Robert stays...

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

25 minutes ago, XplodingScorbord said:

Ok, this place was fun for a couple of days leading up to the deadline (and with the couple weeks worth of decent ball-playing), but now the negative nellys are back to tell us all repeatedly how awful this team will be for the next few months, so I’ll dip back out. 
 

I’ll watch the games and enjoy as long as the passable play continues. My expectations are low, so I’ll be glad for any wins and even hard-fought losses. It’s still light years better than last season. 

People aren't negative for citing stats, evidence and facts. Toxic positivity is a thing. 

The fact that you state your expectations are low yet call people negative Nellys for having low expectations is also really odd.

[DoUEvenShift]

28 minutes ago, T R U said:

This is the same cycle that has happened all year, the Sox look competent for a stretch and a handful of posters pants get tighter and then they eventually remind everyone why they are a 100 loss team.

Uh is there another 12 game stretch where we scored 84 runs with a 2.8 run differential going 8-4 (2 of the losses being 1 run) with half the games against playoff bound teams, and the other half on the road where we have been abysmal all year?

[Colome's Hat]

17 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

People aren't negative for citing stats, evidence and facts. Toxic positivity is a thing. 

The fact that you state your expectations are low yet call people negative Nellys for having low expectations is also really odd.

This team isn't that bad though.  They had an awful start but if you remove that, they are basically close to or a little under .500.  Nobody is doing cartwheels but it is progress.  They are much better than they were last year.  To be honest, the team wasn't that bad last year but they were so poorly managed that it obviously looks much worse on paper.

Getting to 60-65 wins is a big deal.  Let's say that get to 66 wins, which I think, quite frankly is a very reasonable goal.  That's a 23 win improvement, and that comes just from dumping out the last excess of toxicity and getting better coaching.  You invest smartly in the team and they could become a playoff contender next year.  Especially in an American League that is just much weaker than the NL.  86 wins could probably get you a wild card spot.

So yes, this team is no World Series contender right now.  However there is merserable progress.  As someone who is a footy fan, they are essentially a mid to lower level premier league team that is tough to beat and fun to watch.  Eventually, some of those teams vie for the equivalent of our playoffs, which is Europe.   Some of those teams make it into the conference league.  Actually Crystal Palace, if people are attuned to what is happening over there is a good shout.  You had a team underachieving and hanging around relegation due to a bad fit at manager.  They replaced him with a new manager and the difference is night and day.  

Edited August 1 by Colome's Hat

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

14 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

You should probably take a look at the rosters of the Twins and Orioles. 

Two weeks of baseball? U funny. The White Sox are 17-17 since June 20. You're hard to take seriously because you regularly do things like that. Pretend that 6 weeks of baseball is actually 2. Tee-hee. Sneaky. 

You're mocking a post where I said I can see the Sox missing 100 losses. That would require them to play 23-30 the rest of the way. But I said ".500" in there, somewhere, so argue against that and post laughing emojis. 

Seriously, if you can't read, and need to regularly make up strawmen to dunk on, just ignore my posts. I'm sorry that people are being positive without your express written permission. Life sucks that way. 

I posted their ROS war projections, which are much higher than the White Sox. If they are AAA teams, then the Sox are AA.

Do you know why you magically picked their last 34 games? Because before that stretch, they had lost 9 of 10 games, so it's not as pretty when you say they're 18-27 (40% win rate) in their last x amount of games. I don't have much tolerance for people who cherry pick start and end dates to look for the best stretch they can find. 

I also pointed out that bad teams have winning months and presented evidence of that. 

You should also stop talking about reading comprehension/intelligence and etc. I don't respond to posters, I respond to posts. You might want to give it a try one day. Instead of making things personal always, maybe try refuting the context of the post and not the poster. 

[southsider2k5]

I agree that if we leave out all of the bad parts, the Sox have been an OK team.

[WestEddy]

35 minutes ago, T R U said:

This is the same cycle that has happened all year, the Sox look competent for a stretch and a handful of posters pants get tighter and then they eventually remind everyone why they are a 100 loss team.

This roster is full of developing rookies and place holder veterans, they are going to have their ups and downs, but we still have a pretty mediocre pitching staff and the offense still leaves a lot to be desired. You can't rely on Quero, Lee, Meidroth, Montgomery, Burke, Martin, and Smith to all develop into great players because that's just not how it works. Sure would be great if it did though, but odds say a lot of those guys won't.

Luis Robert is the only impact player on this entire roster and he has been struggling for two years now and they just tried to get rid of him. We still have a lot of bad to go before we get to the good, but this season is light years more enjoyable than last season so there's that.

"Pants get tighter"? Like we're all nursing stiffies because our baseball team is looking slightly more competent? 

