Dick Allen

QUOTE (Felix @ Nov 19, 2008 -> 03:21 PM) I don't know where you got the idea that Swisher was 'my boy', but I feel obligated to inform you that he isn't. I was incredibly disappointed in him last year. However, despite this disappointment, I feel that he's a good candidate to bounce back, especially given how amazingly unlucky he was last year (and no, Morneau was not unlucky last year; his .312 BABIP was above the league average but in line with where it should have been given his LD%). However, MVP voters (and fans) continuously tout Justin Morneau as an elite talent and one of the best players in baseball. Unfortunately, this isn't true. He's an above average player who happens to be lucky enough to be hitting behind the best contact hitter in baseball, but is not an elite talent alone. He finished the season 12th in VORP and 15th in OPS (American League rankings). He was tied for 18th in home runs with only 23 (which shouldn't matter, but is worth mentioning since his mythical power isn't really there), and only had a high number of RBI because of his major league high 400 AB with runners on (and league high 558 runners on). Morneau even ranked 10th in the AL in OBI% (other batted in, which is basically the percent of runners on that were driven in), slightly behind other MVP candidates like Carlos Quentin (9th) and Kevin Youkilis (8th). Interestingly enough, David DeJesus led the AL in this with 21% of runners on driven in. More importantly, Morneau completely disappeared down the stretch when his team needed him the most. He hit .267/.350/.481/.831 after the All-Star break when his team needed him the most. This includes his amazing .243/.298/.398/.696 line in September, which has already been mentioned by just about anyone arguing against him as a candidate. I'm not saying Morneau is a bad offensive player. He had a good season, and was above average. However, the majority of sports writers (and fans apparently) seem to think that he's one of the best offensive players in the league and easily the best player on his team. They are wrong (which Rob Neyer covers the case for Joe Mauer pretty well here). In that sense, Justin Morneau is overrated. Feel free to bash me and tell me that my apparent man-crush on Nick Swisher is just blinding me, but it doesn't change the fact that Morneau is not one of the elite offensive players in the league and should not have been in the top 5 for MVP voting this year or in 2006. If you want to prove me wrong, feel free, but it certainly shouldn't include anything about my opinion of Nick Swisher (which isn't really my opinion in the first place). You didn't say Morneau was overrratee, ou said Morneau was the most overrated player in baseball. Period. You can try to spin your error anyway you want, but he's not. He's driven in 370 runs the last 3 seasons. There are a lot of players more overrated than a guy who puts 3 seasons like that together. Maybe he was just incredibly unlucky when he made outs. You know the argument you made for Swisher.

I'd like the White Sox to start collecting some players who can really run and make decent contact, maybe can even drop down a bunt. Hinske had an unexpected decent year. I think he'd be a waste of space.

QUOTE (Felix @ Nov 19, 2008 -> 11:48 AM) He led the majors in at bats with runners on.. there is no reason he shouldn't have gotten as many RBI as he did. Fact of the matter is that he choked down the stretch when his team needed him the most. Whether you look at it from a statistical viewpoint (12th in the AL in VORP, 15th in OPS) or from the opinion that the MVP should have been the most valuable to his team (again, not Morneau given his choke job down the stretch), Morneau simple wasn't the caliber of player that an MVP should be. Simply put, if you aren't the best (or most valuable) player on your own team, there is absolutely no way you should be considered for MVP of the league. You called him the most overrated player in baseball. That wasn't enough, you emphasised it with Period. Your wrong. Maybe he was like your boy Swisher most of the season and just extremely unlucky down the stretch. The bottom line is he's a good player. Not nearly as overrated as you boy Nick.

QUOTE (daa84 @ Nov 19, 2008 -> 10:34 AM) as did raul ibanez Valentin junked if for a season I think.

QUOTE (caulfield12 @ Nov 19, 2008 -> 10:26 AM) My feeling is that they will try to trade DeJesus. He can be susceptible to injuries, he's not a CFer, he can't hit for enough power to play the corners, he's getting into that stage where he is overpaid for what he brings to a small market team...like Johnny Damon Lite. The Royals parted ways with Beltran, Damon and Dye when they became too successful, holding onto one-time franchise player and most popular Royal Mike Sweeney. I don't think DeJesus will be there long-term...Moore knows he's a complementary player on a great team, not a superstar. DeJesus signed a 5 year $13.8 million contract prior to the 2006 season. There is also an option for 2011. If Nick Swisher's contract is "reasonable" his is a downright bargain.

