ChiSox59

QUOTE (Buehrlesque @ Jul 7, 2017 -> 03:11 PM) People tend to propose massive depth packages to compensate for a lack of a big headliner or "untouchable" (as an aside, I think that term is waaay overused, especially when it comes for non-rentals like Quintana). I think the opposite is more likely — that a team will include a big shot headliner prospect and then skimp on the second and third pieces. That way, the team really only loses one significant piece (although it's a big one), and their system isn't gutted. Agreed. As mentioned, I wasn't really proposing that package. Just stating it could get done without Brinson.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jul 7, 2017 -> 02:54 PM) The Brewers are not trading their entire farm system to us like that. The White Sox would be crazy to not accept Ray + Diaz + Clark + Hader + Ortiz due to the sheer volume alone. I do not love Ray as a headliner, but if needed I would need the rest of the package to be strong. Ray + Ortiz + Phillips + Burnes would have me thinking for sure I totally agree with your first sentence. I was mainly just spitballing that they could get it done without Brinson. I'd be pretty lukewam on a Ray + Ortiz + Phillips package. Burns does next to nothing for me. If were taking lottery tickets, at this point it should be guys that have a chance to impact the game everyday in the field.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 7, 2017 -> 02:19 PM) I don't know that a deal gets done without Brinson unless they want to send us like 5 guys. Exactly. Ray, Diaz, Clark, Hader and Ortiz probably does it. But that is literally 2-6.

QUOTE (2005thxfrthmmrs @ Jul 7, 2017 -> 12:25 PM) I think the new ranking of 45 for Robert is about right. Traditionally guys aren't ranked in the upper echelon without showing success in pro ball. Robert may skyrocket through the list once we get a better look at him in A ball next year. Agreed. No qualms about 45. Thought not in top 100 was strange.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jul 7, 2017 -> 11:39 AM) Robertson + Kahnle should bring back more than Soto and a catching prospect who can't hit, especially when the Nationals are desperate. I'd insist on significantly more, and start the ask with Robles. Agreed. That was my biggest beef with those trades. Robo + Kahnle should get a haul. Soto + Kieboom ++ Tho, don't see anyway the Red Sox and Yanks would make those proposed deals.

He pitched last night. 4.1 IP. 7 Hits, 3 R/ER. 1 K. 72 pitches

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 7, 2017 -> 09:56 AM) Especially since they also have some nice IF guys in Isan Diaz and Lucas Erceg that would look really good in our system. I admittedly know next to nothing about Erceg, but he looks like the type of guy we've been trying to get away from. Low OBP and allergic to the walk. Much prefer Isan Diaz as the IF piece.

QUOTE (RegionSox @ Jul 7, 2017 -> 09:55 AM) They edited the list to add in Luis Robert at 45 Lol, that is funny. But you are absolutely correct. And then bumped Tatis to 101...haha.

QUOTE (2005thxfrthmmrs @ Jul 7, 2017 -> 09:49 AM) Burger, Dunning, Hansen, and Robert all has a chance to crack the top 100 by year end. Sort of shocked to see no Robert on either of this last 2 lists, especially the top 100. I think people just don't know here to put him.

Moncada - 1 Kopech - 20 Lopez - 58 Giolito - 74 Other notables: Vlad Guerrero, Jr - 2 Devers - 6 Robles - 8 Acuna - 10 Tucker - 11 Mitch Keller - 15 Meadows - 22 Hunter Greene - 30 Verdugo - 35 Rutherford - 36 MArtes - 47 Clint Frazier - 48 Derek Fischer - 53 Estevan Florial - 70 Kevin Maitan - 71 Kevin ENwman - 87 Juan Soto - 94 Fernando Tatis, Jr - 100

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 6, 2017 -> 03:37 PM) My guess is that there is also a fair chance that some of the return in these trades are guys that can fill in spots today as well. I'd also follow up my original post with a guess that no one wants Mike Pelfrey, and if we need to keep a veteran for a spot the rest of the season, we will be just keeping the one we already have instead of adding another. Agreed on all accounts. Could totally Pelfrey hanging around. I think he actually really likes pitching for the Sox. He's made some comments about how Coop operates and that in all his years in the bigs he has never had that type of attention from a pitching coach. Heck, all things considered, he hasn't been THAT bad for the Sox.

Don't misunderstand me, I am not pinning for Bartolo F'in Colon at all. Mainly just spitballing. And I still think this Ynoa thing is weird.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 6, 2017 -> 03:33 PM) Shields isn't going anywhere. No one will want him unless something crazy happens. Come August 1st, I think our rotation looks like... Rodon, Shields, Lopez, Holmberg, Covey/Danish Coop literally just said like 2 weeks ago that Holmberg is not a starter. I'd be surprised to see him make more than a spot start here or there the rest of the way. Unfortunately Covey will be back at some point. I kind of doubt we see Danish as a starter.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 6, 2017 -> 03:05 PM) There is absolutely zero reason for the White Sox to bring in Bartolo Colon. He is a free agent after this year, and any team who wants him already could have him as soon as he clears. The Sox aren't going this direction at this time of the season. Ehh. It makes a little sense. If the Sox move (or DFA) three out of Q, Holland, Pelfrey, Shields and Gonzalez, they need someone to fill the rotation along with Rodon and Lopez. Giolito should NOT pitch in the big leagues this year. Signing Bartolo to a pro-rated minimum deal and letting him absorb 10 starts will enhance the tanking, and what is the negative?

