Rowand44

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Dec 13, 2005 -> 11:37 AM) What do we need? Trade Garland for a CF? Who? BTW, I hate you. Yes, no green. Maybe a CF and a stud reliever, not sure but we wouldn't keep Jon if we traded for Vaz, I'll guarantee you that.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Dec 13, 2005 -> 11:37 AM) Damn you One of these days si, it will happen..I promise you. When, I'm not exactly sure.

QUOTE(southsideirish71 @ Dec 13, 2005 -> 11:34 AM) Its scary when you and I are on the same page on this. LOL I'm not advocating the deal, I'm just citing what would happen. So we're still not on the same page.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Dec 13, 2005 -> 11:31 AM) So lets just say we do trade Duke and Young/Sweeney/Owens for Vazquez. Mark-Freddy-Jon-Count-Vaz? No, then you swing a deal where you trade Garland for something of value in a seperate deal. As usual you are completely lost.

QUOTE(chitownsportsfan @ Dec 13, 2005 -> 09:53 AM) I'm really sick of the crap that gets thrown at sabremetrics around here sometimes. . There are plenty of stat heads on this site and there are plenty who disagree with those methods. You'll find that everywhere so I don't know what the problem is.

QUOTE(Tony82087 @ Dec 13, 2005 -> 11:26 AM) So then the Sox obviously dont feel comfortable for some reason with Mac as the 5th starter? Something just isnt right in this rumor..... No, you trade the Duke and Young for Vaz and then swing a deal where JG is involved, then you have: Mark, Jose, Freddy, Vaz, Bmac.

QUOTE(chisox2334 @ Dec 13, 2005 -> 09:15 AM) Payroll is limited. Joe crede in arbitration means he will get money. Piersynski arbiration will be getting money. Also, jon garland in arbitration means money. Theres no room for kenny to work it out. Adding vasquez would create payroll problems. The team is set for next year. Garland last year is 2006. If the Yankees are picking up 3 mill of Vazquez's salary per year that would be about an add on of 2.5 mill this year, that wouldn't be a problem.

QUOTE(Chek2002 @ Dec 13, 2005 -> 09:12 AM) I think Kenny should do this. Getting Vazquez would not be that big of down grade. You have to keep in mind Contreras and Garland both can walk after this season. This would give us something back, we will not get anything but a couple of draft picks if they walk. Trading one of the two would allow the White Sox to concentrate on signing the other next offseason. It would be hard for the Sox to sign two of the better free agents next offseason. I would rather it be Contreras in the deal, since he is older and more of a risk long term Welcome.

USCF.

Not a big fan of Vazquez at all and trading Jose is a 100 percent no no imo considering I think he'll be our best pitcher next year. If this happens it obviously means Kenny has no confidence Jon would come back next year. I wouldn't be a fan of trading Jon to get Javier at all but I'm backing up Kenny 100 percent this year, if he thinks he sees something in Vazquez then I'll go along with it. I trust Kenny completely.

QUOTE(SoxFan1 @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 11:17 PM) Yes, I know, but he refers to McCarthy and Jenks...both of which came from the Sox minors. It just doesnt fit to me. If he wanted to talk about additions to the 2005 season, why didnt he mention AJ or Pods or Duke or Dye? Most likely because they actually had Iguchi ranked as one of our top 10 prospects last year(number 8 iirc).

QUOTE(Punch and Judy Garland @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 10:51 PM) You guys say these hyperbolic (is that a word?) statements liek "carried the offense" but thats bulls***. He didn't hit for power, he didn't knock in runs, he didn't walk, he can't play defense and at best he's lockerroom neutral. Just because he was on a championship team doesn't mean that he helped. Another DH around league average would have done more than Jurassic did. He knocked in 87 runs, that's not bad at all. He was the only hitter in the middle of the lineup that could hit the ball at the beginning of the year when Paul and Dye were hitting below the mendoza line. Also, he wasn't neutral in the clubhouse, he was one of the leaders in there along with Mark, Paul and AJP. Carl was actually very well liked on this team.

QUOTE(jphat007 @ Dec 11, 2005 -> 09:25 PM) He only led our team in BA with runners in scoring position for the season. He carried us on offense for the first couple of months when we built our lead and Paul and the crew were struggling on offense. And he was never a "jerk" with the Sox. ^^^

QUOTE(SnB @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 07:21 PM) with classes like that, i'd think you were going to SIU or something. This is what you learn at U of I: How to tell horrible, horrible jokes.

Wow, fantastic deal for Texas.

