Chisoxfn

QUOTE(whitesoxmurph @ May 28, 2005 -> 06:06 PM) Polls are becoming less and less accurate. Two recent example were the exit polls in Wisconsin, Ohio and Penn. in the last Presidential election (all having Kerry a big double digit winner in each State) and the polls of the California recall election. The recall election for those of you who don't know or remember was in 2 parts... 1- should Governor Davis be recalled and... 2- If he is recalled who should take his place Arnold , Lt. Gov. Cruz Bustamante, Gary Coleman, etc... The LA Times poll 3 days before the recall, had the recall going down to defeat by over 20 points and in the case Davis was recalled, it had Bustamante ahead of Arnold by over 15 points. The results were just the opposite, the recall and Arnold both won convincingly. This Hillary poll has a couple of numbers that seem to jump out as being wrong... #1 9% of the people surveyed think she is a Conservative? Did they just call trailer parks or only people with a low IQ? She has been trying to move closer to the center for her run in 2008 but she is about as Conservative Ted Kennedy. #2 33% of Conservatives are likely to support her? Maybe 10% of the right are so unhappy w/Bush that they would support her, but I find it highly unlikely that any real conservatives. It was later told that the LA Times had some fraudelent polls and they corrected them just before the recall. Now they acted as if it were a mistake, but as a republican I can tell you its bulls*** (imo). They did there very best to hold out and try and rally an anti recall so the worse freaking governor in the history of this state (Gray Davis) could somehow stick around. Lucky for him Arnold has a very strong backing. Hell, Arnold isn't great but he's a hell of a lot better than Gray Davis.

Phil Rogers said he had easy 95 MPH heat. Boy was he wrong. Nothing against Miller but he was never as good as BA hyped him up to be. Wish him the best though, he was a hard worker.

QUOTE(dasox24 @ May 28, 2005 -> 02:25 PM) So, who's gonna get the White Sox? Dan, I'm guessing you or Jas will get 1st dibs on that choice. Or, for the Sox can we start a seperate "poll" thread when it's time for the #15 pick, and have people vote, and the player w/ the most votes is that pick and then continue on with the draft. Btw, can I have the Cardinals? I'll be out of town until the day before the draft so I won't be able to participate at all. I'll be around till Thursday than I get back that Monday.

QUOTE(AddisonStSox @ May 28, 2005 -> 08:46 AM) Aardsma has an even brighter future than Williams. Truly, the Giants got fleeced. The Cub fans ought to gloat over this trade for awhile...lord knows they have nothing else to be happy about. Aardsma is definately the gem, but the Cubs need help now and I highly doubt they'll be keeping these guys.

QUOTE(Soxbadger @ May 28, 2005 -> 08:42 AM) SF must be really down on Williams after his start this season. He could be a nice starter for the Cubs. SB This is a great move by the Giants. They needed a quality reliever and they got one. Williams was once a top prospect and I am assuming neither of these guys will spend much time in the Cubs organization. If I were to garner a hunch, I'd think they would be moved on (although I'm not sure of the rules in trading guys you've just acquired). Williams has been brutal down in AAA this year (ERA's like 8.5 or so).

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ May 28, 2005 -> 12:29 AM) Time for Tracey to go to Charlotte perhaps? No reason to rush. Let him get at least half a season in AA, if not a full season. See what he can do. He was in A ball last year and there is no harm in letting him go a system a year. Keeps him comfortable and he is still very raw as a pitcher. Boy do I love his stuff and attidue. I disagree with some of you because I think he can be a quality starter, if not a very good one. He has some really good stuff and movement and I can only see him getting better and better. How good will he get, I don't know if he'd ever be a #1, maybe he coudl be a #2 but not with his current control. As of now I'd say a good #3 is where his upside could take him (with better control that would rise).

QUOTE(danman31 @ May 28, 2005 -> 12:34 AM) I think you are making this comparison because of the fact that Carillo is a local kid like Honel and both are pretty thin guys. Some think the Sox drafted Honel a bit higher because he was a local product, which could again be a factor with Carillo. Honel has had injuries for whatever reason and that is where the thin part plays a factor. I'm not sure I completely agree with that, but I think that's what DBAH0 is getting at. I haven't read all the scouting reports and info on the draft prospects yet, but from what I have seen I seem to like Bogusevic and Tulowitzki the most and I'm not sure either will be there for us. I'd love to take a chance of Townsend. He's become more risky with a year off, but I think it would be worth it. Carrillo looks like a safety pick that I wouldn't mind, but I like the others better. We should try something like this here. Have our draft experts pick a team or probably multiple teams because I don't think we have 30 people that would be interested and knowledgable enough for this. Then they just pick the best player on the board with a little to do with how teams spend money and other factors that teams may go after. I agree with that assessment on the most part Dan. Just one thing, Honel isn't a small guy. He may of been when the Sox drafted him but I definately wouldn't call him thin.

