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9/24 at Tigers

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QUOTE (NorthSideSox72 @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 04:35 PM)
So, I like Chris Sale, and I'm obviously a White Sox fan.

 

That said, I have to agree with Ausmus that Sale's actions were pretty weak. Whether it was stealing signs or something else, Sale's reaction was bratty and he should be more mature than that.

 

Sending a message about cheating on the field instead of crying about it off of the field?

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QUOTE (RockRaines @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 07:58 PM)
There is a guy with binoculars signaling towards home plate, pretty obvious what seems to be happening.

 

 

Can and will the Sox file a complaint?

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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 04:38 PM)
Sending a message about cheating on the field instead of crying about it off of the field?

I don't understand this post. Who said anything about crying off the field? He cried ON it, which is what I thought was part of the lameness.

 

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I like Sale a lot but if he is so sure they are stealing signs, he and Flowers can always mix them up. A plunking may be in order as long as it wasn't up too high.

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QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 05:06 PM)
I like Sale a lot but if he is so sure they are stealing signs, he and Flowers can always mix them up. A plunking may be in order as long as it wasn't up too high.

It's usually not so much which pitch as it is location. That is difficult to switch up.

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QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 05:12 PM)
Supposedly Sale is now denying that he thought Detroit was stealing signs.

 

http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/eye-on-baseba...inez-with-pitch

 

Sorry but I don't buy the explanation from Sale, I gotta call bulls***.

 

Sale isn't stupid enough to say that he was throwing at Martinez, even though the whole world knows he was. Why get yourself suspended?

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QUOTE (flavum @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 09:12 PM)
33-48 on the road this year.

 

9-10 vs the Indians, Twins, and Tigers

Awful record on the road. Played better at home this year

 

QUOTE (TitoMB @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 09:28 PM)
thank god this season is almost over.

The bullpen is an embarrassment to baseball.

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QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 05:06 PM)
I like Sale a lot but if he is so sure they are stealing signs, he and Flowers can always mix them up. A plunking may be in order as long as it wasn't up too high.

 

Flowers did come out during that Martinez AB after Sale kept looking back.

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QUOTE (ptatc @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 05:21 PM)
It's usually not so much which pitch as it is location. That is difficult to switch up.

Yes but you don't need a guy in CF with binoculars to give you location. When I played guys6 who could get signs and location would call you different names. First name would be a fastball last name breaking ball and a swipe here or there for location. Some guys didn't want to know. I always wanted the most help I could get.

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QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 05:29 PM)
Yes but you don't need a guy in CF with binoculars to give you location. When I played guys6 who could get signs and location would call you different names. First name would be a fastball last name breaking ball and a swipe here or there for location. Some guys didn't want to know. I always wanted the most help I could get.

Right. But if no one is on base, it's easy to get the location of the pitch and relay it to the hitter. Like you said it's easy to change signs for the type of pitch but not so much for location.

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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 05:25 PM)
Sale isn't stupid enough to say that he was throwing at Martinez, even though the whole world knows he was. Why get yourself suspended?

Here's my problem with all this.

 

Sale becomes paranoid over a fan watching a baseball game from 400+ feet away in CF with binoculars. Really?

 

Sale motions towards the fan in CF as the 3rd inning ends.

 

In the 6th, Sale hits Martinez.

 

After hitting Martinez, Sale accuses Martinez of getting signs from the person in CF while motioning that direction again.

 

After the game Sale denies that he thought Detroit was stealing signs.

 

Then Sale says he was motioning to a fan that was wearing him out during pre game warm up.

 

All of this is what I call bulls*** about and why I think it was chicken s*** on Sale's part. I could respect Sale much more in all this if he just came out and said he f***ed up by thinking Detroit was stealing/receiving signs but no, he comes back with denial and a lame ass excuse.

 

Don't get me wrong, its not like I dislike Sale at all but he does need to grow up and I hope he learns this experience.

Edited by StRoostifer

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Just to back up my previous post...

 

http://m.whitesox.mlb.com/news/2014/09/24/...s-following-hbp

 

"Martinez said he received word of the sign-stealing accusation through White Sox right fielder Avisail Garcia, who came up with the Tigers in 2012 before being traded to Chicago at the July Trade Deadline last season.

 

"He told me, 'They say you've got somebody behind there and he's giving you the signs.' And I'm like, 'Give me a break.'" "

 

Just man up Sale and admit you made a mistake.

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QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 05:58 PM)
Here's my problem with all this.

 

Sale becomes paranoid over a fan watching a baseball game from 400+ feet away in CF with binoculars. Really?

 

Sale motions towards the fan in CF as the 3rd inning ends.

 

In the 6th, Sale hits Martinez.

 

After hitting Martinez, Sale accuses Martinez of getting signs from the person in CF while motioning that direction again.

 

After the game Sale denies that he thought Detroit was stealing signs.

 

Then Sale says he was motioning to a fan that was wearing him out during pre game warm up.

 

All of this is what I call bulls*** about and why I think it was chicken s*** on Sale's part. I could respect Sale much more in all this if he just came out and said he f***ed up by thinking Detroit was stealing/receiving signs but no, he comes back with denial and a lame ass excuse.

