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The Marlins have offered Saltalamacchia a two-year deal with a club option for a third season, according to Phil Mackey of 1500 ESPN. If a guaranteed 3 yr deal is all it takes to get Salty any chance Hahn jumps in ?

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Dec 3, 2013 -> 11:16 AM) Phil Mackey ‏@PhilMackey 15m Source tells me #Marlins are offering Saltalamacchia 2 years w/ 3rd-yr team option. Guessing Twins will have to top it (guarantee 3rd year?) Most were guessing in the 4 yr. range . Maybe Hahn jumps in the bidding if it's 3 years. Nah.

Hard to beleive the NHL thread is so quiet. Clearly threads thrive on bad news . Success and stability must be boring. Hawks approaching dynasty status and you can hear a pin drop in here.

QUOTE (Baron @ Dec 3, 2013 -> 09:54 AM) Certainly....just not hearing an update besides the Flowers resign has me just a tad bit worried. I understand completely. The Rays sign Hanigan basically saying hey no catchers can hit so might as well sign the one who can throw out a runners and work a walk while we still have catchers who can't do anything right.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Dec 3, 2013 -> 09:35 AM) Traded to Rays. Possible 3 team trade per Rosenthal Rays basically saying if we'e going to have a catcher who can't hit might as well have the best guy at throwing out baserunners and walks plenty and doesn't K a lot either. Smart.

QUOTE (Baron @ Dec 3, 2013 -> 09:45 AM) An update from Bucket would be really nice.....doesnt look like we're getting Salty(Marlins & Twins)....what's left? Kurt Suzuki? Still plenty of catchers the Sox could trade for.

QUOTE (Jillian Michaels' Abs @ Dec 3, 2013 -> 09:40 AM) I wish I could be a fly on the wall in just one staff meeting leading up to the GM meetings, so I could know what the hell the Sox are doing/planning/wanting our of their roster next season. You would be swatted and squished. No leaks allowed !

Catcher's flying off the shelves, Twins spending money in free agency and still looking at Salty too. Tigers making crazy moves and about to sign Nathan. Rumors that Ellsbury might sign during the winter meetings. All kinds of things happening. Hahn and the Sox more under the radar than even KW was. When Konerko says "I'm baaaaaaaack" and the Sox sing "Welcome Back" I expect a 50 page thread.

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Dec 2, 2013 -> 06:36 PM) source? Its on the mlbtraderumors list http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/nontenders2014 but no links provided for Beckham, De Aza and Viciedo , just Flowers and Ax.

De Aza, Beckham, Viciedo, Flowers all tendered , Axlerod non-tendered.

QUOTE (Jake @ Dec 1, 2013 -> 08:15 PM) The problem is that they tried to make quantitative. They made a series of small, subjective opinions about each player and turned them into numbers and then analyzed the result of the numbers as if to say, "numbers don't lie!" Nobody could say with a straight face that Alejandro is one of the worst CF in baseball, but the numbers say so (that a guy made up)! If he just said, I think this guy is better and here are some reasons I'd take it more seriously. Instead, the results don't even reflect his opinions, but rather an arbitrary score based on his opinions -- in other words, I guarantee the list is not in the order it would be if he tossed out the numbers and just ranked them based on who he thought was better. I don't know man you can take 1000 guys with infinite baseball knowledge with all the latest stats on offense and defense and baserunning then throw in health and age and future projection and you 're still going to come up with 1000 different lists when your taking so many players into consideration. I'm sure not going to blow a gasket like most commenters do because someone elses opinion is different then mine. I take following the Sox very seriously but it's the nature of the beast for all those argumentatove, outraged commenters not to keep in mind the writer tried to take all aspects of a players game into consideration but some stuff is very subjective . I read a lot of the individual ranking sand what I saw about the Sox players was pretty much spot on wether it was Dunn, De Aza or Viciedo. Where they end up in the rankings doesn't really matter . The guy seemed like he did his homework. There's just so much research you can do before you have to write the article and you're bound to screw up somewhere since metrics often conflict .

QUOTE (raBBit @ Dec 1, 2013 -> 08:30 PM) The fact that posters are reaching for Bleacher Report for news means we need the Winter Meetings more than anything. Thankfully they begin a week from tomorrow. The cannot come soon enough. You can only go to Soxtalk, SSS , MLBtraderumors, CSN, CBSsports, ESPNChicago so many times before you look at B/R for anything new I haven't already seen about my Sox.

QUOTE (Jake @ Dec 1, 2013 -> 08:15 PM) The problem is that they tried to make quantitative. They made a series of small, subjective opinions about each player and turned them into numbers and then analyzed the result of the numbers as if to say, "numbers don't lie!" Nobody could say with a straight face that Alejandro is one of the worst CF in baseball, but the numbers say so (that a guy made up)! If he just said, I think this guy is better and here are some reasons I'd take it more seriously. Instead, the results don't even reflect his opinions, but rather an arbitrary score based on his opinions -- in other words, I guarantee the list is not in the order it would be if he tossed out the numbers and just ranked them based on who he thought was better. I can say with a straight face De Aza is just about the worst CF in baseball defensively if you use DRS as a metric. Throw in his outs on the bases and your looking at a pretty bad overall CF with not a lot of upside to look forward to.

