ChiSox59

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 6, 2017 -> 09:29 AM) So if hypothetically he's platooned with Narvaez, we actually have one left handed hitting catcher and one right handed hitting catcher on the roster this time, not two righties, right? Yep. Super small sample, but Narvaez actually hit much better against LHP last year. Wasn't he switch hitter, but decided to drop batting from the right side in the majors?

Meh, I am ok with this, I guess. I would have preferred some new blood - Hanigan, Iannetta or Salty, but ultimately there weren't any good options really. Soto is fine.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 5, 2017 -> 06:34 PM) If Jose Abreu had hit the free agent market this year he would not have signed yet. My guess is he'd get something comparable to the money he's likely to get in arbitration these 3 years as a contract - basically I think he'd get paid what he's going to be paid, except with a couple years guaranteed. I do not believe any team will give up any top 100 prospect for Jose Abreu. If he hits the daylights out of the ball in the first half and looks like 2014 Abreu he might become moveable again for a return that isn't "salary dump", but right now given the choice of signing Trumbo or Bautista or any of the other 1b/DH types, Abreu looks like he is at best fairly paid and not worth giving up any additional talent. As has already been said, I disagree with pretty much this entire post. Abreu would get paid if he were a FA. His surplus value isn't great, and the glut of 1B types on the FA market doesn't help his present value, but the Sox could definitely get some nice prospects for Jose. That said, I don't think they're looking to move him at all.

QUOTE (SoxPride18 @ Jan 5, 2017 -> 03:45 PM) I think it's relevant in this thread, but the Rays turned down a Martes, Tucker, Paulino ++ for Archer. That is crazy. Where was this reported?

QUOTE (Quinarvy @ Jan 5, 2017 -> 03:25 PM) I don't think they were aggressive with him at all. Agreed - I mean maybe a tad aggressive because they had a real need at SS last year and after their hot start needed him there. But the guy had nearly 1,500 PA in the minors. This wasn't a Gordon Beckham rush job.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jan 4, 2017 -> 04:50 PM) I agree with this. Irrational fan opinion: Cashman wants to drop the Torres hammer and not have to give up much beyond it. He does not want to drop the Torres hammer and add considerably more after in competing with another team. Hahn is taking what amounts to less than a half season of Chapman for Jose Quintana. Obviously, that not how it works, but he'll want much more.

QUOTE (2005thxfrthmmrs @ Jan 4, 2017 -> 04:25 PM) So the OP did a benchmark of current MLB rankings against historic BA Top 100 rankings? It still doesn't make sense. Exactly. I mean, it doesn't mean much, but its at least a little interesting to look at. Hopefully more than half these guys hit, or this was a bad idea.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jan 4, 2017 -> 04:08 PM) I don't think they've updated that since mid-season. I meant current in the sense that they are the "most" current.

QUOTE (2005thxfrthmmrs @ Jan 4, 2017 -> 03:56 PM) Not sure where you got your rankings from, but those ranks will change quite a bit when the official list drops next month. Current mlb.com rankings. I expect Kopech to rise a bit. Lopez to stay about the same. Moncada will still be top 3. Giolito will drop into teens, most likely. My guess is Collins is closer to 50 than 80.

Can someone post the link without the tweet? Here it is: http://m.mlb.com/news/article/212680084/an...-prospect-poll/

QUOTE (Con te Giolito @ Jan 4, 2017 -> 01:05 PM) Nah the Sale deal was a player light. They should've been able to add Devers or EdRo (at least) to the deal they got and probably would have if they were reasonable with Boston at the deadline and not asking for Mookie Betts. Sale's value peaked at the deadline last year and unless he starts doing Kershaw things he'll never fully regain it. Sox, to their credit, didn't waste any time waiting for his value to deteriorate more and dealt him this offseason for probably 80ish% of what they would've gotten at the deadline. I'm not thrilled about it, but I'm not upset either. At least they didn't stubbornly stand firm another year and taken themselves out of the running for a Moncada-like headliner. All reports were that the Sox couldn't get Moncada or Benintendi in July, so not sure how they beat that offer without one of the other B's. Devers, yah, maybe they could have gotten him then - but without Moncada, you need much more than him to make it up.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jan 4, 2017 -> 12:51 PM) I'm just saying it may be disappointing to some if they really do intend to move him before spring training because there were a good amount of people on here that felt the Sale trade was a player off (myself included). Granted, it'll still be a great deal for us but not quite what we expect it to be. I am with ya there. I thought it was a player light as well, but see my previous post. Diminishing returns is a real thing.

