Soha

I might be alone in this, but I sort of expect the Sox to be worse next year than they will be this year. There's still some solid talent that has to be moved. From Quintana and Shields, to the bullpen guys, Frazier, etc. Specifically though - when they don't have guys like Swarzak, Kahnle and Robertson to button down leads late....then it's really going to get ugly.

QUOTE (ptatc @ Jun 10, 2017 -> 11:54 AM) That would mean most of the players the Sox have acquired are playing poorly. I'll take this year. But if the Sox are that bad next year, they need to start the rebuild all over again because the players they acquired suck. The #2 (Kopech) and #3 (Robert) organization prospects stand a good chance of not seeing the show by the end of next year, and that has nothing to do with them being disappointing. You're probably going to need a bit more patience than you seem prepared for.

QUOTE (southsider2k5 @ Jun 7, 2017 -> 12:54 PM) Chris Cotillo‏Verified account @ChrisCotillo 1h1 hour ago Hiura's been linked to the Astros (15) and Red Sox (24). He answered questions about his health and future position. http://www.mlbdailydish.com/2017/6/7/15757...hiura-interview This is the guy I'm hoping for. Led the ncaa with a .567 obp. That's ridiculous.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jun 7, 2017 -> 10:09 AM) And the White Sox still probably would have picked Fulmer. You guys keep mentioning this anecdote, but the Sox would have had to have picked Benintendi. This is why scouting is that much more important than where you actually pick. Isn't it well known the Sox were enamored with Benintendi and were praying that he would fall to them? Now someone brought up Schwarber in relation to Rodon. That one I doubt they would have taken if they were in the Cubs slot at #4. I hadn't heard any links of the Sox and Schwarber and he certainly was expected to be picked lower in the first round.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jun 5, 2017 -> 03:11 PM) Huira has a plus hit tool, but aside from that there's not much else that stands out. His arm and fielding are both graded a bit below average. I would rather take a more well rounded player at #11 overall. Huira as a underslot signing? Perhaps, but I'd rather go for higher upside. I thought his defense was graded as unknown, due to not being able to play in the field the past year? Honestly, the best hitter in the draft is enough for me. It's not like we're picking 2nd or 3rd here. You're going to have some questions about who you pick with the #11 pick. If you draft him and get his health issues sorted, you then hope to make him the potential left fielder of the future. And if you can do it as an underslot signing, all the better.

QUOTE (steveno89 @ Jun 5, 2017 -> 10:40 AM) Hard to say what better position player options might be available to us at #11 overall? I'm actually intrigued about Evan White's potential to be converted into an outfielder? MLB.com's scouting report on him as a first baseman: Scouting grades: Hit: 55 | Power: 50 | Run: 60 | Arm: 55 | Field: 70 | Overall: 55 Those tools seem like they could be a fit for moving him to the outfield, where his lack of power profiles better? Could be an underslot signing? What about Keston Hiura? It's been said he might be the best hitter in this draft,. The thing is, you might have to do TJ surgery on him and lose him for a year+ after you draft him. If any team can wait that out, it's the Sox in their current stage of rebuilding.

Feels weird to me that this thread is still going so strong. Nobody is going to want Q and his nearly 6 ERA fore their playoff run at this point. Maybe if he has the best 6 week stretch of his career leading up to the trading deadline... that might entice a contender to bite. But otherwise, we're highly likely to keep Q in to the off-season. And at that point he's probably more movable, because teams start thinking more longterm, than just for the moment. And teams would probbaly feel it eas just an off year and he's still got a great contract situation.

A lot of mocks have the Sox taking this guy now. I think it's because Hahn reportedly met with Kendall recently. I'd rather they pass on him, though I want a bat for sure.

QUOTE (Lillian @ Jun 4, 2017 -> 05:41 PM) Perhaps that thumb is still bothering him. I hope that's the reason. He was 0 for 5 today and drew the "hat trick". His S.O. are getting to be a little alarming. This is exactly what we want him to learn to battle through while at Charlotte. He will come out of it a better player.

QUOTE (flavum @ Jun 4, 2017 -> 04:43 PM) Quintana needs 8 innings, 2 or fewer, Tuesday night. I don't think Quintana is moving this year. There's just too many things going against it at this point.

And the Sox are now tied with the A's for the worst record in the AL.

We're hearing f bombs from the plate after every strikeout. This is funny.

The Sox have left the bases loaded in both the first and second inning. Only one run, though. Verlander is at 66 pitches though, so they will get some cracks at their bullpen.

Nice start. 1-0 Sox and Verlander threw 38 pitches in the 1st.

