Dam8610

QUOTE (CaliSoxFanViaSWside @ Jul 16, 2016 -> 11:28 PM) I might have to take back my compliment about you making sense if you think the team that trades for Lucroy is getting 5 or 6 years from him. They get the rest of this year and next and that's it. There's an opportunity to extend him as well. He has 5-6 years of good performance left, and the team that trades for him has 2 of those years and the highest probability of getting the rest.

QUOTE (NCsoxfan @ Jul 16, 2016 -> 10:36 PM) That's false equivalence. He's under contract for this year & next (age 30-31). Obviously you have to factor in costs, not to mention whether there's a decline in productivity (very normal after that age). So the way you frame the comparison IMO is misleading. Analogy is absolutely true. Trading many years of upside to get a little tiny bit better today with a guy who has peaked career wise. Do these trades enough times and you continue to be mediocre or below mediocre for a long long time. You're overvaluing his potential in the hopes of getting a cost controlled, top end talent, which is fair, but you're not acknowledging that, best case scenario, you're flipping a coin in hopes of getting it. Lucroy is an all-star, a premium bat at a premium defensive position, and cost controlled for this year and next. It's not like we're talking about one of the plethora of corner OFs whose names have thrown out over the past couple of years, this is a catcher who provides an impact bat, and likely will for 5-6 years. It's more like trading a 75 cent option that you hope goes to 150 cents in exchange for 120 cents, if you want to use that type of analogy.

QUOTE (AJUribe @ Jul 16, 2016 -> 10:32 PM) Anderson, Melky, and Eaton are the only players that can hit. Abrue brings no energy, frazier hits homers off garbage pitchers but can't put a ball in play off any pitcher of decent quality. Can't win with 2 black holes at 3-4. You call 2-4 with 2 doubles a black hole? Give me that black hole any day of the week.

QUOTE (NCsoxfan @ Jul 16, 2016 -> 08:36 PM) I don't think so. We're pretty entrenched in the +- 2 games over .500 type of team. There's a huge gap between our statistics versus the teams that are solidly in the playoffs. We have got to stop trading 80 cents today that will likely be 120 cents but could be 150 cents for 100 cents. Fulmer is a maybe starter who has an absolute ceiling of a #1 starter and a floor of a middle reliever. Lucroy is an all-star catcher who likely has 5-6 good years left in him. Your analogy doesn't add up.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ Jul 16, 2016 -> 07:04 PM) I like the idea of LuCroy but the Sox need more than just a catcher to become contenders so using the Sox best asset (Fulmer) to acquire LuCroy makes little sense. It's not like the Sox are loaded with assets for trade to fix the holes in the pen, DH and CF. There are internal options to deal with DH and CF. That will require some breaks in the White Sox favor, but every team needs that to get to the postseason. This move would improve the team for this year and next and gives the team that whole time to negotiate an extension with him.

QUOTE (soxforlife05 @ Jul 16, 2016 -> 07:01 PM) Haven't you seen our record against divisional opponents not named Minnesota? It's 6-18 So improving the team won't improve that?

QUOTE (soxforlife05 @ Jul 16, 2016 -> 06:13 PM) We are within 1 game of being behind 7 teams for the wild card. Another losing streak and the team is finished. Another winning streak and they could be on top of the division again. That's not really a good argument against doing something to improve the team. QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jul 16, 2016 -> 06:35 PM) They could fix catcher defense much cheaper than Lucroy will cost. Another short term focused move so people can howl at the moon...no thanks. Lucroy fixes catcher defense and catcher offense. He's a 3 or 4 hitter playing a premium defensive position, and therefore worth giving up something valuable like Fulmer.

QUOTE (South Side Fireworks Man @ Jul 16, 2016 -> 04:41 PM) Abreu should be batting fifth or sixth until he starts hitting like a three or four again. Abreu has a .312/.357/.493 slash line since June 1. How is that not a 3 hitter?

QUOTE (Lip Man 1 @ Jul 16, 2016 -> 05:38 PM) The odds of the Sox making the playoffs this year are either slim or none. Don't trade anybody! Mark Would those odds not improve tremendously with the addition of Lucroy?

From the glass half full perspective, that means based on historical results, the White Sox have a much better chance of winning the next 5 games, as they are 42-35 in games following a game day.

QUOTE (TheFutureIsNear @ Jul 16, 2016 -> 05:18 PM) No interest in trading Fulmer and I don't think we have enough to get Lucroy without him. Of course I'd love him but we just have nothing to trade for any top flight guys sadly. You just named the trade chip that could bring him in, and if the White Sox truly are in year 2 of a 3 year competitive window, the best way Fulmer can help that is in a trade.