It's like you're telling us something I've been saying any time I post. I think most of the current roster will be gone by the next time they're "competitive". My unreasonable, crazy elation is over the White Sox looking like they might not lose 100 games this year. Boy, am I loading up on playoff tickets. LOL. 

I'm still waiting for all the people who predicted this team to lose even more than in 2024 to get to the emergency room and have their own 2-year negativity priapism treated. 

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

9 minutes ago, Colome's Hat said:

This team isn't that bad though.  They had an awful start but if you remove that, they are basically close to or a little under .500.  Nobody is doing cartwheels but it is progress.  They are much better than they were last year.  To be honest, the team wasn't that bad last year but they were so poorly managed that it obviously looks much worse on paper.

Getting to 60-65 wins is a big deal.  Let's say that get to 66 wins, which I think, quite frankly is a very reasonable goal.  That's a 23 win improvement, and that comes just from dumping out the last excess of toxicity and getting better coaching.  You invest smartly in the team and they could become a playoff contender next year.  Especially in an American League that is just much weaker than the NL.  86 wins could probably get you a wild card spot.

So yes, this team is no World Series contender right now.  However there is immerserable progress.  As someone who is a footy fan, they are essentially a mid to lower level premier league team that is tough to beat and fun to watch.  Eventually, some of those teams vie for the equivalent of our playoffs, which is Europe.   Some of those teams make it into the conference league.  Actually Crystal Palace, if people are attuned to what is happening over there is a good shout.  You had a team underachieving and hanging around relegation due to a bad fit at manager.  They replaced him with a new manager and the difference is night and day.  

They can reasonably get to 66 wins? The White Sox have less than a 5% chance of winning 66 games this year. 

You can't "remove bad periods." Everyone looks better when you remove bad periods. 

A playoff contender next year? Oh my, I'm just going to bow out from this conversation. Have a good one.

[Colome's Hat]

14 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

They can reasonably get to 66 wins? The White Sox have less than a 5% chance of winning 66 games this year. 

You can't "remove bad periods." Everyone looks better when you remove bad periods. 

A playoff contender next year? Oh my, I'm just going to bow out from this conversation. Have a good one.

I dunno, based on recent play, this teams seems very capable of going 26-27 the rest of the year.

 

That isn't great by any means but it is a marked improvement over last year.  

 

As far as playoffs, if you can nab a wild card spot or win the division with 85-86 wins, yes this team with the right investment and free agent signings/trades could absolutely do that.

 

This all gets back to the fact that the team last year was never as bad as their record indicated but were horribly mismanaged.

Edited August 1 by Colome's Hat

[T R U]

10 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

"Pants get tighter"? Like we're all nursing stiffies because our baseball team is looking slightly more competent? 

It's like you're telling us something I've been saying any time I post. I think most of the current roster will be gone by the next time they're "competitive". My unreasonable, crazy elation is over the White Sox looking like they might not lose 100 games this year. Boy, am I loading up on playoff tickets. LOL. 

I'm still waiting for all the people who predicted this team to lose even more than in 2024 to get to the emergency room and have their own 2-year negativity priapism treated. 

Nothing I said was outside of reality, yet here you are to remind everyone that this bad team is not historically bad. They're still bad either way, so I guess take your victory lap?

[T R U]

20 minutes ago, DoUEvenShift said:

Uh is there another 12 game stretch where we scored 84 runs with a 2.8 run differential going 8-4 (2 of the losses being 1 run) with half the games against playoff bound teams, and the other half on the road where we have been abysmal all year?

I guess you forgot earlier when they had a nice little stretch and there was a post about demanding apologies and another about the playoffs lol

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

26 minutes ago, DoUEvenShift said:

Uh is there another 12 game stretch where we scored 84 runs with a 2.8 run differential going 8-4 (2 of the losses being 1 run) with half the games against playoff bound teams, and the other half on the road where we have been abysmal all year?

What's funny is I'd spend a few minutes looking for this stretch among other 100 loss teams, but when I found the examples they would just be written off as negativity, and disregarded.

[DoUEvenShift]

12 minutes ago, T R U said:

I guess you forgot earlier when they had a nice little stretch and there was a post about demanding apologies and another about the playoffs lol

Yea I don't think anyone took that seriously other than OP, and even then may have been trolling. (I hope) That was posted after a 5-2 stretch which was preceded by 4 losses and followed by 8 more. All I'm saying is post ASB the team has been way better, I don't think that's too controversial. 

[T R U]

6 minutes ago, DoUEvenShift said:

Yea I don't think anyone took that seriously other than OP, and even then may have been trolling. (I hope) That was posted after a 5-2 stretch which was preceded by 4 losses and followed by 8 more. All I'm saying is post ASB the team has been way better, I don't think that's too controversial. 

Its not, they have looked better and have been much better than last year. I don't think anyone has said otherwise.