QUOTE (miracleon35th @ Jun 4, 2017 -> 12:11 AM) The tanking thing never made sense to me for several reasons 1. No guarantee that you will end up with a top 3 Draft pick. 2. No guarantee that any player selected becomes an All Star quality player. 3. No guarantee that the 5th overall pick becomes a better player than a 12th overall pick. 4. It demoralizes the current team and destroys the winning attitude that is so important to cultivate. 5. It demoralizes the fan base. 6. It reduces attendance which in turn lessens the financial ability of the team to acquire players. 7. It goes against everything we are taught about competing in sports no matter who your opposition is. I like the progress with Avi G, Leury G, Davidson and Yolmar. Omar and Kevan Snith have been decent. Sox need to start bringing up some pitching. Maybe Giolito, Fulmer, Burdi, Reynaldo and maybe even Kopech. We have to stop the bludgeonings. 15-5, 10-1... 1) Nobody said there were guarantees. It's just about maximizing your chances and possibilities. 2) Same answer 3) Again, nobody said there were guarantees. History certainly has shown that the top picks tend to have a better chance at success than middle picks. 4) See I think it's the complete opposite. Do you not see more life in this team this year, than we've seen in many years? 5) I have not seen this fanbase as excited and energized in at least 10 years. I think the acquisition of a Luis Robert is enough to keep us all excited through a tough summer. 6) Attendance isn't down yet. It might be at some point and they probably are expecting it. The idea is that if you build this thing correctly, that will be more than made up for when this team is highly competitive in a few years. 7) Professional sports leagues all encourage tanking and it's unfortunate. In all major US sports, the worst place to be is stuck in mediocrity. You aren't good enough to compete for the playoffs or championships, yet you aren't bad enough to draft top talents to make yourself better. It's an ugly place to be, and a place the White Sox have spent most of the last 10 years in (for that matter, the Bears have spent many years there as well). If you look across the 4 sports, you see some common themes. Guys like Lebron James, Connor McDavid, Kris Bryant...they were funneled to teams who were atrocious. Do I wish sports would change the system to discourage tanking? Absolutely. Give all non playoff teams equal lottery chances at top picks. But until they do that, you're going to have people rightly wanting to get bad, to get good. Finally - the part of your post I disagree with the most is wanting to bring up guys like Giolito, Kopech, Burdi to stop the bludgeonings...so, we are going to ruin these guys' development because our big league team sucks? Seriously?

QUOTE (greg775 @ Jun 3, 2017 -> 11:54 PM) Thanks for the insults. I personally would rather get the 30th pick than EVER root for the Sox to lose. So there. I understand your concept. I think it's ridiculous. This team will lose 90 plus games. I'd rather go .500 than lose 90 plus games. Why? I put little stock in the baseball draft. I feel you can get a helluva good pick if your team had a lousy record. I don't have to root for that record. And guess what? I don't trust my front office to take a great player at No. 5 overall vs. No. 13. No I don't. With their track record it'd be some college pitcher who won't make the adjustment. Now kudos for drafting Tim Anderson and some of the others. But I don't need the No. 3 pick; give me a winning record and No. 14 pick. Obviously every one of us would rather pick 30th than tank. The whole point is to win a World Series. The pro tank people are tired of running in quicksand and want to see some actual progress towards a championship. It's not a hard concept to get.

QUOTE (witesoxfan @ Jun 3, 2017 -> 08:07 PM) See, but they are going to end up with a bad record. I think this is pretty much a foregone conclusion. To me, it's just easier to shrug off the losses at this point. Actively rooting for losses is backwards logic. "Runners on first and second for Abreu, let's hope he grounds into a double play." Like, what? That's the way I see people watching the game when they are hoping for the Sox to lose. If they end up with the 3rd pick or the 5th pick instead of the 1st, it doesn't really matter. From 2011 to 2015, the Cubs picked in the top 5 twice, still picked in the top 10 every year, and ended up with Baez, Almora, Bryant, Schwarber, and Happ. I don't think they ever went full tank trying to win 60 games, they just didn't have very good teams so they ended up at the bottom. That's pretty much the point I'm trying to portray - the Sox are going to lose a lot of games, so you may as well hope for wins and be grateful when they do, because it's not going to happen a lot. I mean, if that's what people are hoping for, then by all means, do it. I can't stop you. I just think it's a bit wrong. You don't think the Cubs ever went full tank? Come on, who are we kidding here? They were in bigger tank mode than the Sox have been so far in this rebuild. They made zero effort to actually be competitive in the first few years of the Theo regime. Their 101 tanked losses in 2012 were rewarded with a guy named Kris Bryant. And I think your point of the Cubs 5 top 10 picks illustrates exactly how important tanking can be. Because Kris Bryant is the only one of those 5 guys that has established himself as more than a role player. And he was taken with the 2nd pick in the draft. The other guys were taken 4th, 6th, 9th and 9th...and none have shown to be worth those picks at this point (granted Happ hasn't had a chance to prove it one way or another yet). Maybe they will eventually. Maybe they won't. Or maybe they are worth their picks and it just illustrates how much worse picking 4th, 6th or 9th is compared to 2nd. Finally - if the Sox had 3 more losses in 2014, they would have drafted Andrew Benintendi instead of Carson Fulmer. That sure would have been nice, eh?