Don't know if this was mentioned, but the Sox drafted Williamson one round higher in 2003. Williamson pitched in the 2004 JUCO world series.

QUOTE(KipWellsFan @ May 27, 2005 -> 10:12 PM) I saw that one recently too. The action is good but nothing too spectacular. What I enjoyed was Jet Li playing a Rain Man like character. Interesting decision for him to take that part. 7/10 6/10 for Interpreter He was one of the directors I think. The movie was nothing like I expected, but that action scene against the guy in the white suit was totally badass and the story while different was good. I agree, Jet Li did a good job with that role (a much different role than he's used to).

QUOTE(mrkupe @ May 27, 2005 -> 10:08 PM) Various comments: For what it's worth, Clement has done a nice job of improving his defense this year. While it's a different story over the course of a pro season, it does give some hope for him. Thing that concerns me with him is that his value as a hitter is largely derived from his power. If he remains a catcher, I think his offensive capabilities will greatly diminish pretty rapidly, although I wouldn't mind being wrong there. Tyler Greene is a solid prospect, but the rumor has it that he's going to ask for a ton of money no matter where he's drafted, and nobody really likes him THAT much. Certainly not the White Sox for their 3rd round pick (remember, this draft is going 5 rounds, so the potential to draft Greene could very well be there). Bogie's an interesting name to bring up, given that he's still a bit raw as a pitcher due to his two-way play. Reminds me of Josh Fields last year, another guy who (despite a different situation) had the combination of college experience and significantly untapped upside. When it comes to USC, the only guy I want is Ian Kennedy. That kid is a total stud and next year, if he goes pro (I'm pretty sure he'll be eligible next year) he'll go very very high. He's filthy, flat filthy. I just don't like Clement. I think he's the most overrated player in the draft. He's had some good years offensively, but the only reason he gets talked about the way he does is because he plays catcher. Anywhere else and he's just average in comparison. Larish is just as capable and has tons more power. It just happens Clement plays catcher and while he has improved, he'd be Mike Piazza behind the plate (and I highly doubt he'll ever hit to Piazza's extent). Bogie is probably the guy I'd go with. Him or Cesar (if were talking pitcher, but I'd still at least look at the kid from A&M at SS...I like him a lot). I agree with your assesment on Greene as well, but if the Sox felt they had a shot, than I'd consider it. However I get the sneaking feeling you'll see the Sox draft a guy who slid and will offer him a little more than 3rd round money to get him in. Sox have never been cheap in the draft, but they also make damn sure that they sign there 1st 20 guys (and they typically do a very good job of getting their early picks signed). All that being said, if Townsend is on the board...thats my guy.

I saw unleashed tonight. Pretty solid had a few badass action scenes and Morgan Freeman is good in it as is Jet Li.

QUOTE(danman31 @ May 27, 2005 -> 04:58 PM) It was pretty obvious, but I don't remember him being referred to as Emperor Palpatine in the originals so I had to figure it out the harder way lol. I just noticed the two looked identical. That was the give away to me

QUOTE(Jabroni @ May 27, 2005 -> 09:53 PM) Well, I figure Kevin Walker will be dumped for El Duque, although it will suck to lose Walker's awesome 0.00 ERA. I just hope Timo will be the one dumped for Frank. It would make me feel great to see the worst hitter on our team being jettisoned and replaced with the best hitter in Sox history. That would definately be addition by subtraction AND addition. It better not be Willie. He made a few gems defensively tonight and has held his own with the bat. Of course the Sox seem to love Timo for whatever reason. He did hit more homers than anyone else in BP when I was there on Thursday (maybe thats why, LOL).

QUOTE(Jabroni @ May 27, 2005 -> 09:44 PM) Someone needs to use fathom's phrase and bring "OMIT TIMO!" signs to the next homestand. Maybe Kenny will get the point and cut his worthless hide once Frank is healthy. Its the ultimate unifer of Soxtalk. Just think of how pleasant this place will be the day Timo gets cut

QUOTE(Jabroni @ May 27, 2005 -> 09:33 PM) Timo was getting WAAAY too much playing time as it is. No bat, crappy base-running, and shoddy defense -- he has more than earned his release. This is a rare time in which I agree with you

This reminds me of the time machine in Napoleon Dynomite.