[WhiteSox2023]

22 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

"Pants get tighter"? Like we're all nursing stiffies because our baseball team is looking slightly more competent? 

It's like you're telling us something I've been saying any time I post. I think most of the current roster will be gone by the next time they're "competitive". My unreasonable, crazy elation is over the White Sox looking like they might not lose 100 games this year. Boy, am I loading up on playoff tickets. LOL. 

I'm still waiting for all the people who predicted this team to lose even more than in 2024 to get to the emergency room and have their own 2-year negativity priapism treated. 

I do get a stiffy at the thought of all of these young guys including Mead panning out.  Just not realistic unfortunately.  Just keep acquiring position player castoffs in their early 20’s and maybe a couple will pan out.

[Harry Chappas]

If there is in fact an ownership change in fiscal direction this division is no great shakes.

Picking up Robert's option shows a potential positive change in strategy.

There seems to be some positivity to the franchise and direction on what they are looking at.

[WestEddy]

19 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

I posted their ROS war projections, which are much higher than the White Sox. If they are AAA teams, then the Sox are AA.

Do you know why you magically picked their last 34 games? Because before that stretch, they had lost 9 of 10 games, so it's not as pretty when you say they're 18-27 (40% win rate) in their last x amount of games. I don't have much tolerance for people who cherry pick start and end dates to look for the best stretch they can find. 

I also pointed out that bad teams have winning months and presented evidence of that. 

You should also stop talking about reading comprehension/intelligence and etc. I don't respond to posters, I respond to posts. You might want to give it a try one day. Instead of making things personal always, maybe try refuting the context of the post and not the poster. 

Okay, so I'll take this as you admitting that 6 weeks of baseball doesn't actually equal 14 days. I really don't care what you have tolerance for. That's why I have you on ignore. I don't have tolerance for guys who will just misrepresent what I wrote, then call me names and scold me.

Obviously, you think you're waaaaaayyyyy smarter than me, and everybody else here. I mean, you have your own proprietary algorhythms, or something. LOL. So just ignore my posts. I skip over yours, and the unfortunate time I click into one, I realize I'm not missing any in depth analysis. 

Again, I understand that it sucks when people think things without asking you, first. You have the last word. Make it count. 

[LittleHurtCG]

3 hours ago, hogan873 said:

I'm fine with keeping Robert, especially based on what type of packages were traded for other outfielders.  I would imagine the Sox will pick up his option, and that's probably more certain if he continues to play like he has over the past month.  He does seem to be re-energized and is having fun.  Maybe the young guys playing well is having an effect on the clubhouse.

As far as Getz's comment on spending over the winter, I think we can agree they will.  The question is, how much and on what?  Will it be another $20M on 5-6 trash heap veterans and schlubs?  Granted, the Slater and Tauchman signings worked out, but let's not talk about the likes of Rojas.  Or, will this team actually go out and get a big, or even fairly big, name free agent?  The day they sign someone like Schwarber or Tucker is the day I believe they're going to be serious.

They have a great young core that is exciting and has a lot of promise.  Wasting that by continuing to operate like they have would be a great disservice to the fans and to the players.  I suppose time will tell...

I'm having deja vu reading this comment. Seems like we already did this song and dance like 7 years ago. Let's hope they get more creative than the Machado friends and family plan. Hey Schwarber, would you rather have an additional 30 million on your contract or how about we hire your cousin at 75K a year? We will even throw in a golf cart for him to drive around the stadium on game day. 

[WestEddy]

24 minutes ago, Colome's Hat said:

I dunno, based on recent play, this teams seems very capable of going 26-27 the rest of the year.

That isn't great by any means but it is a marked improvement over last year.  

As far as playoffs, if you can nab a wild card spot or win the division with 85-86 wins, yes this team with the right investment and free agent signings/trades could absolutely do that.

This all gets back to the fact that the team last year was never as bad as their record indicated but were horribly mismanaged.

I think this team, as situated on August 1, is probably a 70 win team. Meaning, if this group of guys started a season today, they'd win 70. I agree with you that it's not crazy that they could add 10 wins through a couple of additions, some of the players on this team progressing in their development, or some of the dreadful years regressing to the mean. 

The way the playoffs are set up now, a .500 team is technically "competitive" for the post-season. 

Last year's team played behind their Pythagorean by about 8 games. (I'm agreeing with you again.)

[Look at Ray Ray Run]

9 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

Okay, so I'll take this as you admitting that 6 weeks of baseball doesn't actually equal 14 days. I really don't care what you have tolerance for. That's why I have you on ignore. I don't have tolerance for guys who will just misrepresent what I wrote, then call me names and scold me.