QUOTE (Buehrlesque @ Jan 4, 2017 -> 12:04 PM) Q's value will likely never be higher, but it is not likely to fade much either. Four full years on an under market contract is such crazy value that the market can't even really meet it. Plus, the other part is that other players' value is no sure thing to hold steady anyway, and pitchers like Glasnow could easily tumble. Any trade is a snapshot in time value wise. The big picture is my whole argument is predicated on the fact that the slam dunk elite offer is not being made anyway. If that kind of offer comes in, then you take it. If not, evaluate all scenarios. I think the bolded is the key. We saw this with Sale, and we may very well see it with Q if he's traded this offseason. Teams are only willing to give up so much. I think you can get the same for Q value-wise next offseason, or even in a year and half, as you can now. That doesn't mean you hold for the sake of holding, as there obviously is some risk there (but with Q its minimal), but you don't take a lesser package. You wait until your asking price (or at least what you realistically would take - see Sale trade), is met.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jan 4, 2017 -> 10:10 AM) If this is true, we all may be slightly disappointed with the haul. If they're intent on finishing a deal before camp opens, they will end up settling for best offer. Meh. RH has said this is going to take time. He is not going to settle on his 2nd best trade chip that has four years of cheap control. He just won't. He'll get what he wants this offseason, or wait until he does.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jan 4, 2017 -> 10:10 AM) If this is true, we all may be slightly disappointed with the haul. If they're intent on finishing a deal before camp opens, they will end up settling for best offer. Meh. RH has said this is going to take time. He is not going to settle on his 2nd best trade chip that has four years of cheap control. He just won't. He'll get what he wants this offseason, or wait until he does.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jan 3, 2017 -> 04:25 PM) And a worse defender and base runner. Melky will fetch a talented player or two, but they will almost certainly be highly flawed. We're on the same page.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jan 3, 2017 -> 03:55 PM) Most comparable player I can compare Melky to who has been moved recently is Melvin Upton. He netted a 20 year old with back of the rotation appeal, and that's after the Padres picked up all by $5 million of Upton's salary. If that's all they can get for him come the deadline, then that's all they can get and is something they will do. Meh. Melky's OPS+ was 120 last year. BJ's was 84. They are about the same age and make about the same money, though BJ had 1.5 years still left on his deal and is owed $1.5M more than Melky this year. Not terrible comp, but Melky is a better bat.

QUOTE (bighurt574 @ Jan 3, 2017 -> 03:11 PM) He almost certainly wouldn't. If you're another team, you're basically just trading one risky asset (prospects) for another (young MLBer still figuring it out). Not sure that really makes sense. Unless another team is convinced Rodon is on the verge of being an ace and ponies up, Sox should hold him and build his value -- either to keep or trade down the road. Rodon may not have "figured it out" in the sense that he isn't quite a dominant ace and still has quite a bit of untapped potential. But you don't have to look very hard to find stats that paint him as a top 25 pitcher in the game already. The dude is really good.

QUOTE (bmags @ Jan 3, 2017 -> 02:23 PM) He's good, he'll probably out perform many inhouse options, but he's not good enough that teams aren't going to just squint at what they have and reason that they are better considering they don't cost 15 million + prospects. Yep, I agree. I think Melky is going to be on the Sox until June or July some time.

Rodon is going to be a star. They control him for 5 years. He keeps his head down and does his job. Zero percent chance he is traded this offseason.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jan 3, 2017 -> 02:11 PM) I don't see the sox as the worst team in baseball, or even bottom three, unless we deal Quintana and abreu. The padres rotation is terrible. The twins appear set on a weak season as well. Abreast, Cabrera,, Anderson, Frazier is enough of a lineup from being worst in the mlb Abreast always makes things better.