QUOTE (Felix @ Nov 18, 2008 -> 07:38 PM) Justin Morneau is the most overrated player in baseball. Period. Congrats to CQ, hopefully he tops it next year. I'll take overrated .300 hitters with power who drive in 130 runs any day of the week. If Swisher put up the exact same numbers many on this board would be on suicide watch if he wasn't the unanimous MVP pick.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 19, 2008 -> 08:21 AM) Always a bridesmaid, never a bride. I wonder how many times Joey has gotten interviews and failed? He really wanted this job. He was jockeying heavily for it. (If someone looks like he can jockey, its Joey) He had Ozzie, KW and JR call on his behalf. The Mariners have a chance to actually be decent in time. I think Joey will eventually land a job where he's doomed to get fired after a couple seasons of losing. Pittsburgh, Baltimore, something like that.

QUOTE (DrunkBomber @ Nov 18, 2008 -> 06:50 PM) I have absynth sitting on my shelf right now, taunting me Its not the real stuff. Its probably the slimmed down version. The real stuff is still illegal I believe, here and most of Europe. I was in Amsterdam and they were touting it, but it wasn't the real stuff. I think you can find it in Prague.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Nov 16, 2008 -> 01:29 PM) If they ever have an MLB channel (well I guess directtv does, but a national one) than I believe it would be cool if they televised things like AFL games and other random big minor league games where two stud prospects are battling, etc. I'm pretty sure the MLB channel is coming in January. Its supposedly one place DJ may work.

Pedroia Morneau Youkilis Mauer Quentin 5th place missing the last month isn't bad.

The entire premise for trading Jenks is the White Sox would be anticipating a decline in his performance while his paycheck will be significantly higher. If they can get a haul, and from what I read, they won't get it from the Mets, and think his performance is about to decline, they would probably trade him. I'm not for looking to trade guys at "peak value" if they still are giving you "peak performances". If you go by stats, you probably don't think about trading Freddy Garcia after 2006. 218 IP 17-9 4.54 ERA, owed $10 million for 2007. Much better numbers than Vazquez, and people think the $23 million and 2 years left on his deal are a bargain. Sometimes anticipating some rough times for players while they still have a lot of value leads to deals.

Former White Sox catcher Don Wakumatsu will be named the new Mariners manager. Joey Cora shut out.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Nov 17, 2008 -> 04:24 PM) I wonder if he showed up out of shape and scared some people off? I agree. The agent talks like he has a million offers. Maybe the offers just aren't as attractive as what he was hoping.

QUOTE (Chisoxfn @ Nov 17, 2008 -> 04:16 PM) I'm not about to debate the merits of Soxtalk or Southside Sox and I will solely tell you that selling low is something you do for a guy that has proven himself to be a fully productive major league ball player. Nick Swisher showed absolutely nothing last year. Does he have baseball tools, sure, was his value at an all time low, sure, but there isn't a f***ing team in baseball that was about to give up A type prospects for someone that was as god awful as Swisher was last year. The problem with the concept of trying to sell high and buy low is that you would always be trading your best players and the players who can't play would be littering your roster for years. The quicker you admit your mistakes and move on, the better. I like that blog, but ripping the Sox for "selling low" is BS. The guy sucked, was owed a lot of money, and the positions he plays happen to be where the Sox have more capable players. You get rid of him for what you can. They didn't have to eat any of the contract. Spend some of the savings on other players who actually can help you and move on.

QUOTE (Raf @ Nov 17, 2008 -> 02:15 PM) Wow. The analysis is spot on. The Sox DID sell shockingly low on Swisher, AND gave up the best pitcher in the deal on top of everything. The chances of Swisher rebounding are much better than any of these former Yankee scrubs ever amounting to anything. There's a reason why South Side Sox is regularly linked to by other, respected publications. It's a great site with extensive analysis and scouting predictions, which is more than I can say about Sox Talk. I'm sure I will be kicked off now, so I will leave you all to bicker amongst yourselves. Anytime you get get out of a $22 million obligation with a guy who was horrendous and couldn't beat out DeWayne Wise, anything you get is gravy. Texiera probably will be nothing. I agree the 2 Yankee minor leaguers are crap. Betimet may be able to help. Swisher is just bad. Holding on hoping against your better judgement that Swisher can turn it around just so your trade won't be thought of as wrong, bad or stupid, is exactly wrong, bad and stupid. The White Sox will use the financial savings on major league players. Players who will have a position to play. Obviously, if Swisher proves last season was just a fluke, KW got hoodwinked. I think that's a longshot. I've been critical of KW. I'm not like a lot of people on this board who think every move he makes has to be gold because he's the great KW, but this move makes a lot of sense for the White Sox. If Swisher shows next season he still can't play, your stuck with about $16 million for 2 years and a contract that in unmovable unless you eat most of it.

