CaliSoxFanViaSWside

So you completely ignore the idea of Moose and Grandal being the other LH options while thinking a 1 year stop gap in RF has to be LH ? Avi might be no worse defender in RF than Ozuna or Dickerson or even Gardner if you take his arm into consideration and familiarity with our park. Hell TB even played him in CF for 11 games . You need to get over the non tendering because he wasn't very good thing. 2 of the last 3 years he's been good. That means a lot more than anything earlier in his career. He is hitting more fly balls than ever and is also a better fielding now than before.

You think he won't get a pittance in 2020 ? No one is arguing that letting him go wasn't the right thing to do. Didn't over expose him to RHP ? Have you seen his splits against RHP for 2019 ? They were pretty good. How can you argue that he isn't remotely close to a fit when you readily accept other cheap stop gaps.

I really think that's what most of us bringing him up are hoping for. Sox are going to cut corners we know this. RF i can handle cutting a corner on , DH i can handle not going after JD Martinez . Even the injury concerns over Avi shouldn't matter that much. Eloy and Moncada get injured, anyone can get injured. Our pitching is a mess because of injuries. Nimmo was injured last year You can still upgrade pitching , power , Lefthandedness, and OBP by getting Grandal and Moose. We aren't getting everyone we want at all positions. We are going to have to settle for just being better or average in RF until a later date. If that's Avi or someone else cheap but an improvement I'm all for it.

It's more like it wouldn't be a problem as opposed to a solution when you consider cost effectiveness . How is it the amazing Rays Front Office could see his value yet even smart ( and I mean that it's not sarcastic) Sox fans like you can't ?

1st of all lets not pretend you aren't snarky or condescending (see the 1st comment I quoted) so sometimes you get it back. Turnin' Two contradicted your statement about "playing him strictly when he was most likely to succeed " rather well citing his amount of plate appearances and your 6.2 career WAR also very well by citing his last few seasons which means a lot more than career numbers. He also could've told you he played 125 games and only because of injury didn't play more. 90 of the 125 were in Rf. 24 at DH and even 11 in CF. Basically you are laughing at how one of the smartest organization in baseball found value in Avi yet somehow the Sox won't be able to . And again it's not like anyone is championing his return. Turnin Two made it clear he's not the best option but he is also not a laughable or out of our minds option.

I understand why you like McCann. Pitchers like him. He's a leader . He does his homework. He made adjustments. During the 2nd half slump I stuck up for him against the guys who were all jumping on the "he is who we thought he was" train. All that being said I don't believe Grandal is a luxury. He is simply the best free agent out there to help the Sox in 2 areas that they sorely lack which is power (specifically LH ) and OBP who would be affordable if we can all agree that starting pitching is going to command the most money spent this off season. McCann just might not be around after next year. Grandal should get a 3 year at minimum contract, No matter what anyone thinks of McCann he out bWar'd Grandal 3.5 to 2.8 in around 80 less AB's so I have to think McCann got more credit for defense especially when Grandal is usually among the league leaders in passed balls. Both McCann and Grandal hit left handers very well so with a lefty pitching I can easily see Grandal DHing while McCann catches with Collins on the bench.Catcher is the one position that really needs to be shared when it is so demanding both physically and mentally.

Fox pulling out the old Beetlejuice soundtrack with Jump in Line ( Shake Shake Senora ) made me smile.

Mike Tauchman of the Yankees

You don't have to get Grandal and Moustakas for 2 years each. There's Abreu too ya know. He's the oldest. No one lasts forever there are players who will falter and that includes Vaughn. You do what you can to build the team without Vaughn . If Vaughn becomes a stud then that's a good problem you have. If Collins is left out so be it. There are always trades to be made if somehow the Sox end up with too much talent. You really do over think things sometimes. There's no reason to try to fit Vaughn into someones timeline . Collins can be a valuable piece but we need valuable pieces now to least get into a position for the playoffs if the young starting pitching can come through they way Giolito did. If that doesn't happen there's no amount of money the Sox can throw at free agents that will fix things. But in the mean time you need solid position players with solid backups in case Moncada really is as soft as everyone thinks,not a DH who really can't play the field or a lefty who can't hit lefties and they both play the same position when on the field. We have Abreu to DH and a future DH in Eloy . Why spend money on another one ? I even saw one article online that suggested Vaughn was a future DH.

Last time I saw Vaughn he was playing A+ ball, I'll worry about Vaughn when he is killing AAA.

No, I'm expecting Abreu to DH mostly. If the Sox can't see having Abreu mostly DHing thats not my problem. Moose would take over at 1st and hopefully Abreu gets less than 50 games there. You go on and on about Moose not being in the lineup but here's the reality. see below. The problem with your plan is expecting to make the playoffs next year with a Kopech, Cease and Lopez never having had success in MLB yet. You don't deal for one year rentals expecting to sign them . You just don't. You didn't have a rebuild to throw those years away on a rental. If you want to trade for Nimmo a guy with 3 years , that's not so bad.We had the rebuild to make smart trades. We have a ton of OF's in the system . I don't care what you think of them , they need to have an opportunity to rise , one more year. Just as all the starting pitchers need 1 more year. I wasn't counting on Betts or Springer . I said wait , Pederson is included in that wait. Also Moose (876 OPS 2019 ) and Grandal (.926 OPS 2019) hit lefties way better than Pederson (.505 OPS 2019 ) does. Dodgers really wouldn't even bat Pederson against lefties. JDM/Pederson vs Moose /Grandal isn't the difference between the Sox making the playoff or not . It's just a better, deeper more well rounded team my way. I expect ELoy to put up JDM type numbers this year or very close.The pitching will be the difference in if the Sox make the playoffs. They fill more positions and have better backups my way. They don't trade assets,they have my guys for more than just a year. 1st Moustakas/Abreu 2nd Madrigal/ Moustakas 3rd Moncada/ Moustkas SS Anderson DH Abreu/ Moustakas C Grandal/McCann LF Jimenez CF Robert RF Whoever