 

Don't get me wrong, its not like I dislike Sale at all but he does need to grow up and I hope he learns this experience.

 

If Sale states he is throwing at Martinez for any reason, he gets a long suspension, and loses probably a weeks worth of paychecks. I call bulls*** on the fact that you wouldn't have done the same thing.

 

It is like your wife asking if this makes her look fat. No matter what the answer really is, you know what the correct answer is.

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The last part to Sale's greatness might not be improving his pitching but just his mental POV. He gets a little too amped up out there sometimes. Maybe he should take the caffeine routine down a notch on game day.

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QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 06:12 PM)
If Sale states he is throwing at Martinez for any reason, he gets a long suspension, and loses probably a weeks worth of paychecks. I call bulls*** on the fact that you wouldn't have done the same thing.

 

It is like your wife asking if this makes her look fat. No matter what the answer really is, you know what the correct answer is.

Reread my posts again. I'm calling bulls*** on Sale for denying he thought Detroit was stealing signs. Not once have I said Sale should admit to hitting Martinez on purpose and infact i agree he should not, so why are you so focused on that?

 

Sorry but Sale is full of s*** on this one and I'm willing to bet if the roles were reversed this board would be lit up with pissed off Sox fans!

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QUOTE (ptatc @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 05:33 PM)
Right. But if no one is on base, it's easy to get the location of the pitch and relay it to the hitter. Like you said it's easy to change signs for the type of pitch but not so much for location.

If no one is on, the base coaches can make themselves useful and give you location, and if they think location is being given, the catcher needs to delay his set up.

 

Boys will be boys. Every team tries stealing signs, except when you are the victim you get pissed off.

Edited by Dick Allen

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QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 06:18 PM)
Reread my posts again. I'm calling bulls*** on Sale for denying he thought Detroit was stealing signs. Not once have I said Sale should admit to hitting Martinez on purpose and infact i agree he should not, so why are you so focused on that?

 

Sorry but Sale is full of s*** on this one and I'm willing to bet if the roles were reversed this board would be lit up with pissed off Sox fans!

 

It is all a part of the same story. No sign stealing, no reason to hit Martinez.

 

Sale is lying his ass of, we all know it. In a situation like there, there is literally no good reason to tell the truth.

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QUOTE (raBBit @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 06:33 PM)
I can't believe people calling Sale immature. I love Sale's fire. You have to have moxy to be an ace and no matter how high your moral high ground is, throwing at the opponent is a part of the pitching and the best pitchers have always done it. You have to throw inside and you have to own the plate.

Even if it is a little immature, so what? The don't f*** with me attitude is tremendous even if the guy in the bleachers with binoculars was just some guy with little money and poor eyesight and was just catching a game. And the way guys dive when hitting now really has made the brushback a hard thing to execute .

 

Sale obviously has stuff that will intimidate. If he gets an attitude that does the same, it only makes him better.

Edited by Dick Allen

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Why did you all discount number 2 so quickly?

The two most popular theories of what happened today:

 

1. Sale thought somebody in the stands was relaying signals to the Tiger hitters, then hit Martinez on purpose. Sale later denied this and said he was upset at a fan who was mocking him.

 

2. Sale, Konerko, and Ventura met privately after the game (this has been confirmed). It's possible that the Sox were upset that the Tigers' gift to Konerko was a base and some dirt, so Ventura asked Sale to hit Martinez. (Link:http://www.southsidesox.com/2014/9/24/6840663/why-did-sale-throw-at-victor-martinez)

Neither have been confirmed.

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QUOTE (raBBit @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 06:29 PM)
You're missing something here.

 

Sale said he was gesturing a fan so it seemed as if tip of the hat was between himself and the heckler, not between him and Victor. If he starts talking about how there was a guy with binoculars, then it implies guilt, he probably gets suspended and loses money. Everyone on the field knows there was either a guy with binoculars or Sale just believed there was a guy with binoculars. Sale and Kinsler both did the hand binoculars and Martinez addressed it after Avi said something to him.

 

On another note, I don't know why Garcia is talking to Martinez about what Sale said after the fact. That type of stuff shouldn't be out in the media within an hour of the game.

 

Explain to me why Sale referred to the person with binoculars in CF as Martinez "boy" while motioning that direction? I haven't missed a thing. Watch the video, Sale was wrong and Avi's comment to Martinez just backs that up even more.

 

I respect that you want to stick up for a player on the Sox but I'm sorry to say that Sale was wrong.

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QUOTE (raBBit @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 06:33 PM)
I can't believe people calling Sale immature. I love Sale's fire. You have to have moxy to be an ace and no matter how high your moral high ground is, throwing at the opponent is a part of the pitching and the best pitchers have always done it. You have to throw inside and you have to own the plate.

Fire is good and I like it about Sale as well.

 

But causing a commotion and making/gesturing false accusations during a game, only to deny it after the game with some bulls*** excuse is immature as well as paranoid.

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QUOTE (StRoostifer @ Sep 24, 2014 -> 06:51 PM)
Fire is good and I like it about Sale as well.

 

But causing a commotion and making/gesturing false accusations during a game, only to deny it after the game with some bulls*** excuse is immature as well as paranoid.

 

No. Immature is getting yourself suspended for no good reason.

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