QUOTE(SoxFan101 @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 02:50 AM) Dye only signed a 2 year contract so I dont think he will return.... And yes we will still have enough pieces to win but hopefully we can figure something out with Garland and even Contreras. Dye has a 6 million dollar team option for next season. As long as he produces like last year it'll be picked up.

QUOTE(SSH2005 @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 02:16 AM) On the whole, I think that El Duque could be more effective out of the bullpen than Marte. But lefties absolutely destroy El Duque. When he was in the rotation they sure did. In his brief stint in the pen he did just fine against them though. Adding 3 mph or so to his fastball in the pen is just so huge as it also makes his breaking junk more effective. Obviously he's not a sure thing but I'm much more confident in him then I was or would be with Damaso.

QUOTE(SoxFan101 @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 02:16 AM) Next season if you think about it could almost be a re-building season....could have Josh Fields, Chris Young, Jerry Owens all starting and Brian Anderson in only his 2nd year. A course if we keep the pitching in tact that would prob still be enough to make the playoffs possibly. Also if Joe wants to get paid I want to see him produce with the bat for a whole season not just 3 out of 5 months... Dye will be here in 07 as long as he produces like he did last year. You might have some youngins next season but you still have one hell of a core: Paul, Thome, Gooch, AJ(he'll be back), juan, dye, mark, bmac, freddy, bobby, neal. Not bad.

QUOTE(IlliniKrush @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 01:58 AM) I read that article. Absolutely ridiculous By his logic, they should trade wood, prior, and zambrano for position players due to their higher win shares totals. Also, he advocates getting rid of great starting pitchers because they will become expensive pretty soon. We're talking about the Cubs here, not the Royals. That article is horrible. You don't give up a stud starting pitcher for a stud position player, ever.

QUOTE(YASNY @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 01:54 AM) Phil Rogers is advocating they trade Zambrano to get Tejada. http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sp...-home-headlines That would not be smart on the Cubs part.

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 01:14 AM) If Marte was horrendous, what was Mike Jackson two seasons ago? Or Shingo Takatsu earlier last season? I don't want our ballclub to endure any pitching retread (ie, the remaining FA bullpen help) that will remind us of the previously mentioned players. Not many appear worried about trading Marte. If you believe he departure was neccessary, fine. Now, locate a suitable replacement. Where's he going to come from, for how much, and is the pitcher of equal or greater value? I just won't accept a drop in bullpen production for the sake of a supersub in Macowiak. Signing Dotel seems a reasonable solution, but it doesn't help us for the first several months. Basically, I'm looking at it like the Duke is Damaso's replacement. Another reliever would just be an extra I guess you could say, that's why I honestly have no problem with a Baj or Munoz. I do love the Dotel idea though. Anyways, I think Orlando will be much better in the pen then Damaso was last year, his arm is so much stronger coming out of the pen that it makes his junk much better as well. Cheat makes a good point about Kenny not even giving Ozzie a chance to be cute with a 2nd lefty.

QUOTE(Flash Tizzle @ Dec 12, 2005 -> 01:00 AM) It doesn't matter to me whether a left-hander is sign specifically for the duty of retiring left-handers. My concern? Williams better locate a reliever of equal or greater value than Marte. And despite the consensus Marte was a headcase and seemingly worthless to this team, I'll GUARANTEE we'll be happy if his replacement deplicates Marte's numbers from last year. Marte literally was horrendous last year, I won't be happy with any reliever that duplicates Damaso's year.

Have a good one.

Ouch.

QUOTE(joeynach @ Dec 11, 2005 -> 03:20 PM) I would definatly sign AJ for a 2 or 3 year deal. The problem is AJ is coming off one of his worst years in terms of his batting avg, which has been the cornerstone of his game for so long. He was the guy who was always a lock for a 290-310 avg. He hit a career low .258 in 2005 for the sox. Kinda of dissapointing. It was nice to see some inflated power numbers, but that was a product of a 7 homers in 7 days tear he went on in May. AJ is still AJ and will put up career average numbers more likely than break out numbers. That being said I would look for his batting avg to rebound next year, I hope. If i was KW I would know I could probably get him on a 1 year deal for quite cheap since he had his worst year in batting avg, 1 year 3.5 mil. However, I would also try something like a 2 year 7-8 mil with an option or a 3 year 10-11 mil deal with a buyout. That should basically do it, granted AJ wants to be a White Sox for the next few years. Getting offense from AJ is secondary, any O from AJP is just a bonus.