With Abreu now mostly at DH he would get plenty at 1st, or when Abreu played 1st he can DH, He could also open the season at 2nd before Madrigal comes up but I'd prefer someone like Holt or Leury if Sanchez is non tendered. Plays 3rd to give Moncada rest. Basically the primary 1st baseman/DH and backup 2nd and 3rd baseman. Easily as many AB's as he got with the Brewers around 500.

Yea I think he means he hopes the Sox become more like the Stros/Rays in a subtle way by not mentioning the Sox.

This was actually one of the better Hawk efforts this year especially the play of the 3rd and 4th lines. The problem is the power play went 0-5 and gave up a shorty. But as a team they generated a lot of top scoring chances but Holtby had his best game of the season. Stats favored the Hawks 84-49 Hawks in shot attempts, 43-22 in scoring chances. Washington blocked 17 shot attempts. I think eventually Robin Lehner becomes the #1 goalie though they will get near equal time in the near future until they have enough evidence to play Lehner more.

I'm willing to admit he sucks like most QB's when he doesn't have time to throw. The biggest difference in the team is the poor play of the OL. At least last year he could run when he couldn't find a receiver , he doesn't even have a pocket to run from this year.

Some of the math heads have figured it's $65M with arb., pre arb., and Abreu . Grandal and Moustakas are both LH power bats. Together they can give you 60 HR's play catcher, DH, 1st, 2nd and 3rd base and together they might cost the same as JDM's AAV which might be around $35M . That just sounds better to be covering 5 different positions in a pinch, more HR's, same salary and left handed. Plus you don't lose any defense like you do having to play JDM in the OF in the World Series or interleague games in NL parks. Those games could matter when it comes to winning a division or just making the playoffs. They are also both younger than JDM and out WARed JDM last year and both might take less years in their contracts As far as where the money goes , you were already off by $15M on the starting point and if there is anything left over you don't have to waste assets trading for a 1 year rental like Pederson and hoping to resign him . I think that's a terrible plan and more speculative than signing Grandal and Moustakas. Just wait a year , what's wrong with waiting ? If you wait a year you save a bunch of years on the guys it takes to trade for him. If there is money left over than you can sign him as a FA or Springer or even Betts in 2021.

Stros in WS walk off 2 run Altuve HR !

Clutch

You don't think the Sox are going to try to fill as many holes as they can being as economically as possible ? Only the starting pitching should get a decent amount of money thrown at it . You don't think left handed power bats might also be a top priority after starting pitching along with trying to build a better defensive team ? The giant hole can be filled with more versatile players who also plug some holes who can rotate at DH. I'd be surprised if the Sox bought JDM. Some of us are going to be disappointed. There's a lot more to look at than just sticking a bat at DH at play here.

Both ? Have to prepare for 2021 by filling holes this year. This year is pitching rich so that's where the money definitely has to go.

Can't replace Lopez. He's shown enough that any year in the next 2 could be a break out year. He's been healthy and young starting pitching provides good value. That's why they had a rebuild.

What did you do with the real Chicago White Sox ? Was this post completely facetious ? Edit: Just read the rest of the thread. I knew you had you be screwing around.

That still doesn't negate all the other things I mentioned. There are other ways to upgrade the offense besides making the defense poorer and cluttering the roster with DH types thus limiting defensively versatility and relegating your bench to a couple super utility types while also not giving the young pitchers a shot at defensive support and tying up a huge chunk of payroll. It might also limit any roll Collins might have.

He's not my 1st choice and I wouldn't give up assets for him. I'd consider him if non tendered but only if there are other offensive upgrades and the pitching is still the 1st priority and the Sox aren't going to go above $125M payroll in 2020 thus giving them a chance at Springer or Betts in 2021 . It also gives one of the minor league OF's a chance to improve. If the price of Nimmo proves too high or the Mets want to keep him, a non tendered Bradley isn't a terrible choice if you consider Eloy might become more of the Eloy we saw at AAA, , Robert, Madrigal, Grandal and Moose would substantially upgrade the offense we could carry a defense 1st RF who has a good arm, robs some HR's ,pops 20 HR's . runs the bases well and provides veteran leadership. He's also young enough that he might have a season like he did in 2016 but I know I am reaching on that one.

Ok Hawks can salvage this opening season home stand with 2 more victories against some tough opponents. Looks like Keith pairing with Murphy is the shut down defensive pair for now. Not sure the Hawks can play good offense and good defense at the same time. Seems like it's either one or the other for them.