QUOTE (DBAHO @ Nov 17, 2008 -> 12:39 PM) If Detroit is willing to trade for Lugo (albeit dumping a bad contract in the process), some team will give Cabrera a good enough offer so the Sox will have to offer him arbitration I would have thought. But they are giving up a bad contract in exchange. I don't think Detroit is going to be in any position to add money.

QUOTE (Steve9347 @ Nov 17, 2008 -> 11:37 AM) You're right, but he won't take arbitration when he can easily sign a multi-year deal elsewhere. His ego is too high to admit he's not worth a multi-year deal. At 34 (right?), this is probably his last chance at a multi-year deal anyway. If he's offered $6-8 million a year for 2 or 3 years, he may jump at the arb offer believing the market and economic conditions could be better next year. He is definitely in the group of guys who are going to get squeezed this off season. The top 4 or 5 guys won't be affected. If they don't offer him arb we know they really didn't like him very much.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Nov 17, 2008 -> 02:55 AM) Failing to offer arbitration to Cabrera would be dumb as hell. He's almost certainly going to sign a multi-year contract elsewhere and even if he accepted arbitration, the Sox would be able to deal him with the number of teams looking for a shortstop, even if two of them are in the AL Central. I could be wrong, but I think if you offer someone arb and they accept, you can't trade them for a while. I don't know if many teams want Cabrera at $11 -$12 million anyway.

Good thing Rex didn't start this game. The horrible play of everyone else would be ignored and the humiliation would have been blamed on him.

A couple of White Sox notes from Gammons: • Ken Williams is one of the winter's most significant wheelers and dealers. He is marketing Javier Vazquez, Bobby Jenks, Jermaine Dye and others as he tries to overhaul the White Sox. The Mets are afraid of the red flag on Jenks, whose strikeout rate has dropped precipitously from 50 in 39 1/3 innings in 2005 to 38 in 61 2/3 innings this past season. And although GM Omar Minaya checked in on Sabathia, it does not mean the Mets will get into a bidding war with the Yankees for the 2007 AL Cy Young Award winner. • Scouts in Arizona for the Arizona Fall League and the White Sox's minor league people are convinced that Gordon Beckham, the eighth pick in the MLB draft this past June, will be Chicago's everyday second baseman by June.

According to Phil Rogers, one reason the Sox are considering moving Jenks is that some feel Jon Link can be a nice closer. He doesn't get much mention on this board, but if they think he can close in the big leagues he has to be a big consideration for a set up role as well.

I expect at least 2 of the 3 seemingly open positions to be filled by expensive veterans. I will be the most shocked human in the world if KW doesn't acquire a legitimate leadoff hitter this offseason.

http://www.isfauthority.com/images/35thStr...erings-2of2.jpg http://www.isfauthority.com/images/35thStr...erings-1of2.jpg There are doors where the current offices are. Maybe they will put the restaurant/bar and gift shop there.

Didn't Wood have a problem with Steve Stone several years ago for Stoney telling it like it is?

QUOTE (shipps @ Nov 15, 2008 -> 09:10 AM) Speaking of Griffey,he says it was easier to play CF than the corners.And that is something I always thought was the opposite but Iam buying into that now.You can get alot better read and alot quicker read on the ball.You dont have to contend with the funny little nooks and crannys that are down the lines.And you can see the pitch and location of where the hitter got to it more clearly,you pretty much get a far greater overall view of the play on the field. I think if he spent the majority of his career as a corner OF he would feel differently. A guy who is injured as often as he is and has the range he has now should not be in CF. The angle the ball comes to you is a little different, but I've heard KW talk about it and make it seem like its something huge, but these guys can pick it up in a very short time. He may think its easier to play CF but his pitching staff finds it harder to be successful when he's out there. The batting average for ball in play which has been used to describe how unlucky Swisher was this year was something like 75-100 points higher when Griffey played CF for the Reds his last season he played the position for them compared to what it was when someone else was playing CF. A bad defensive CF hurts your team a lot more in the long run than a bad defensive RF or LF.