QUOTE(Middle Buffalo @ May 27, 2005 -> 08:43 PM) I have a TON of respect for McCain, but I can't stand that he went around stumping for GW before the last election. GW showed McCain no respect in 2000, but because McCain wants to run in '08 he swallowed his pride and went with the party. I'm tired of the politics in politics. And Hillary essentially hand picking her seat in New York isn't politics??

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ May 27, 2005 -> 09:23 PM) Here's a question. Jordan Danks falls to the 3rd round spot where the Sox are picking. He has said that he'll be going to Texas. If there was any chance at all that he would sign a deal however (e.g Gio Gonzalez and Ryan Sweeney), would you still pick him? If the Sox were willing to offer him 750K or so yes, if they weren't than no.

QUOTE(mrkupe @ May 27, 2005 -> 09:29 PM) McCormick is a Boras guy I believe. Mayberry kinda scares me. I'm intrigued by the rest of the guys. Ya, McCormick has some talent but being a Boras guy he's not going to the Sox. I wish I had my notes near me cause I may be confusing McCormick for someone else, but if he's who I think he is he's not gonna be on the board anyway (well unless Boras demands cause him to slide past the Sox). He's supposed to be a top 10 pitcher IIRC (but I may be mixing him up with one of Boras other clients cause this year he has a very very strong client base in regards to the draft). If the Sox were to take a shot at a Boras client, I'd want it to be Tyler Greene in the 3rd. Greene is a darn good prospect, who will likely go in the supplemental to 2nd round, but I've seen a few places slide him into the 3rd.

QUOTE(DBAH0 @ May 27, 2005 -> 09:21 PM) Other guys worth considering; Chris Volstad - RHP Mark Pawelek - LHP C.J Henry - SS John Mayberry - 1B Matt Torra - RHP Mark McCormick - RHP To me I'd prefer the Sox take a chance on a high school guy with a bigger upside than a college guy with more polish at this stage. The Sox have got enough good arms in their systems, that they can probably afford to take more of a chance, if you get what I mean. Not I, this crop is very thin when it comes to high school pitchers, at least in the early stages. Heck this draft isn't even that strong in the early rounds when it comes to pitching. As far as I'm concerned Carillo is as safe a pick as any and upside is an overrated word. It seems to be used for guys that don't know how to play the game and often times its more of an excuse for drafting a guy who hasn't yet succeeded. I understand sometimes you just look at a guys arm and projectability and drool, but in the 1st round I don't think thats whats best. Your going to be investing a good amount of money and your going to want to find a guy with good stuff, but he better have a good head on his shoulders (if he doesn't the money could get to his head and a lot of other things could happen) and personally I like guys with command. If the best guy on the board is a high school pitcher you take him and that could very well happen with the recent trend of college pitchers being favored by GM's. In that case do what DePodesta did last year, he noticed that trend and realized the better values were the guys out of high school. But as far as I'm concerned, there is zero resemblance to Honel/Carillo. Carillo has a good fastball (in the low 90's and can get it up a little higher every once in a while...don't see him adding anything to the heater) plus he has a nice curve and changeup and very good command. He's played against some of the best in college baseball and lost just a game. Honel on the other hand had an upper 80's fastball and one of the sickest knuckle curves I ever saw. He also had good command and had a decent changeup. I guess (and this is cause I don't nkow the guy or his workout routines, only know what I've heard) is that he got extremely cocky and maybe lazy (no idea whether true or not).