The White Sox are attempting to make the postseason this year and have publicly stated that they are in the middle of what they consider to be a 3 year window to compete for the playoffs. As of today, the most easily identifiable weakness on the team is the offense, specifically a lack of consistent production, something that could be most easily solved by the addition of a highly productive bat. The spots on the team that are easily upgraded at this point are CF, DH, and C, where Hahn's offseason "trade defense for offense" experiment has failed miserably and the White Sox have experienced a plethora of injuries. For all these reasons, the White Sox should pursue Jonathan Lucroy. He is a middle of the order bat at a premium defensive position where the White Sox need an upgrade. The price will be steep, but the players the White Sox would potentially give up are not likely to help in the competitive window the team has stated they wish to maintain, such as Carson Fulmer, Spencer Adams, Jake Peter, Trey Michelewski, etc. Meanwhile, a lineup with Lucroy could provide the run support the pitching staff needs, regardless of whether Abreu and Frazier turn their seasons around. This lineup looks like a playoff lineup to me: SS Anderson RF Eaton C Lucroy 1B Abreu 3B Frazier LF Cabrera DH Morneau/trade if he doesn't work out 2B Lawrie CF Jackson Lucroy would also provide a defensive upgrade at one of the most important defensive positions, and is also one of the best pitch framers in the game according to the numbers for those who believe in those statistics. If there was a move that would put this team over the top and into the playoffs, this is the move.

If you're going for a catcher, go Lucroy.

QUOTE (WhiteSoxLifer @ Jul 15, 2016 -> 07:55 PM) 3-4 now. 2 singles and homer Current A+ OPS: 1.800

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 14, 2016 -> 09:59 PM) If the Pomeranz trade is any indication of where the trade market is at, I am good with standing pat. That's where the starting pitching market is, but everyone knew that. In fact, that trade makes me think the White Sox could get Lucroy with a package that includes Fulmer.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jul 9, 2016 -> 09:17 PM) Cause I fell for it last year. Exact same situation. Sox went completely in the tank right after the break. This team doesn't have what it takes and I can see that clearly. SELL. Last year's team was 4 games under .500 going into the break and never seemed to get over a rough start. This year's team will either be 2 or 4 games over .500 going into the break and has already overcome quite a bit of adversity that would have sunk a team like the 2015 squad. Offensively, their two biggest bats have severely underperformed, and they've had quite a few injuries that have eaten away at depth. Not to mention they've pulled themselves out of that horrible tailspin they were in quite nicely, which would've turned into a death spiral for a team like last year's squad. One highly effective run producing bat is just about all this team is missing to be competitive with anyone in the league. Getting that bat at a premium defensive position like catcher, and having that catcher also be a premium defender, would be a huge boost to a team like this one, and could be just what the team needs to get in the playoffs and maybe even make a deep run. Send them Fulmer and anything else short of Collins that it takes to get him here, and see what happens. I certainly have a lot more hope for what this team can accomplish in the second half as opposed to last year's team.

Why are people suggesting selling when this team is over .500 going into the break instead of talking about what it would take to get the one player on the market who would be a substantive and worthwhile upgrade (Jonathan Lucroy)?

Timmay!

So what would it take to get Lucroy, again?

Lucroy is the person to add, he'd be a definitive upgrade that wouldn't take up a spot in the OF or the DH spot. The question is whether the White Sox have the pieces to put a package together to get him.

What would it take to Lucroy? Fulmer + ???

Timmay!

QUOTE (GreatScott82 @ Jul 4, 2016 -> 08:53 AM) Wow. Interesting stuff. I wonder what their record is since they inserted Tim Anderson into the lineup as well? 12-10. Another interesting note on Anderson, he's hitting .300 with an OPS just shy of .800 while carrying a 32.4% K rate. He'll be a scary good hitter if he can maintain his performance in all other aspects and knock that K rate down to 25% or less.

QUOTE (flavum @ Jul 4, 2016 -> 08:57 AM) 23-10, then 10-26, then 9-4. 42-40. I thought about that, too. Turns out Lawrie has played 81 of the team's 82 games, with the lone exception being one of the 10 wins in the 10-26 stretch.

My guess is the answer depends on Brett Lawrie. First 33 games (23-10): .271 AVG, .817 OPS Next 35 games (9-26): .191 AVG, .570 OPS Last 13 games (9-4): .377 AVG, 1.079 OPS Seems like when Brett hits, the Sox win, and when he doesn't, they don't.