Obviously, you think you're waaaaaayyyyy smarter than me, and everybody else here. I mean, you have your own proprietary algorhythms, or something. LOL. So just ignore my posts. I skip over yours, and the unfortunate time I click into one, I realize I'm not missing any in depth analysis. 

Again, I understand that it sucks when people think things without asking you, first. You have the last word. Make it count. 

I certainly don't scold people, and I've never called you any names. Please don't lie.

You typically ignore the content of my posts and then attempt to take personal jabs at me left and right, but I ignore them and stick to the substance. 

I'll also respond to posts that I feel like, and don't believe I need anyone's permission. Lastly, my algo's don't typically have dance moves, but maybe one day they will.

This is actually the first baseball related discussion board I've ever been a part of where people get very offended by me presenting modeled data. Not only do I not believe that the data is always right, but I typically will caveat that it's just one layer of analysis as I believe there is more to success than just numbers. 

"I have you on ignore" is one thing that when I read, I do cringe a bit.

[DoUEvenShift]

11 minutes ago, Look at Ray Ray Run said:

"I have you on ignore" is one thing that when I read, I do cringe a bit.

if you have someone on ignore aren't you not able to see their posts? Or is this just a "i see your name and skip ahead" type of ignore.

[WestEddy]

28 minutes ago, T R U said:

Nothing I said was outside of reality, yet here you are to remind everyone that this bad team is not historically bad. They're still bad either way, so I guess take your victory lap?

Well, everyone sure took a victory lap on me last year when I said the bullpen was "lockdown", once, yourself included. So enjoy my victory lap. Maybe one day we'll meet and talk about our various victory laps taken here. 

[T R U]

6 minutes ago, WestEddy said:

Well, everyone sure took a victory lap on me last year when I said the bullpen was "lockdown", once, yourself included. So enjoy my victory lap. Maybe one day we'll meet and talk about our various victory laps taken here. 

To be fair, the bullpen was absolutely atrocious last year so that was pretty deserved. 

[Princess Dye]

20M would be spent on someone who wouldnt be that good... we'd have to overpay to get someone here in 2026.

And it takes care of CF, obviously a tough position. I can talk myself into this. 

We may spend a little next year. It is our go-to move to get a young team some additions , get people excited, and then lose all momentum due to a CBA disagreement

[WestEddy]

10 minutes ago, DoUEvenShift said:

if you have someone on ignore aren't you not able to see their posts? Or is this just a "i see your name and skip ahead" type of ignore.

You see they posted, but the post is hidden. When people reply to them, you see their text in the replies. When somebody ignored has a bunch of hidden posts on a page, I might click in to see if something's going on. 

[Tony]

37 minutes ago, Colome's Hat said:

This team isn't that bad though.  They had an awful start but if you remove that, they are basically close to or a little under .500.  Nobody is doing cartwheels but it is progress.  They are much better than they were last year.  To be honest, the team wasn't that bad last year but they were so poorly managed that it obviously looks much worse on paper.

Getting to 60-65 wins is a big deal.  Let's say that get to 66 wins, which I think, quite frankly is a very reasonable goal.  That's a 23 win improvement, and that comes just from dumping out the last excess of toxicity and getting better coaching.  You invest smartly in the team and they could become a playoff contender next year.  Especially in an American League that is just much weaker than the NL.  86 wins could probably get you a wild card spot.

So yes, this team is no World Series contender right now.  However there is merserable progress.  As someone who is a footy fan, they are essentially a mid to lower level premier league team that is tough to beat and fun to watch.  Eventually, some of those teams vie for the equivalent of our playoffs, which is Europe.   Some of those teams make it into the conference league.  Actually Crystal Palace, if people are attuned to what is happening over there is a good shout.  You had a team underachieving and hanging around relegation due to a bad fit at manager.  They replaced him with a new manager and the difference is night and day.  

This board admittedly just stays in a vicious "loop of disagreement" when it comes to the positive vs. negative takes on the overall health of the organization. 

As I've always said, I won't fault or get in the way of anyone trying to be positive. Where I chime in is when the "positive" group will take shots at those being "negative'

And here is why. Since 2013, the Sox have played 13 seasons. Out of those 13 seasons, the Sox have had a team above .500 twice. 2 times. 1 Division win, 0 playoff series victories. As everyone knows, it's been 20 years since the last playoff series win. 

I agree with a lot of what you wrote. The team does look improve and there are players in the organization that look like they could be quality major league players for the foreseeable future. The organization has a LONG way to go, we know all too well about the issues with ownership.  So if you want to be bullish about the future of the organization, you absolutely can. But that positivity, objectively, is built off hope & faith. That's cool, but you can't blame people for taking a more negative approach to things after the last decade+ of futility for this organization. It's been an absolutely dreadful 15+ years on the South Side, and no one should begrudge a fan for taking a "I'll believe it when I see it" attitude around the White Sox.