QUOTE(mrkupe @ May 27, 2005 -> 08:43 PM) Cesar's an interesting one, although I'm concerned that scouts' views of him have been a bit overly favorable due to his remarkable unbeaten streak. At the same time, I do like what he offers, and he fits all the criteria of the White Sox that we've seen in recent first rounders (college player, expected to be a relatively fast mover, not represented by Boras, etc.). I also agree on the pitching remark, although I could see the 'Boras factor' in the draft taking Cesar out of play pretty fast. The other guy you speak of is Troy Tulowski (sp.) of Long Beach State University. Lots of mixed opinions on this guy. He could go as high as 3rd to Seattle, although I think a drop is possible (but to 15, I'd be very skeptical). I'm not totally certain that he would even be regarded as the optimal choice at shortstop for the White Sox, as Pennington out of Texas A&M would probably come cheaper if he's available and has the sort of scrappy attitude that the Sox seem to covet these days. Pennington is the guy I like but as of now it seems he'd be a bit of a reach. However, the Sox haven't been shy to grab there guy, regardless of him potentially being projected a few pegs down. One things for certain they have a few options and they center around a starting pitcher, shortstop, or catcher. This years catcher crop is entirely ugly in my book, at least in the early rounds. No way is Jeff Clement worth a 1st round pick. If you want power, wait till the 3th-6th round and draft Jeff Larish. He's got more power than Clement and Clement isn't what I'd call a good defensive catcher, hell he's not even mediocre. My two cents are that eventually he'll be moved to another position. Pitching wise...no doubt in my mind it comes down to three guys: Cesar, Townsend, and Bogsuvic. All three are talented guys. Bog is a really talented lefty who I think is better than Ricky Romero who should go a bit better (Romero did outduel him in a game this year @ Tulane) and I love Townsends arm, but he won't be as fast of a mover considering he'll need to get back in pitching shape. Cesar doesn't do one thing amazing, but he does a lot of things well and sometimes I think thats better than doing one thing amazing. He has good command, 3 quality pitches, and a good head on his shoulders. If the Sox really wanted to reach, they could get a guy I love in Ramos (LBSU) but its not going to happen. By the way, welcome aboard...this is a fun idea and I'm gonna have to check out Sickels site and see how this thing goes.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ May 27, 2005 -> 05:55 PM) Jason, what about Townsend? How's his fastball (I didn't see much on it, other than he had a good breaking ball)? I'm watching his scouting video from last year, that's a filthy curveball he's got. Looks like a big bender with a sharp drop. I couldn't really tell about his fastball, on the video, he only threw it a couple of times. I hope they look at Townsend, though, if he projects to be as a reliever, that kind of sucks... Townsend has a dynomite arm. He's supposed to hit the mid 90's. That entire Rice trio was just filthy. One of the best collegiate staffs in a long time, imo. There are some obvious concerns considering he's been out of competitive baseball for a year now and If I drafted him I'd want to be darn positive that he'd sign. I'm assuming people will have some recolection of what he was asking in his negotiations with the O's (I still don't get what had happened, but somehow those negotiations ended a while ago and i forget exactly why but I think it dealt with him and school and he went back for a class or something). Back when he was pitching for Rice he was low to mid 90's. He had some workouts in the 90 MPH range, however recently he had a few where he was at 85-88 but I think that deals more with not being in baseball shape. I did read somewhere that Baltimore totally botched negotiations and that Towsend is expected to be a relatively easy sign who will go for slot money. Along with that hammer (Which is freaking awesome) he has a good changeup.

As far as that kid from Umass. I think he's another guy thats definately worth looking at. Considering he pitches in a smaller conference and for a not as well known baseball school, it will be a definate knock on him. However, if he has the stuff that knock could be a reason why he's available later on in the 1st when he could of went sooner. I'm solely basing this on BA's scouting reports cause I've never seen Umass play any baseball, hell I didn't know they had a team, LOL (sorry Spiff). One thing I stay away from is guys that had there arms destroyed in college. Some schools work there pitchers too hard and for whatever reason I've seen at least some of those guys come to the minors and there velocity tends to dissapear. At the same time you have high schoolers that throw 97-98 but than get drafted and throw 93-94 cause they never worked hard enough and build up the stamina and endurance to be able to do those things over the long haul of a minor/major league season. There are definately a lot of reasons why the MLB draft is such a crap shoot and why it pays to take care of your player development people and spend the money on the draft.

QUOTE(CWSGuy406 @ May 27, 2005 -> 03:45 PM) BHam (Tom), when you see this thread -- have you talked to Jenks yourself? If so (or if you've talked to someone like the manager), how's Jenks' attitude/mentality? I'm not sure if you'd know this, but are they keeping (somewhat) tabs on him to make sure he keeps himself out of trouble? I commend Williams on a job well done this offseason as far as some minor league pickups. Jenks and Owens have been awesome. I'm not Tom, but from what I hear and I know Tom and some others have mentioned it as well....Razor Shines and the rest of the staff has really done an outstanding job getting Jenks under control and working with him. At the same time Jenks is doing a good job in trying to be a changed man. The Sox took a gamble on Jenks and if it pays off, it could pay off really well. I'm talking about a guy who has the ability to be one of the best closers ever. Think a Gagne like effect. He isn't quite as electric as Hernandez, but pre-injury he was as close (stuff wise, but has always lacked polish). Jenks has a shot at fitting in with the club later this year as a callup at the very least and I have no doubt (barring injury or mental blowup) that he'll get some action next year as well.

Carillo doesn't throw 97, despite what BA would like you to believe. He can hit 94. He's more in the 92-94 range, 95 every once a while. Not a knock, but you see 97 and maybe guys throw a pitch or two a game like that, what I want to know is what he generally pitches at and he isn't generally in the upper 90's. Still good stuff. I like him quite a bit. Of course I like Texas A&M's shortstop and I like Tyler Greene a lot. If he slides due to having Boras as his rep, I'd snag him in the 3rd.