QUOTE (Balta1701 @ Jan 3, 2017 -> 12:54 PM) Why would said team not just go sign Michael Saunders? That would probably be their first choice. Look, Melky doesn't have much surplus value, but let's not act like the guy is a scrub. We all know you hate him - you crusaded against him more than anything I have ever seen on a message board in 2015. But the dude can flat out hit. He is still a very good bat, but one with some baggage.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 3, 2017 -> 11:55 AM) http://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/mlb-hot-...n-todd-frazier/ Pretty generic rumor. Prospect or two could is pretty vague. I expect the Sox would want one top 100 type guy for Frazier, plus another flyer.

QUOTE (Thad Bosley @ Jan 3, 2017 -> 11:02 AM) I would have to respectfully disagree. I don't see how it can even be remotely realistic for the Sox or anyone to think they can compete with the current roster that, with Sale and Eaton in tow, were unable to win more than 78 games in the past four years, and that was with stop gap measures in place. How can they now be expected to even get close to even 78 wins, never mind compete, without their best pitcher and position player, and with yet another set of additions of the stop gap variety. It doesn't compute. Maybe "catch lightning in a bottle" is the better phrase to use. But basically just see how things play out April-June, and then reassess. I don't think there is a good chance of that team being within 5 games of .500 in mid June, but crazier things have happened. At that point, you can still trade Melky / Frazier / Lawrie. If the offers suck now, there is a chance that their value increases by June when teams are desperate for infielders with good (Frazier) and average (Lawrie) bats. By June, Melky's commitment is a much more palatable ~$8M. Maybe he can be moved for a decent piece at that point. Trading them now for garbage that will never help the Sox doesn't do much for me. It's not like the Sox have a wealth of ML ready talent to take their spots outside of Saladino, who I still expect to get a good chunk of at bats as the super sub. Adding two of Colby Rasmus, Michael Sanders, Gregor Blanco, Rajai Davis, and Drew Stubbs would be cheap. One of Chris Carter, Ryan Howard, Adam Lind, Brandon Moss, Mike Napoli to DH. And add a Ryan Hanigan type to split the catching. None of those guys will be all that expensive. All will be on one year deals. If the Sox are way out of things in June (which they likely will be), they'll likely be trade bait and teams love short term commitments to useful players. I am not saying this is 100% the right way to go, but it is what I expect barring a Quintana trade, and I am OK with it. The team will actually be half ways decent to watch, and the team will be mostly dismantled in June and July when teams are desperate for upgrades. I think it makes a lot of sense in a market that has not developed for our short term bats. QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jan 3, 2017 -> 11:02 AM) I think it some point they take last bids on Q, and trade him for the best offer. They have gone really far down the trade path with him, especially in public, for him to come back now. Even if they go into the season with a lot of those players, I don't see them adding to them in any significant way. I fully expect Abreu and Lawrie to be on the opening day roster. Q I think there is about 10% chance. Frazier is not much higher, though I see a disappointing return to move him. Melky I think will be on the roster, as no one will really want him. Call it a 75% chance at return. I just don't see the point in trading Quintana for the best offer right now, if the best offer isn't sufficient to the Sox. I don't think his value is going to decrease between now and a year from now. At some point, there is diminishing returns - I think saw that to some degree in the Sale trade, and I think you'd definitely see that in a Q trade. If someone bowls you over, by all means take the deal. But I think Rick is still in that mode. If the Q domino falls, then my thinking changes. At that point, the Sox pitching staff goes from OK to terrible, and at that point you may as well just take what you can get for Frazier, Melky and Lawrie before Opening Day.

QUOTE (Dick Allen @ Jan 3, 2017 -> 10:14 AM) After the Sox trade Q and Robertson and Frazier or Melky, it's going to be really hard to be a White Sox fan. The team will absolutely suck, and next offseason there will be very little action. They will not have much to trade. They won't be signing big names. I'd be shocked if more than 1 of those four are traded prior to opening day at this point. In fact, I think they all stay.