QUOTE (Jake @ Dec 1, 2013 -> 05:05 PM) It isn't that it came from B/R, it's that it's based on nothing. They claim to consult various statistics, but the actual point values they assign are based on their gut feeling (that is informed by stats, but who knows to what extent). That's dumb. All trades and free agents signings are based in part on past and future perceived worth. That's why you have some people liking or hating on trades and signings. I think the lists are useful for fun and not thinking they're the defintive word . That's whats fun abour baseball ,comparing players to each other.

QUOTE (Jose Abreu @ Dec 1, 2013 -> 07:06 PM) Then surely, Santiago would be on it and Quintana would be top 50? If they used FanGraphs Steamer projections maybe not . They weren't too kind to Santiago for next year .Also there are still a fair share of Sox fans who don't think Quitana can sustain what he's been doing. The ones who doubted him after his 1st good year still hoping to be right in their analysis though if it were me I'd be more than happy to admit I was wrong.

QUOTE (Jake @ Dec 1, 2013 -> 05:05 PM) It isn't that it came from B/R, it's that it's based on nothing. They claim to consult various statistics, but the actual point values they assign are based on their gut feeling (that is informed by stats, but who knows to what extent). That's dumb. I think you have to remember that list was for who they consider best for 2014 so a certain amount of speculation went into it.

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Dec 1, 2013 -> 03:55 PM) I don't understand the arbitrary point values given. De Aza was given something like a 13/25 for baserunning. Why 13? Why out of 25? I'm not saying their actual rankings on that list are bad, I just don't understand their scoring system for figuring that list. It was actually 12 out of 20 for baserunning. And I can't answer why they picked a 20 pt. system for running the bases. But a 12/20 seems fair. He has speed but not elite speed and his SB percentage wasn't good per attempt nor was his baserunning. He provides value for speed and not much when you factor in his blunders. Looks like they wanted a 100 point sytem overall divided by 6 categories with some categories worth more than others.

Top 150 starting pitchers 131. Danks , 58. Quintana , 5. Sale. Santiago wasn't among the 150 which seems curious considering he had 1 more start than Danks and pitched better but Danks also didnt pitch in relief. Also no Eik Johnson and they do put some prospects in the list most notable Archie Bradley who they ranked 47th This list seems the most open to arguments.

QUOTE (Stan Bahnsen @ Dec 1, 2013 -> 01:15 PM) Yeah, I gotta pay more attention. I tend to not read the words in links. Based on the D metrics, which I'm no fan of, I think he'd likely rate better for LFers, but I could be mistaken. For corner outfielders they did a top 70. Avisail wasn't on it ,Viciedo was 64. Dubtful De Aza even played enough LF to even qualify and I sure can't argue with their placement of De Aza or Viciedo.

QUOTE (Chilihead90 @ Dec 1, 2013 -> 12:19 PM) It's from Bleacher Report, so it really shouldn't be taken too seriously anyway. I don't think it 's difficult for knowledgeable people to make a list like that . To automatically dismiss it for that reason is pretty silly. Of course there will be disputes among fans but the list in general is fairly accurate. Of course there will be those who disagree amongst fans. That can't be avoided. They used various respected websites to compile their lists. Baseball-Reference.com provided basic stats. FanGraphs offered more complex stats, most notably plate-discipline data that was referenced for both hitters and pitchers. Brooks Baseball afforded spray charts; zone profiles; and, most importantly, pitch data. Pitch types, velocity and movement data all came from there. Lastly, Baseball Prospectus produced additional data and was particularly handy in forming the health sections by way of its injury records. Rotoworld helped with more recent injury updates. They took everything into consideration . Hitting, hitting for power, baserunning,fielding and health.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Dec 1, 2013 -> 10:18 AM) Are you suggesting Keppinger and Konerko were worse? Because that's silly. They merely played more. If you give Phegley the same number of plate appearances, he ends up as the worst. Using wRC+ which tells you how you played relative to the league as opposed to offensive runs accumulated, which is a measure of how often you play, then Phegley's 34 comes out as the worst...by far. You know it's a sad state of affairs when people argue over who's the worst player on the team and if that player or our other players were the worst in baseball. So he sucked after his call up. Imagine that, a rookie sucking with his first exposure to ML league pitching.

QUOTE (chisoxfan310 @ Dec 1, 2013 -> 07:57 AM) I wouldn't want Granderson unless it meant Dunn was the odd man out making Viciedo the DH. Otherwise, its a deep draft, lets not waste our high draft position. Alejandro De Aza named 37th best CF in baseball out of 40 http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1755728...center-fielders

QUOTE (raBBit @ Nov 30, 2013 -> 01:43 PM) I totally agree with your thoughts on CF and I wanted Bourjos before he was moved I just don't know how likely it is. Another thing, I don't if I think or I am confident we'll compete but that is where the FO wants to go so it's definitely something to note when looking ahead this offseason. I thought Bourjos was a perfect fit for the Sox and was disappointed the Cards beat us to the punch. Haven't done much looking to see who might fit the bill but I like Juan Lagares of the Mets . Here's a little something on him from Fangraphs. Unfortunately he's not LH. http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/juan-lagare...sin-of-runners/

Hawks win 5-2 , finsihing " Circus Trip" with a 6-1 record after the opening lose to Colorado with 6 straight wins.

Kane putting on another clinic with a goal and assist leading the Hawks to a 3-0 lead over the 'Yotes after 1.