QUOTE (soxfan2014 @ May 31, 2017 -> 09:51 AM) Best reported one I think we saw was headlined by Martes and Tucker but the Sox wanted Musgrove. We don't know how many were actually real though. My recollections were that the Astros didn't want to move either of those guys.

QUOTE (Chicago White Sox @ May 31, 2017 -> 09:03 AM) I'm arguing that many posters here didn't fully acknowledge the risk of holding onto Quintana. The idea of keeping him for "when we are good again" was lunacy from the get-go IMO. Coming into the season, if you believed we couldn't realistically compete over the course of the next three seasons, then Jose Quintana was effectively worth whatever you projected his 2020 WAR to be us. Let's say that's 4 WAR. For another team he could have effectively been worth 15 to 18 WAR over that same period. The opportunity cost of keeping him and not receiving value from another team for his 2017 to 2019 production would have always been tremendous. Whether Hahn received an acceptable offer during the offseason, we'll never know or be able to prove. The problem I have is fair value is typically defined as what the market bares (assuming no market constraints). And given how this was one of the worst markets for starting pitching in recent history, it's hard for me to believe that not a single team was willing to pony up and pay fair value. Therefore, I'm willing to speculate that Hahn may have over-valued Quintana or under-estimated the risk of holding. I said in the game thread last night, but if teams were skeptical of Quintana being a legit TOR starter before, this bad stretch where his elite command has gone to s*** isn't going to help matters. But what deal do you think they should have taken for ? The best reported deal I heard was headlined by Tyler Glasnow, who's ERA is around 7. If it's Glasnow or keep Q and suffer through his bad year, then I'll take keeping Q. Even if Q sucks the entire year, I'll still have confidence that he figures it out over the winter and is back next year. It's better than taking hot garbage for him.

Kahnle is awesome

QUOTE (bmags @ May 24, 2017 -> 01:13 PM) Honest opinion is sox are going to get way less than we expected on Q. I agree with that line of thinking. But for me, it leads me to thinking he stays longterm. And I'm ok with that.

I can't see them moving Devers with the hole they have at 3B. I don't think he's that far away from the show.

QUOTE (GreenSox @ May 23, 2017 -> 06:52 AM) That Robertson return was reasonable at the time. Don't be so sure that we're flush with pitching prospects. It's hard to turn those prospects into major league starting pitchers. Most flame out. This year their are bright signs from the youth on the major league roster, but that's from position players and relievers. And you'll need plenty of depth, else you have another year of Noesi. Take the best talent we can get. I agree with this for the most part. With the addition of Robert, and hopefully taking the best available hitter in the draft in a few weeks, I'd say they can turn their attention towards the best available package, regardless of position. The only exception to me is if they do move Quintana - a bat needs to be the headliner coming back.

QUOTE (BlackSox13 @ May 22, 2017 -> 01:12 PM) Would love to have Robles but not at the expense of adding Burdi to the deal. Burdi presents two options going forward, 1) he could be the future Sox closer 2) he could net a Giles type haul in another year or two that would easily net more value than Robles currently presents, which admittedly is alot. Trading Burdi now, IMHO, would not exactly be the best way to maximise his trade value. That said, if the Nat's were willing to offer Robles along with one of Kieboom/Soto and a lesser third piece for Robertson/Burdi, I'm all ears. If the Nats would do this trade, you say yes 100 times out of 100. But I don't think they would even consider it. They need immediate help in their bullpen, not a minor league pitcher - even if he's close. Because he might have a few years of bumps and bruises to start his MLB career.

The bigger question, or certainly more immediate question - might be what if he continues to hit this way for another 1-2 months. We never considered this when the rebuild started, but do you consider offers from playoff contenders? If a guy is hitting .340ish with a high OPS in to July - man that might fetch a ton from a contender in need of a bat. Say if Washington offers you Vickor Robles+ for Robertson and Avi...does Hahn say yes or no? I'm thinking Hahn would decline that at this point.