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Mark Buehrle or Mark Mulder?

Is Mark Mulder better than Mark Buehrle? Please answer this question.

QUOTE(Steve Bartman's my idol @ Jan 26, 2006 -> 10:32 AM) Based on what? Santana's vast World Series experience? WTF does World Series experience have to do with being a good pitcher? What the other 24 guys on your team do should not affect your image like that.

QUOTE(Steve Bartman's my idol @ Jan 26, 2006 -> 10:30 AM) True...but WINS are THE most important stat. I'd rather have a 20 game winner with a 4.00 era than a 13 game winner with a 3.00 era. Mulder >>> Buehrle Mulder = 88 wins over the past 5 years Buehrle = 81

QUOTE(Steve Bartman's my idol @ Jan 26, 2006 -> 10:26 AM) Over the last 5 yeras, who has the most wins out of all the pitchers mentioned? You guys have access to all the stats...educate me. Wins are the most overrated stat of which to rate a pitcher, give me ERA, WHIP, OPS against, BAA any of those over wins which can sway all to easy. This argument also means that Russ Ortiz is an elite pitcher because he gets a lot of wins.

QUOTE(Steve Bartman's my idol @ Jan 26, 2006 -> 10:23 AM) I agree. Over the course of their respective careers, Clemens is much better than Buehrle. However, in 2006 AND beyond, I'd rather have Buehrle than Clemens. (Rocket is 43!!!) Do you have a single stat to back up your arguement that Buehrle has outproduced Santana over the course of their careers?

QUOTE(Steve Bartman's my idol @ Jan 26, 2006 -> 10:19 AM) Based on the last 5 seasons! BTW, if that's the case, how could you say Peavy, Halliday, Santana, Prior, Zambrano are even as good as Buehrle? They have had 1, maybe 2 good years each. Santana's past 4 years >>>> Buehrle's past 5. Johan's highest ERA over that time was 3.07 and his highest whip was 1.23. Johan has put up a sub 1 whip over the past 2 years to go along with a 2.61 and 2.87 ERAs. How has Buehrle out produced him?

QUOTE(Steve Bartman's my idol @ Jan 26, 2006 -> 10:12 AM) The point is, Buehrle's credential are every bit as good, if not better, than any of the pitchers previously mentioned. Except for the fact that they are not.

QUOTE(Steve Bartman's my idol @ Jan 26, 2006 -> 10:10 AM) That's what I thought...seems like I get POUNDED every time I make an opinion. Well, at times your opinions on matters seem to be unpopular and nonsensical to the rest of us.

QUOTE(Steve Bartman's my idol @ Jan 26, 2006 -> 08:59 AM) See if you people can comprehend what I am sayin...IN MY OPINION Buehrle is better than the above mentioned pitchers, and IN MY OPINION if a WS was on the line, and I could have any of those guys to pitch for me in Game 7, I would choose Buehrle. Isn't the entire point of a message board to exchange and discuss topics based on personal opinion?

vette

QUOTE(maggsmaggs @ Jan 25, 2006 -> 07:48 PM) Yeah, it was from Phil's chat today and here is Phil's comment about Sanchez during last year's prospect chat. Labeling him Juan Gonzalez like is a little lofty. He said he's built like Juan Gon not that he plays like him.

Jewel has now installed the Pay-By-Touch system in many of their stores including one in Schaumburg. This system requires that the person who is paying has a pulse so it is not going to be fooled by a play-doh mold.

QUOTE(Balta1701 @ Jan 25, 2006 -> 06:31 PM) He's better than MB thus far...but I wouldn't put it out of the question for MB to take that last step. He had a great year last year despite having a couple of really bad months...including 1 part where I'm still convinced he was slowing up his delivery and tipping his changeup. He gave up something like 4 runs in the entire month of June last year. It'll take a decent step upwards by Buehrle to pass Santana, but having watched Mark since he came up I wouldn't put it past him. I won't say it's likely, but it's certainly not impossible. I see Mark outlasting Santana over the course of their careers, Mark and Johan were born 10 days apart in 1979, yet Mark already has 172 career GS compared to Johan's 108. Mark just strikes me as the type of pitcher who will have an extremely long career and compile some great stats through his eventual dominance and through longevity. Santana has better stuff than Mark and has been more dominant over the period of time that both have been in the league, yet the way I've seen Mark pitch over his career in games such as the D-Rays one at home a few years ago, the amazing Indians game at Jacobs field two years ago, the Seattle game at home last year and the playoffs show me that he has the ability in him to become a pitcher close to Santana's stature. Mark IMO will be on more winning teams and see the playoffs more often than Santana but as long as both are in the league and healthy, I just don't see him passing Johan up.

QUOTE(Chisoxfn @ Jan 25, 2006 -> 11:51 AM) Orton should party it up with Slerms McKenzie Wow, a Futurama reference that's certainly . . . um, interesting.

QUOTE(Steve Bartman's my idol @ Jan 25, 2006 -> 03:01 PM) What have they done? Won? MB was (is) the best starter on the best starting staff in MLB. Being the best starter on arguably the best staff in baseball does not make you the best starter in baseball, it makes you the best of a collection of very good starting pitchers. The fact that the team that Mark Buehrle was on won the world series does not in any way, shape or form mean that he is better than any top tier pitcher who's team has not won anything. Johan Santana may not have won a world series yet but he's better right than Mark Buehrle ever will be.

QUOTE(Steve Bartman's my idol @ Jan 25, 2006 -> 01:29 PM) Buehrle is better than ANY one of the above mentioned pitchers. You are high. Johan Santana is easily the best pitcher in baseball right now. Rich Harden? Jake Peavy? Buehrle is damn good but come on.

QUOTE(q\/\/3r+y @ Jan 24, 2006 -> 10:40 PM) It's funny as hell. Look at him feeling sorry for himself. You're so cruel. What if I posted a picture of your pasty white ass on the board and had everyone laugh at you? Then how would you feel?

Negative. The laptop is back to the level of "f***ed." I'm beginning to hate this thing.

I'd just like to thank the few of you that knew what I was doing when I posted that. I'd also like to thank the rest of you for proving my hypothesis correct. All I had to do was type one sentence and suddenly it turns into a heated argument of which we already had months ago. You are all dumb. Thank you. EDIT: I'm thinking about deleting this post about ten minutes from now, getting off Soxtalk and comming back on tommorrow morning to read the 32 page thread that will have grown from my comment.

Mark Buehrle is not an ace.

QUOTE(Texsox @ Jan 24, 2006 -> 02:33 PM) The only thing I would change about my HP is the power connection is always coming loose. Have you checked the HP web site for error codes? I searched up and down the HP website, they had no answers for malfunctioning memory modules. I opened up the bottom of my notebook, removed the memory module carefully, fired some compressed air into the memory slot and replaced the card. The problem is now fixed. My notebook is now back up and running.

QUOTE(3E8 @ Jan 23, 2006 -> 09:43 PM) So wrong, yet so right.

QUOTE(sox4lifeinPA @ Jan 24, 2006 -> 11:25 AM) I would first find the nearest building, I'd say at least 10 stories. Next find a window which you will be required to open. Extend your arms out of the window with you HP in hands. Let go. buy a dell My notebook has been super awesome for me for the year that I've had it, this is the first trouble I've had. I'm pretty happy with the performance of my HP.