QUOTE (Username @ Jul 6, 2017 -> 01:59 PM) Wow I actually think the Bartolo move is very possible. Why not? Throw him out there a few times and see if he recovers value. Worst case maybe an August move guy. Other than that, maybe related to adding guys to the 40 man roster like you said? Would probably have to be a Q move since that would involve guys close to the majors and the quantity to create a squeeze. It just begs the question why you'd DFA Ynoa when you could have just optioned Infante. Seems like the Sox are trying to clear a 40 man spot. Lopez, Giolito, Gonzalez, Moncada and Saladino are already on it. Basically the only guy in AAA with a shot at being called up right now that is not on the 40 man is Delmonico.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jul 6, 2017 -> 01:41 PM) It could also be that Ynoa asked out of the organization too. I doubt that. He is out of options, so for him asking out of the organization is basically asking to be DFA'd with no guarantee on finding another MLB job. Seems like a stretch.

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jul 6, 2017 -> 01:18 PM) My question to you is: Do you really believe these players we mention have a chance of being something on your next competitive team? Is a guy like this going to earn squat in free agency anyway? I guess deep down the goal is to lose so many games there's no doubt who gets the No. 1 overall pick cause you guys certainly want to get rid of anybody with a pulse. It will be funny watching Nate Jones close next season. I can buy your premise if the guys we get for Swarzak have a chance to help a contending team someday but I severely doubt that. Anyone you get for Swarzak is probably a long shot to be an MLB regular. But that is better than nothing, which is what you get if you don't move him. That is really all there is to it.

Interesting move when you have both Infante and Minaya on the 25 man. Both have options, and Infante would have been the easy choice. This also opens a spot on the 40 man. Either the Sox are just flat done with Ynoa and Coop gave up, or there is a roster move impending adding someone to the 40 man. Minaya is younger and still has a (small) chance of being a part of the next bullpen that matters, but Infante is over 30 and has no chance of being a part of the future. Weird to get rid of Ynoa who is at least somewhat intriguing due to his stature and arm when a guy like Infante could get optioned again without even losing him. Are the Sox signing Bartolo?

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jul 6, 2017 -> 01:09 PM) But if guys have no trade value do you really need 2 scrubs of return to dump in A ball somewhere and release in 2 years? The Sox have two tradeable assets in Robertson and Q and that's it. The rest will bring scrubs who mean nothing to a rebuild. You guys perplex me. Getting somebody that has the chance of being something on your next competitive team is better than holding onto guys that are impending FAs and will 100% return NOTHING. Pretty simple stuff.

QUOTE (shipps @ Jul 6, 2017 -> 11:58 AM) I am confused on Soto because I dont really keep up with any minor league stats. Is he not the catcher who just a couple months ago people were saying is going to be a solid back up in the league for a long time? Is his numbers and reputation skyrocketed that high in a couple of months to basically be an untouchable in a trade for the best available closer to a team that is in desperation? That is Severino. And he's been awful in AAA this year.

QUOTE (raBBit @ Jul 6, 2017 -> 11:54 AM) This is an interesting point. However, I am not sure it's one way or the other. I don't mean to imply you were speaking in absolute but with relievers and how they can blow up any given day I'd imagine it's closer to 50-50 than 80-20 in either direction. Sure. Just moreso saying that all else being equal, when a middle reliever successfully (far from a given) takes over a closer role, his value is going to increase from what it was a as a middle reliever, even if his salary increases because of it. Basically, if Kahnle takes over closer duties once Robo is moved, and continues to perform well, I think his value will be higher in December than it is right now. Then again, he could tank, and his value could drop. Such is the case with relief pitchers. But generally speaking, inserting a player into the closing role and then flipping him is not a bad strategy. It is what I wanted to happen with Jones this year, but obviously that wasn't in the cards.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jul 6, 2017 -> 11:46 AM) Their leverage will increase when and if more closers hit the market. The Reds' guy has twice Robertson's value: younger, cheaper, more control, having a better year. I think that is very debatable.

At this point, I'd be fine not seeing Moncada until next summer. I don't think that what the Sox will do, but I'd be fine with it. Keeps 2B open for Yolmer and its not like were going to be competing next year. May as well save his service time for more meaningful seasons. He has been good in AAA, but its not like he is playing so well he's given the Sox no choice but to call him up.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ Jul 6, 2017 -> 11:30 AM) He's #12 in BP. That would be a heist. Robertson's not worth that (or even close to that). The Nats have no leverage, are a legitimate WS contender besides their bullpen, and literally need 4 or 5 arms. The asking price should be astronomical. You can always lower it later.

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ Jul 6, 2017 -> 11:26 AM) Same. I assume they could do better but I don't think it'll be the Nationals' top guys. Like I said above, if I were working for the Nats, I would target more control if I had to deal away top guys for help. Wasn't it Olney recently who said he thinks a deal between the 2 probably won't happen? Where else could Robertson potentially go? Yankees? Rangers if they start heating up over the next 3 weeks? Yah, he said they hadn't talked in awhile. But I take all that stuff with a grain of salt. Minimum, I want to see Kieboom + Luzardo. But I bet Ricky is still asking for Soto +, and he should be (for now).