulfield12 said:

They have six starters now with Desclafini and a pretty deep minor league system as well.

Fathom keeps mentioning Woo and Miller.

I mean not sure I’d count DeSclafini personally…long man in the pen/depth, sure. 
And what would be a realistic innings limit with Woo this year? Seems like going into the season with him still in AAA ready for if/when there’s an injury wouldn’t be the worst idea. 
 

Of course I have no idea if the Mariners are actually interested, just going by the rumors. 

Edited January 6, 20242 yr by TheFutureIsNear

2 hours ago, WhiteSox2023 said:

 

Frobby, if Ortiz was only 22 years old right now, do you think he would have more value?  I think he would have a lot more value, assuming he was putting up the same numbers as he has recently.

Well, of course he would.  But I don’t agree that Ortiz is “over the hill.”  Here are his circumstances.  

- Drafted in 2019 at age 21.

- No minor league play in 2020 due to COVID.  

- Got off to a nice start in 2021, quickly promoted to AA but tore the labrum in his non-throwing shoulder and missed 3/4 of the year.

- Started off 2022 in AA, had a cold start, caught fire in June, promoted to AAA in late August and played very well for the remaining month.

- Played very well in AAA in 2023, struggled a bit in a few sporadic major league at bats but looked excellent defensively.  

So, his age isn’t a result of him struggling at any level of the minors.  It’s really due to the missed Covid season and then the shoulder injury.   He’s actually played very well at every long and was being moved along pretty quickly.   

So, I’m not debating that he’d be more valuable if he were younger.  I still have a high opinion of him and think some people are making too much about his age (including calling him a 26 year old when this will be his age 25 season).  His 6 years of team control will be ages 25-30 (31 by season’s end), is that really so terrible?

And as a reminder, I am not one of the posters suggesting Ortiz would be the lead piece of a package   I see him (or Norby, whomever the WS prefer) behind Kjerstad or Cowser as the second piece